View Poll Results: What should we do?

Voters
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  • Nothing, Cat is out of the bag and this is the cost of our "freedom"

    16 10.26%
  • Prison Time for gun owners who lose or have their gun stolen

    30 19.23%
  • Background checks and a waiting period for 100% of transactions

    119 76.28%
  • No semiautomatic anythings...

    60 38.46%
  • Tax gun sales with additional fee to go to mental health

    70 44.87%
  • Register ALL firearms and require insurance (car analogy)

    101 64.74%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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  1. #6801
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    The lawsuit was a warning, and Dyke and his fellow gunmakers needed help. They wanted Congress to give them protection from liability for shootings. Fortunately, Dyke had contacts in high places, including an up-and-coming Republican senator and the president of the United States.

    Dyke was friendly with the Bush family, which summered in Kennebunkport, Maine. He raised money for Maine Medical Center, which ran the Barbara Bush Children’s Hospital. In 1999, a year after the hospital’s naming, George W. Bush, Barbara’s son, announced he was running for president. Dyke became his Maine campaign chair. But his presence was perceived as toxic after an Associated Press reporter asked the campaign about its association with an assault weapons manufacturer. Dyke resigned, saying he didn’t want to be “any baggage” for “young Bush.”

    Dyke also had a longtime friend in the U.S. Senate, Maine Republican Susan Collins. She once called him “the most entrepreneurial person I’ve ever met. … This man has had one common theme throughout his life: commitment to the people who work for him, and his passion for creating jobs in Maine.”

    Dyke had met Collins in the 1980s when she served on Cohen’s staff. In 1994, she ran for governor, with Dyke’s support. Collins won the Republican nomination but lost the general election. She wouldn’t be unemployed long. She secured a job at Husson College as executive director of the Richard Dyke Center for Family Business, which he had helped start by donating $250,000. Collins was “very qualified” for the job, and Husson’s president, not Dyke, approached her about it, said the senator’s spokesperson, Clark.

    When Cohen didn’t seek reelection, Collins decided to run. While not a key adviser, Dyke instructed her over dinner at a Bangor restaurant “as to what it would be like working with other senators and how to leverage her strengths,” Clark said. “He also talked about the challenges facing small businesses across the country.”

    With Dyke and other Bushmaster executives among her donors, Collins won. In July 2005, she voted for the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act, which Dyke had pushed hard for. It prohibited lawsuits against firearms manufacturers, distributors and dealers for misuse of their products by others. That October, Bush signed it.

    Collins “has always charted her own centrist position on gun issues,” her spokesperson said, pointing out that the senator supported a failed 2004 proposal to extend the assault weapons ban. Collins backed PLCAA because “she doesn’t think manufacturers of knives, guns, vehicles, etc. should be held liable for the crimes committed by people who misuse their products,” Clark said. After the Lewiston massacre, Collins has resisted calls for a new ban on assault weapons.

    Bushmaster caught the attention of Cerberus Capital Management, a New York investment firm named after the three-headed dog that guarded Hades in Greek mythology. In 2006, Cerberus offered $76 million, twice Bushmaster’s own estimate of its value.

    “Holy shit,” Tom Tyler, then a Bushmaster executive, recalled Dyke telling him. “I never believed a good old boy from Wilton, Maine, would see that kind of money in his checkbook.”

    The private-equity business model was a super-sized version of Dyke’s “bottom fishing.” Cerberus’ holding company, Freedom Group, gobbled up one gun manufacturer after another, notably Remington Arms. It also touted the bellicose aspects of its guns, using Bushmaster to cater to a new group of prospective buyers: not hunters and gun collectors, but “couch commandos” with fantasies of war and killing.

    Freedom Group produced a series of print ads for its Remington-branded AR-style rifles, which were made at Bushmaster’s facility in Maine, with slogans like “Forces of Opposition, Bow Down. You are Single-Handedly Outnumbered,” and “Take Back the City.” It plugged Bushmaster guns with a novel “Man Card Campaign.” The gimmick was that owners had to be macho or their cards could be revoked. Cerberus declined to comment.

    Dyke stayed on as a board member and consultant for the holding company for about a year. But he told New York Magazine he thought Cerberus was moving too fast, and he quit. But he wouldn’t be out of the AR-15 business for long.

    In 2011, Freedom Group closed the Bushmaster facility in Windham, Maine, putting 73 people out of work. Dyke, who still owned the plant, was furious but saw a way to benefit, Kent said.

    He summoned Kent to his home in Henderson, Nevada. Over cocktails, Dyke showed his old friend a business plan.

    “It makes sense to me,” Dyke told him. “We have the facilities. We have the workforce, and all the noncompetes are done.”

    Dyke messaged his former Bushmaster employees. “Would you be crazy enough to go back into business with the old man?” he asked.

    That August, the 77-year-old Dyke hosted a party to celebrate the launch of the family’s new company, Windham Weaponry. Among the attendees were several state legislators and Collins.

    “We’ve got to get back in the game,” Dyke told them. “A lot can happen to it, but it cannot leave Maine because the Dyke family won’t let that happen.”

    In its first month, Windham shipped 1,500 rifles. Soon the company had rehired most of its former employees and was producing nearly as many rifles as Bushmaster had at its peak.

    In December 2012, Adam Lanza, a devoted player of a video game that featured an assault-style Bushmaster rifle, killed his mother and then went on a rampage with her Bushmaster XM-15 at a Connecticut elementary school. Like other mass shootings, Sandy Hook was good for sales.

    “Windham Weaponry is busier than a beehive this Spring! While we’re building rifles as fast as we can, be assured that we won’t sacrifice quality for speed!” Dyke’s company said in its newsletter.

    Referring to “challenges resulting from recent events,” Windham encouraged its customers to contact their legislators and to attend the NRA annual meeting to oppose a new proposal to ban assault-style rifles after Sandy Hook. “Take action today, and make your voice heard!”

    It didn’t mention that its own factory, under the previous owner, had made Lanza’s gun.

    On Jan. 16, Windham Weaponry employees flew into Las Vegas for the 2023 SHOT Show, the industry’s firearms palooza. Driving past the Trump International Hotel to the expo center, they posted photographs on the company Facebook page, saying, “We made it!”

    They set up their booth, putting the rifles on racks with a sign proclaiming that they were “battle tested and warrior approved.”

    Dyke wintered in Las Vegas. But he was too ill to visit the company’s booth. If he could have walked the floor, he would have heard the telltale sounds of his legacy: the unmistakable ratcheting of charging handles being pulled back and the metallic “thunk” of their release.

    When Dyke first brought his rifles to the show, they were banished to backroom booths. Now hundreds of companies are emulating Dyke by selling either AR-style rifles or accessories and other tactical gear. Cerberus’ holding company lost investors and faced lawsuits after the Sandy Hook shooting. The unit eventually went bankrupt twice, and its gun businesses were auctioned off. A Nevada company now sells AR-style rifles under the Bushmaster name, along with a device that enables them to fire at double speed, not only with the pull but also the release of the trigger, according to its website. “Bushmaster is back,” the company crowed when it opened in 2021.

    In late February, Dyke was stung by a scorpion and had to be hospitalized. On Feb. 28, he chatted with Pestilli, Bushmaster’s former head of sales, by phone, thanking him for his help over the years. The next day, Dyke watched a Los Angeles Lakers game on television. He was about to go to bed when he had a heart attack and died, at the age of 89.

    After his death, Windham Weaponry shut down. Then some of Dyke’s former executives stepped in. They leased the facility and plan to resume assembling and selling AR-15s, even as Mainers mourn the Lewiston victims.

    At Dyke’s memorial service, Thurston credited him with rescuing more than a firearms company.

    “Bushmaster after 9-11 did a lot of things for this country,” he said, his voice rising. “Richard made sure that every employee at the end of the month understood that if it looked like a gun, it was going in a box and then going in a truck” to customers.

    He pointed at the mourners nodding in agreement. “Because you might need it.”


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    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

    "Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"

  2. #6802
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  3. #6803
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    So, more good guys with guns? Better mental illness remediation? Price of freedumb? Help me out here - what do we need?

    Double mass shootings over weekend set grim U.S. record
    In less than 90 minutes on Sunday afternoon, two 911 calls led police in Texas and Washington to two mass shootings that pushed the nation to a gruesome milestone.
    They were the 37th and 38th shootings this year in which four or more victims were killed, the highest number of mass killings in any year since at least 2006. Last year’s 36 was the previous record.

  4. #6804
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    Definitely going to need more good guys with guns...

    https://www.fox7austin.com/news/shoo...jured-homicide

  5. #6805
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  6. #6806
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    From todays WAPO

    The earsplitting, heart-stopping roar of fully automatic weapons hasn’t been often heard on America’s streets since Congress largely outlawed them in 1934. But now it’s back, owing to a small device that is easily plugged into certain handguns and rifles, converting semiautomatic firearms into guns capable of firing 20 bullets in one second — with one pull of the trigger.

    In Sacramento last year, a handgun converted into a machine gun was used during a gun battle that left six dead, in what has been called Sacramento’s deadliest mass shooting. In Minneapolis, eight people were wounded in August amid a spray of 40 bullets fired in just seconds. In 2021, a Houston police officer was killed and another wounded by a suspect with a pistol equipped with the device.

    And in D.C.’s NoMa neighborhood in August last year, a drug dealer who was shot at returned fire with 24 shots in one burst along North Capitol Street, authorities said. His target, a car that had been used in a drive-by shooting, sped away, while two people were wounded, according to court records.

    “It’s incredibly scary,” said Matthew M. Graves, the District’s U.S. attorney, citing the rising number of conversion devices found in the city in recent years. There were 27 guns recovered with the devices in 2021. The number rose to 119 last year, and, as of late October, the number was more than 150, Graves said. Police often find extended magazines attached to the guns, to hold more than the standard 12 or 13 bullets contained in most magazines, and they have even seized round drum magazines, which can hold 50 or more bullets.

    “We have no shortage, unfortunately, of crime scenes where we have strong reason to believe, based on the number of rounds expended, that one of these devices was used,” Graves said. Local and federal authorities could not provide any examples of a converted automatic weapon causing any woundings or deaths in the District so far.

    The devices have many names: Switch. Giggle switch. Sear. Auto sear. Conversion device. Glock switch (some of which have Glock’s logo fraudulently printed on them). Even though they are small — switches for pistols are about the size of a playing die — and don’t themselves contain bullets, the devices are considered machine guns by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, said Craig B. Kailimai, special agent in charge of ATF’s Washington field division.
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    “That would be illegal,” he said. “The device itself.”

    The devices can be made of metal or plastic, and authorities believe some are imported from China and sold on the streets. But 3D printers also have been used to make both the square-shaped switch for pistols and an S-shaped device that slides into guns such as the AR-15 to convert them to fully automatic, Kailimai said. The printing process takes about 45 minutes.

    Under some circumstances, civilians can legally purchase automatic weapons. The conversion switches for both semiautomatic handguns and rifles also can be purchased legally under certain conditions. Both the American military and law enforcement have uses for automatic weapons, so law enforcement officials cannot approach gun manufacturers and ask them to stop making guns that can be easily converted, Kailimai said. Glock officials have said they cannot change the design of their pistol to foil the switches.
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    The ATF said it recovered more than 5,400 illegal switches between 2017 and 2021, a 570 percent increase from the preceding five years. In both pistols and rifles, the switch works by blocking the mechanism in the gun that requires a trigger pull before each shot. With a switch in place, one trigger pull can fire the weapon until it is out of ammunition.

    “I think they’ve been understudied. We don’t have a lot of great data,” said Daniel Webster, a professor at the Johns Hopkins University Center for Gun Violence Solutions. “But it’s relatively intuitive, something that creates the equivalent of an automatic weapon is going to get a lot more bullets flying in an incredibly short amount of time,” striking more targets and reducing the amount of time people have to escape drive-by or mass shootings, Webster said. He said that makes the device more attractive to mass shooters and criminal street crews.

    Webster said legislators should enact higher penalties for possession of the switches, prosecutors should seek those penalties, and judges should impose them

    “It’s the functional equivalent of an automatic weapon,” he said. “Who among the law-abiding gun ownership crowd wants to argue that these are fundamental to their Second Amendment rights?” Webster said that “law enforcement should make it clear that federal law on firearms should apply to every weapon that has a switch.” He said prosecutors who have reduced prosecutions for gun possession in urban areas should make exceptions for guns with switches attached.

    Graves agreed. “They’re basically being treated the same in our criminal justice system as the firearms that don’t have these devices there,” he said. He noted that D.C. Council member Brooke Pinto (D-Ward 2) proposed legislation “adding a separate penalty for possessing a machine gun and using a machine gun in a crime, which we think is incredibly important. We need to increase the penalties.”
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    Pinto said in an email that she has worked with Graves to address violent crime in the District and is pushing a bill that would “increase the maximum penalties for individuals firing a large number of bullets at a time, and requiring that sentences for possession of extremely dangerous weapons, like machine guns, be stacked on top of baseline penalties, rather than running concurrently.” She said the D.C. Council’s judiciary and public safety committee held a hearing this month on a bill with these provisions “aimed at the small number of offenders engaged in most of the violent crime.”

    D.C. police and federal agents have seized guns with switches while executing search warrants for drugs, in traffic stops after chases, and after arrests for robberies and carjackings. This month, the U.S. Capitol Police tried to pull over a stolen car that took off and crashed into a barricade. Officers then found a gun with a 22-round extended magazine in the car and another gun with a switch near where a passenger was arrested.

    No woundings or homicides have been linked to the switch in the D.C. area. But in Houston, Officer William Jeffrey was shot and killed by a man firing an automatic handgun in October 2021, and three officers were wounded by another switch-equipped gun in January 2022.

    “There is absolutely no reason or no room for our suspects to be armed like this,” Houston Police Chief Troy Finner said at a news conference. He showed body-camera footage of the fatal shooting of Jeffrey. “This is a threat that is here, and it’s a threat to everybody — law enforcement and citizens in every neighborhood in our community.”

    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

    "Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"

  7. #6807
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  8. #6808
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless View Post
    You are also the one who wanted to post dead kids. Don't feel the same about dead shooters apparently. Odd.

    Im suprised all of you are so worked up about dead, white, Christians. Not really your crowd.
    43 posts on 3-28-23

    Is BS in jail for drugs and guns violations, or did he just flip out and leave? Banned?

  9. #6809
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    Mass shooter at UNLV right now. Initial reports 28 shot:
    https://x.com/intelfrombrian/status/...4lGhgLYsrm4qDQ

  10. #6810
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    Last night someone killed six people in TX, but in light of today's events it's not even news.

  11. #6811
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
    Last night someone killed six people in TX, but in light of today's events it's not even news.
    And today we find out once again people who get murdered in Las Vegas stay in Las Vegas
    what's so funny about peace, love, and understanding?

  12. #6812
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    Keeping it classy, eh dipshit?

  13. #6813
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    Better stop those trans folks from competing with and reading books to other kids..
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  14. #6814
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    Quote Originally Posted by seano732 View Post
    Mass shooter at UNLV right now. Initial reports 28 shot:
    https://x.com/intelfrombrian/status/...4lGhgLYsrm4qDQ
    Doesn't someone here work as staff for UNLV or is it a different school in LV? Only staff members were shot.

  15. #6815
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    Quote Originally Posted by muted reborn View Post
    Doesn't someone here work as staff for UNLV or is it a different school in LV? Only staff members were shot.
    MarcusBrody is a professor in the LV area. Not sure if it's UNLV.

  16. #6816
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2skier112 View Post
    43 posts on 3-28-23

    Is BS in jail for drugs and guns violations, or did he just flip out and leave? Banned?
    Most of us are really only a few really bad breaks from flipping out (spouse cheating, kid killed, fired out of the blue, etc). Some of us will do tragic and permanent things at that point..

    Or he ran away on a romantic escapade with Benny.. on a buffalo
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  17. #6817
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    Speaking of maggots in the throes of addiction who shouldn't have guns, anyone heard from MTT lately?
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  18. #6818
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    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    Speaking of maggots in the throes of addiction who shouldn't have guns, anyone heard from MTT lately?
    This type of post is unnecessary. It only comes across as you being an asshole.

  19. #6819
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    Quote Originally Posted by NW_SKIER View Post
    This type of post is unnecessary. It only comes across as you being an asshole.
    See, I took it the opposite. As kooky as he is, he is one of us and I do care if he's doing alright. SJG isn't wrong in his statement. MTT has demonstrated an alcohol addiction and posted suicidal ideations along with evidence he has guns. I hope he's alright.

  20. #6820
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    Looks like even The Onion has given up on reporting new mass shootings. That's probably not a good sign...

    https://www.theonion.com/search?blog...=1702076349503

  21. #6821
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    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    Speaking of maggots in the throes of addiction who shouldn't have guns, anyone heard from MTT lately?
    Quote Originally Posted by NW_SKIER View Post
    This type of post is unnecessary. It only comes across as you being an asshole.
    Oh how do you disagree with any of those sentiments? Do you think he should have guns? Do you think he's stable? Do you not worry about him, especially when he goes radio silent? Please elaborate.

    The whole fucking point of this thread is that there are many reasons exactly like this why gun ownership needs a much higher bar. And that citizens should be able to remove firearms from the homes of people exactly line MTT and BS based on their publicly posted firearm antics.
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  22. #6822
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    @ 7:12


  23. #6823
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    Quote Originally Posted by seano732 View Post
    Mass shooter at UNLV right now. Initial reports 28 shot:
    https://x.com/intelfrombrian/status/...4lGhgLYsrm4qDQ
    Quote Originally Posted by muted reborn View Post
    Doesn't someone here work as staff for UNLV or is it a different school in LV? Only staff members were shot.
    Quote Originally Posted by riser4 View Post
    MarcusBrody is a professor in the LV area. Not sure if it's UNLV.
    https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/08/us/un...day/index.html

  24. #6824
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    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    Oh how do you disagree with any of those sentiments? Do you think he should have guns? Do you think he's stable? Do you not worry about him, especially when he goes radio silent? Please elaborate.

    The whole fucking point of this thread is that there are many reasons exactly like this why gun ownership needs a much higher bar. And that citizens should be able to remove firearms from the homes of people exactly line MTT and BS based on their publicly posted firearm antics.
    He posted a couple days ago, before you made that post you could have checked that if you were really worried. Maybe shoot him a PM if you’re concerned. No amount of backpedaling and justification will change that.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  25. #6825
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    He posted a couple days ago, before you made that post you could have checked that if you were really worried. Maybe shoot him a PM if you’re concerned. No amount of backpedaling and justification will change that.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    There will be no backpeddling on my position that nobody adducted to alcohol or anything else mood altering should be allowed to own a firearm, much less carry it in public. If, or when they snap, I won't have to back peddle on wishing we could have or SHOULD have done something. When anyone posts in the threads designated for help with those depression and addiction ailments we're plenty responsive and supportive.

    Pretending this shit ain't a problem and LACK OF gun laws are making it way more fatal than it needs to be is more of a problem than some tough love here and there
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

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