View Poll Results: What should we do?
- Voters
- 156. You may not vote on this poll
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Nothing, Cat is out of the bag and this is the cost of our "freedom"
16 10.26% -
Prison Time for gun owners who lose or have their gun stolen
30 19.23% -
Background checks and a waiting period for 100% of transactions
119 76.28% -
No semiautomatic anythings...
60 38.46% -
Tax gun sales with additional fee to go to mental health
70 44.87% -
Register ALL firearms and require insurance (car analogy)
101 64.74%
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06-17-2022, 03:10 PM #2751
https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/17/polit...ans/index.html
Proof that the GQP and its voters are a cancer for America. Can’t even support pathetically weak gun law.
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06-17-2022, 03:16 PM #2752"I don't pretend to have all the answers, and I think there's something to be said for that" -One For The Road
Brain dead and made of money.
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06-17-2022, 03:44 PM #2753?
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Verdi NV
- Posts
- 10,457
I would not be opposed to first time gun buyers. Having to pass a very through gun safety course prior to taking possession of a gun of any type
It would have to be government funded so it doesn’t price the poor out of gun ownership. After passing the class and a background check. National right to carry should be the law of the land.
The government federal or local does not need to know what guns who owns
There is a good reason for that
There could be some stiff penalties for allowing kid’s or unauthorized people to possess your gun. Lock them up when you’re not in control of them. The days of the shotgun or rifle in the closet or pistol in the night stand. Are overOwn your fail. ~Jer~
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06-17-2022, 03:49 PM #2754
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06-17-2022, 04:00 PM #2755
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06-17-2022, 04:05 PM #2756?
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Verdi NV
- Posts
- 10,457
I have not taken a Hunter safety course since I was 13. And I believe it was sponsored by the NRA. You had to take the class to get a hunting license. I think that’s still the case? I’m thinking a class equivalent to the current concealed carry classes required in some states with a direct line to the ATF. Where class instructors could flag people they suspect are crazy/ dangerous and no fuckin way should be armed
Own your fail. ~Jer~
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06-17-2022, 04:10 PM #2757
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06-17-2022, 04:11 PM #2758?
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Verdi NV
- Posts
- 10,457
I’m not going to get bogged down in that. But I’m more than sure every one of these Waco people who went into public places. Schools churches 20th floor of a casino? Planed to go there armed with the intention of just killing random people? They were all on antidepressants. Those are facts. Draw your own conclusions
Own your fail. ~Jer~
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06-17-2022, 04:14 PM #2759
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06-17-2022, 04:27 PM #2760
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06-17-2022, 04:32 PM #2761
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06-17-2022, 06:21 PM #2762
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06-17-2022, 06:40 PM #2763
I wonder how they feel about people on probation for DWI, or multiple DWi or public intoxication, i.e. a history of alcohol abuse? In some states being a "habitual drunkard" exempts a person from jury duty.. It should also exempt people from the right to carry a gun in public.
Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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06-17-2022, 06:44 PM #2764
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06-17-2022, 06:49 PM #2765
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06-18-2022, 01:13 AM #2766
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06-18-2022, 04:04 AM #2767
“All” is clearly an exaggeration
But many is correct. These are powerful mind altering drugs.
And yes, you could argue they were fucked before the meds. But people have had psych issues since the stone age. And guns have been around for centuries.
Modern culture? Copycats? Maybe. But these “medications” are whack.
1989: Joseph Wesbecker walked into his former employer Standard Gravure Corp and shot 20 workers, killing nine. He had been taking Prozac for a month. This shooting led to a landmark case, where the survivors sued the makers of Prozac, Eli Lilly. Wesbecker used a semiautomatic Chinese AK-47-style firearm, a 9mm pistol, and a .38 Special snubnose revolver – all of which he purchased legally, passing his background check.
1995: Jarred Viktor was 15 when he was prescribed Paxil. Ten days after starting it, Viktor stabbed his grandmother 61 times.
1996: At 18, Kurt Danysh murdered his father just 17 days after being prescribed Prozac by his family doctor, who failed to do even one psychological test. During his police confession, Danysh told police the medication made him feel odd: ‘I just act differently. I don’t have the energy or personality I used to. I spend half the time in a trance.’
1997: Luke Woodham stabbed his mother, then traveled to Pearl High School, where he was enrolled, using a .30-30 to shoot two students and wound six others; he was stopped by his assistant principal (aka a good guy with a gun) who used his own .45 ACP handgun to force Woodham’s surrender.
1998: 15-year-old Kip Kinkel shot both of his parents, then carried a 9mm handgun, .22 rifle, and a .22 pistol to his Thurston High School, where he murdered two classmates and injured 22 more, all while taking Prozac.
1999: Eric Harris, 17, with Dylan Klebold, killed 12 students, one teacher, himself, and wounded 23 others during the Columbine school shooting; he had been prescribed Zoloft and then Luvox before he used a 12 gauge shotgun received through a straw purchaser and a 9mm TEC-DC9.
2001: Christopher Pittman, a 12-year-old, was prescribed Zoloft, which caused him to become agitated, jittery, and experience tactile hallucinations; Pittman told psychiatrist Dr. Lanette Atkins that he heard voices telling him: ‘Kill, kill, do it, do it.’ He took a .410 shotgun and shot his grandparents, then burned their house down.
2001: Andrea Yates drowned all five of her children. She was taking Effexor and was suffering from delusions about satanic possession. The murder of her children led Effexor to list homicidal thoughts in the medication’s side effects. Although it’s a rare side effect, manifesting in one in 1,000 patients, over 19 million prescriptions were written and filled in 2005. That’s an estimated 19,000 people suffering from homicidal thoughts because of the medication.
2005: 16-year-old Jeff Weise was taking 60 mg daily of Prozac, the highest dosage for adults, when he shot his grandfather, his grandfather’s girlfriend, murdered 10 students at Red Lake, Minnesota, and wounded 12 more, before shooting himself. He was armed with a .40 caliber pistol, .22 pistol, and a 12 gauge shotgun.
2008: Steven Kazmierczak was prescribed Prozac, Xanax, and Ambien, a sleeping medication, three weeks before walking into Northern Illinois University, killing six people and wounding 21, with three pistols (one chambered in 9mm and two in .380 ACP) and a shotgun. Kazmierczak had stopped taking the antidepressant ‘because it made him feel like a zombie.’
2009: Two weeks after starting Lexapro, Robert Stewart walked into his estranged wife’s work at Pinelake Health and Rehab, and opened fire. He killed eight elderly patients and wounded three others. He doesn’t remember the incident.
2012: James Holmes, also known as the Batman Movie killer, was taking sertraline when he walked into the showing of The Dark Knight with two .40 caliber pistols, an AR-style .223 rifle, and a 12 gauge shotgun, killing 12 people and injuring 70 others. In his personal notebook, which he sent to his psychiatrist the same day as the shooting, shows that as the medication decreased his anxiety, he lost his fear of consequences. As the dosage became higher, his thoughts became more obsessive and psychotic.
2013: At the time of the Washington Navy Yard shooting, Aaron Alexis was a civilian contractor working at the yard and was prescribed trazodone, a serotonin antagonist and reuptake inhibitor (SARI) that works much like an SSRI to increase serotonin levels in the brain. He killed 12 people and injured eight others.
2014: Ivan Lopez was a 34-year-old US soldier who shot 15 of his comrades, killing three of them, at his base in Fort Hood, Texas. He was undergoing mental health treatment through the Veterans’ Administration, which is known for over-prescribing medication. The VA confirmed that Lopez was taking antidepressants (the VA only uses SSRI antidepressants) during the time of the shooting and his subsequent suicide.
2015: From the moment it occurred, the Charleston Church shooting has been deemed an act of white supremacy, a race crime against blacks. But two years after Dylann Roof shot and killed nine people and injured another, the court released documents that show it was more mental health than hatred that led to the murders. The documents confirmed he was taking antidepressants.
2016: Arcan Cetin, who was just 20 years old, walked into the Cascade Mall where he shot and killed four women, one just a teen, and shot one man, who later died at the hospital. Records show that Cetin was under the care of a psychiatrist and taking medication for depression and ADHD, including Prozac.
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06-18-2022, 05:50 AM #2768
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06-18-2022, 08:27 AM #2769
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06-18-2022, 08:57 AM #2770
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06-18-2022, 09:19 AM #2771
Mental health in society like anything else exists along a spectrum. There are people who obviously are mentally well enough to operate a firearm safely. At the other end of the spectrum is the batshit insane. Where do we draw the line in the sand? It needs to be done of course - but to imply it’s simple (it’s not rocket surgery) is wrong.
The idea that someone who is on - or has been on - anti depressants needs to go through wellness checks before getting a gun sounds simple.
What about anxiety (instead of depression) - the same exact medications gets used in anxiety.
What about alcoholics?
People with opiod addictions?
Should people who are on Prozac be allowed to drive? Fly personal airplanes?
To be clear I’m not advocating “this is too hard - just let everyone have guns”.
And who is going to be the arbitrator of who gets guns - doctors? If I were a doctor in that situation I’d probably only give license to 5% of people applying - since there’s no way I’m risking my career and family’s financial future trying to predict the future behavior of anyone.
My point is that it’s super complicated.
And if a mass murderer was on psych medications when they commit an atrocity I hope society has the grey matter to go beyond a binary view of “it had to have been the medications that caused it!”
Cmon people - other than the sponge brains MTbrain and More Shit we should be able to take it a step further and think maybe this person was on medications because they were mentally unwell and the system doesn’t have many other easily available options other than medications - and maybe the medications help and without them we’d have more killings?
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06-18-2022, 09:56 AM #2772
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06-18-2022, 10:15 AM #2773
Uhhh. Hate to throw a wrench in the people on antidepressants gun control topic, but wouldn’t the issue mostly be the people NOT on medication?
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06-18-2022, 10:22 AM #2774
How many LEOs are on antidepressants? A high number of cops are vets with some level of PTSD they deal with on a daily basis. It's the people addicted to mood altering shit we really need to be more concerned with.. and as you say, folks who are off meds that were working for them..
Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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06-18-2022, 10:25 AM #2775
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