Ukraine

[highangle]

Probably a lot, or some, of the weapons sent to Ukraine have already been sold on the black market. After all, Ukraine was considered last year as one of the most corrupt countries in Europe, and i don't believe this had changed.

Ukraine still doesn't have a corruption czar, even though this was requested, i believe by EU.

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

Have you been programmed to notice that Russia is a kleptocracy/oligarchy/shakedown state where every car needs a camera to protect the driver from the cops?

[skaredshtles]

You folks need to QUIT quoting Cono. He's a fuck-nut.

Please?

[rod9301]

Calling Ukraine corrupt is your oldest most shopworn talking point. Like a lot of countries Ukraine does have a corruption problem. It's a problem that stems from its proximity to Russia and pales in comparison with Russia's own endemic corruption.

An overwhelming majority of Ukrainians want to break free from Russia's corrupt shackles. One of the many myths of engaging, trading and negotiating with Russia is that closer contacts and having them be part of organizations like Amnesty International or Economic groups like the G8 would liberalize the country and spread the rule of law. Instead, the opposite happens. Russia weakens, weaponizes, and corrupts the system.

That's why one of the few positive byproducts of Russia's war against Ukraine is the majority of Ukrainians now have a chance to overhaul their system making it possible for them to join the European Union.

Sure Russia is corrupt, everyone know this.

I was talking about Ukraine though and what may happen to the money and weapons sent to them.

Interesting that a lot of high level government officials have multi million dollar houses in western Europe.

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

[MultiVerse]

More interesting than the fact you are heavily invested in Russia and are talking your own book?

[rod9301]

Why would i talk my own book?
You think I'm trying to influence people to buy Russian stocks? How would this benefit me?

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

[MultiVerse]

Why else would you repeatedly tell the lie over-and-over that sanctions and exports bans don't impact Russia and only hurt the West?

[rod9301]

What i said if that sanctions hurt the west, possibly more than they hurt Russia, but 8 let have changed my mind.
For they hurt us and Europe, but now I'm thinking they hurt Russian people too. Not though the Russian government, at least 8 can't see any evidence of that

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

[rod9301]

I meant " what i said is that"

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

[Cono Este]

Tell the Taliban what? And what did I walk into?

The mistake America made with the Taliban dates back to the time between 2002 and 2005 when the Afghan people welcomed the American presence and the Taliban numbered less than 8,000 militants. We did not properly support Afghan society because we believed we had already won. The error arose from a preoccupation with Iraq.

At the time, a stable Afghanistan was not America's goal.

That's why I wrote weapons sent to Ukraine "mainly becomes a problem if Ukraine loses the war." Russia's secondary goal if they can't destroy Ukraine outright, just as it is elsewhere in places like Africa, parts of Asia and the Middle East, is political instability. Why is it so hard for so many people to see this obvious truth?

Tell the Taliban not to sell off the 100’000’s of weapons we left over there when the ANA dropped them and surrendered. The whole thing was a terrible idea from the beginning. I’m not blaming Biden.

I promise they’ll end up somewhere in another conflict.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[bennymac]

What i said if that sanctions hurt the west, possibly more than they hurt Russia, but 8 let have changed my mind.
For they hurt us and Europe, but now I'm thinking they hurt Russian people too. Not though the Russian government, at least 8 can't see any evidence of that

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

Can you say that in English please

[4matic]

What i said if that sanctions hurt the west, possibly more than they hurt Russia, but 8 let have changed my mind.
For they hurt us and Europe, but now I'm thinking they hurt Russian people too. Not though the Russian government, at least 8 can't see any evidence of that

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

Yale's Sonnenfeld breaks down myths surrounding the strength of Russia's economy https://www.cnbc.com/video/2022/08/0...pyToPasteboard

[Cono Este]

Arming Ukraine is not an option. Arming a bunch of goat herders who no one trusted with a weapon anyway was an option, a really bad one.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[MultiVerse]

The weird thing about the behavior of people like Rod and Cono in this thread is every time there's a discussion that starts with a clearly attributed and defined Putin endorsed talking point they jump in and endorse it vigorously, always while ignoring the substance of any discussion that came before. At this point it's pathological because every time they've endorsed one of Putin's talking points the passage of time has proven them wrong.

[J. Barron DeJong]

Ukrainians being supplied by Patagucci:




Wait….Enhance.

[jono]

The weird thing about the behavior of people like Rod and Cono in this thread is every time there's a discussion that starts with a clearly attributed and defined Putin endorsed talking point they jump in and endorse it vigorously, always while ignoring the substance of any discussion that came before. At this point it's pathological because every time they've endorsed one of Putin's talking points the passage of time has proven them wrong.

Pootin has invested heavily in building out the lever of nationalist media to get his talking points out. People hear them from different sources and don't always realize that's because those sources are all shilling the same stew. It seems obvious, but denial is a helluva drug.

[Cono Este]

You guys are not only delusional, but you are stupid.

Some of us in here tried to warn you guys about how ugly this war was going to be. I quote myself “we don’t fight like this in the west” “we don’t arm civilians” it’s Slav vs Slav.”Etc.

I guess based on your distractions, calling people Putin sympathizers, or cowards means you guys will turn a blind eye to anything. This behavior was present before the invasion and now you’re being told it’s happening now, and you’re still trying distract with insults.

It does not mean we don’t support Ukraine, it means we’re smart enough to put just a little distance between ourselves and a corner of the planet that does not fight war like we do.

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Cono Este]

You think any of them will make a difference? No training?

Have you thought about the escalation of Russian aggression on civilian targets this will cause? You think Putin has a soft heart?

Hmmm How do I say this? In Western Europe they have a history of not resorting to throwing their civilians into the Breech.

Let’s see if you guys can stomach the pictures of dead civilians?

Or is that what you want?




Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Cono Este]

Yep. Your buddy Vladimir shouldn't be causing any of it.

And of course you'd like Ukraine to roll over and play dead for their own good.

This guy ^^^, actually spent part of his life working for Amnesty or a similar organization.

^^** that was his response to the prior quote when I suggest that civilians should not be used as cannon fodder. Insults to justify it.

His double standard is why no one respects human rights groups like his. Youre seeing it now in Ukraine. They are fighting for their country and now these douches show up. Pencil neck city boys, with law degrees, who are political, and biased, and most importantly ignorant of the people and places they go. No nothing do gooders. Selectively deciding when and where to apply their made up shit.

I only wish instead of warning him I’d baited him into more. Maybe the page 3 tosser would lose his livelihood.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Adolf Allerbush]

No nothing do gooders.

Funny

[MultiVerse]

You guys are not only delusional, but you are stupid.

Yet, you're the one who has been wrong every step of the way. You also haven't said anything original.

Of course your guy Putin attacks civilians. Your delusion was thinking that wasn't the plan all along. Your arguments are incoherent. Your self congratulatory quotes above were in the context of Ukraine sending untrained civilians, not soldiers, to fight which overall has not been the case. It's another thing you were wrong about.

Putin bombs civilian infrastructure far removed from the fighting. His army rapes women and kills children. He kidnaps children and sends them to Russia. He set up concentration camps in occupied territory. His army systematically tortures and murders POWs. He steals Ukrainian crops and everything else he can get his hands on. He destroys Ukrainian churches and other cultural sites.

How many times do people have to tell you Putin wants to erase the Ukrainian state before you start to acknowledge that fact?

[riser4]

Yet, you're the one who has been wrong every step of the way. You also haven't said anything original.

Of course your guy Putin attacks civilians. Your delusion is thinking that wasn't the plan all along. Your arguments are incoherent. Your self congratulatory quotes above were in the context of Ukraine sending untrained civilians to fight, which overall has not been the case. It's another thing you were wrong about.

Putin is bombing civilian infrastructure far removed from the fighting. His army is raping women and killing children. He kidnaps children and sends them to Russia. He set up concentration camps in occupied territory. His army is systematically torturing and murdering POWs. He steals Ukrainian crops and everything else he can get his hands on. He destroys Ukrainian churches and other cultural sites.

How many times do people have to tell you Putin wants to erase the Ukrainian state before you start to acknowledge that fact?

Ya, but isn't it the Ukrainians fault that he has to resort to all that because they didn't just roll over and let him do all that without a fight?

[MultiVerse]

Ya, but isn't it the Ukrainians fault that he has to resort to all that because they didn't just roll over and let him do all that without a fight?

Exactly. Saying "I'm anti war" sounds great at first. Cool, so are most people being killed by war.

What folks like Cono, Rod & Percy really mean however is "My preferred side has chosen to be a combatant so I'm opposed to the other side fighting, which continues the war."

They should just say they're pro-subjugation and be done with it.

[uglymoney]

Exactly. Saying "I'm anti war" sounds great at first. Cool, so are most people being killed by war.

What folks like Cono, Rod & Percy really mean however is "My preferred side has chosen to be a combatant so I'm opposed to the other side fighting, which continues the war."

They should just say they're pro-subjugation and be done with it.

Roger Waters trending on Twitter for exactly this today. Douche.

Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk

[Tri-Ungulate]

Funny

Or did he mean "Do nothing no gooders"?

'Cuz that seems to be his position.

[jono]

Roger Waters trending on Twitter for exactly this today. Douche.

The unmitigated gall of talking down to Alina back in March after she asked him to speak out against the war should have been the apex of his deluded self-importance. Should have been.