Ukraine

[::: :::]

Ukraine is probably the most important place in the world in terms of world peace and American security. Ukrainians are making peace more likely in the future:

• By resisting Russia, Ukraine makes a Chinese invasion of Taiwan less likely
• And also reduces the possibility of successful autocratic aggression elsewhere
• They are also making more war in Europe less likely
• And denying massively increased Russian control of major petroleum, grain, and other key world commodities
• Ukrainian's self-defense also makes nuclear blackmail less effective and therefor reduces the risk of major nuclear war in the future
• Ukraine is weakening Russia's ability to act as chaos agent in its desire to undue the peaceful liberal world order

For a small percentage of America's defense budget and without putting American troops in danger, Ukrainians are helping keep America and the rest of the democratic free world safe. There is no other policy instrument, let alone at such a small cost, capable of checking Russian & Chinese aggression.

We should not only be thankful but also slightly embarrassed that they are doing so much for us and we are doing so little for them. If people like Cono channeling Marjorie Taylor Greene are allowed to reverse Ukraine's efforts, it will come at a cost of a less safe & secure America and greater risk of nuclear war in the future.

in some manner, this conflict is almost a model for thinking about standing up for politically ethical democracy in the US:
Instead of rolling over when challenged, people who understand the value of what they have stand up to the bullying opportunists

[MultiVerse]

Anything interesting happening in Ukraine?

In terms of the future direction of the war today we learned Iran will help Russia build suicide drones. That fact speaks to effectiveness of sanctions in slowing Russian defense production. Even though sanctions and controls are far from perfect, they are forcing Russia to burn through existing stockpiles without capacity for direct replacement through production. The West should further strengthen sanctions and export controls in order to dismantle Russia's genocidal empire.

Far from being ineffective, sanctions and export controls are slowly devastating Russia's ability to wage war on its neighbors.

[TBS]

Ukraine’s requirements for peace
https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news...sho-rosi-79141

[TBS]

Iraq:

US attacked Iraq on false pretense(wmd).

Russia attacked Ukraine under false pretense.

I don't see any difference between the two, except that, so far, many more people died in Iraq.

And yet there was no outcry in the developed world about the iraq invasion. Many posters above have called out this bullshit

In Iraq, how often did US troops intentionally bomb civilian infrastructure - schools, power plants, hospitals - as a matter of strategy?

I don’t recall any

[Bunion 2020]

^^^ Game, set, match.

[bobz]

That was back in the Ttips days of the way OT forum. If Rod had been around he would fucking well know there were a lot of us being highly critical of American actions in Iraq and just like him now, we were raging about it albeit on an even more obscure ski forum.

Yes. (As Bunion may recall) I opposed the US Iraq invasion, and I now oppose Russia's Ukraine invasion. Glad to hear Rod's on the same page with me on that one. Great. So then let's focus on the invasion that's been happening all this year and now.

[frorider]

Guys, if someone posts deeply idiotic blather like ‘And yet there was no outcry in the developed world about the iraq invasion’ or ‘gravity is just a theory’ there’s nothing to be gained engaging them.

[skaredshtles]

Guys, if someone posts deeply idiotic blather like ‘And yet there was no outcry in the developed world about the iraq invasion’ or ‘gravity is just a theory’ there’s nothing to be gained engaging them.

And *much* to be gained by ignoring them.

[Bunion 2020]

Tough to do when people keep quoting his lunacy. I will try and do better.

[J. Barron DeJong]

China’s been shortening RU’s leash. First by telling them to cut it out with the nuclear threats, now this:



https://twitter.com/ambdanfried/stat...VeItGKaQyDOMpw

[beer30]

Um. No. Before (or rather while)Schröder was bought by putin( we're going full circle here) he said that the Invasion is not justified.

Merkel, who was Opposition leader at that time, got the lube and instantly signaled full Support to Bush jr.

To paraphrase: "I would boldy go where the sun don't shine, my great American friend."

So like I stated, not much said about it. Certainly nothing done it. Unless Gerhards saying it wasn’t justified but taking no action against the aggressor is some sort of stand.

[Putin]

The obsession with Rod and Cono is tired. Who gives a fuck what they think?

Da, I care.

I pay good money to these two stooges to shitpost on TRG.

Anything interesting happening in Ukraine?

I am winning !


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[bagtagley]

I didn't say they're dumb, although some certainly are. Some are very smart. They're True Believers, cult members. You can't get people out of a cult by appealing to logic, if their logic loop worked they wouldn't be in the cult.

Fundamentalism, it’s a plague.

[jono]

I am winning !

Master strategist.

[Cisco Kid]

Anything interesting happening in Ukraine?

Russian infantry is digging trenches in Russia while lobbing buzz bombs onto Ukrainian civilians as is SOP for Russian military tactics. Snuff films from the front can be seen on the SUN news Youtube channel if you're into that. Lousy time and place to be a grunt.

[The Reverend Floater]

Iraq:

And yet there was no outcry in the developed world about the iraq invasion.

You serious, Rod?

[up an down]

You serious, Rod?

Rod is seriously cognitively biased or seriously stupid or seriously ignorant of the facts or maybe is seriously a paid stooge.

[rideit]

He is the ron johnson of our times.

[bagtagley]

I’m still not convinced rod isn’t a contrarian bot.

[ex-powderbroker]

AFAICT there's no right to post easily disproven statements endlessly on social media, but here we are. So it becomes a game of shouting down the bs or banning. I'm grateful for the willingness of posters here to tell the trollbots to shut the fuck up when warranted but it still takes an awful lot of effort, especially in the face of organized and amplified disinfo. Anytime one of these gets shown the door, another one comes right back. I think RodJohnson has, kind of like Steep (at least before he went full crazy), a built in amount of goodwill as someone that posts about skiing and doesn't attack people.

[Casey E]

Another mobilization official kisses the dust. Tough nuts them ruskies, this one shot himself 5 times before biting it....

https://nypost.com/2022/11/17/russia...-mysteriously/

Meanwhile,

Earlier this week, Putin attempted to quell mounting civilian protests related to the ongoing war by announcing that those caught criticizing the military or disseminating “fake news” could have their passports confiscated.

“Everyone has to make up their mind: Either you’re with your country or you’re not,” Dmitry Vyatkin, a member of Russia’s State Duma, told RIA Novosti at the time.

Didn´t Bush say something like that way back when?

[TBS]

^^^Or Elon Musk?

[garyfromterrace]

Ukraine’s requirements for peace
https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news...sho-rosi-79141

Seem reasonable.

And *much* to be gained by ignoring them.

Hear! Hear!

[Cono Este]

Why can’t you fucks understand you don’t have to support Russia to expect the Ukraine to play by the rules. Especially when it’s our ammo. We’re not sending Russia the ammo to shoot prisoners in the head.

[Svengali]

planned perfidy is a war crime that Ukrainian machine gunner did his job and saved his comrades lives
I've watched Willi's videos since he was just eating his spicy peppers --sometimes he seems to play the devils advocate card, and other times jumps to unsubstantiated conclusions just like the rest of us.