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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
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    220

    Demo bindings as DD?

    Anyone out there skiing Demo bindings as their daily driver? My 14 year old son is gaining on me, I only got an inch on him and he's got the same foot size as me. Thinking of getting some demo bindings and mounting them on my skis so we can share. How are demo clamps these days? I used to work in a ski shop and it seemed like all of the demo bindings had some play/slop to them but that was a long, long time ago. Have they gotten any better? Is one brand better than the others with their demo bindings? Do any of them have a solid connection with no play in them? Can you use binding freedom/quiver killer with them? Is the hole pattern of the Warden demo the same as the regular Warden?

    Thanks, Mike

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2015
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    I run the Attack2 13 AT demo on a few pairs and Warden 13 demos on some others. Both solid. No slop. Attacks add some height & some ppl don't like that.

    Pretty sure the pattern for the regular Warden is different, both toe & heel. Can confirm tomorrow. Attack demo has same heel pattern as non-demo fwiw.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    Reno, NV
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    Quote Originally Posted by ntblanks View Post
    I run the Attack2 13 AT demo on a few pairs and Warden 13 demos on some others. Both solid. No slop. Attacks add some height & some ppl don't like that.

    Pretty sure the pattern for the regular Warden is different, both toe & heel. Can confirm tomorrow. Attack demo has same heel pattern as non-demo fwiw.
    Same for my demo fleet (3 teens and the wife). Never had an issue and no one seems to notice the stack height.


    Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    if you run demo bindings you will get a nose bleed from the xtra stack height
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
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    Nothing wrong with demo bindings, and the high stack will help with edging on firm, which is why racers have them. It puts the force vector (combined gravity and centrifugal forces) closer to the inside edge of the outside ski.

    Btw, this is not a joke.

    Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    563
    If any of my ski partners were remotely close to my size I would exclusively mount Warden demos so they could reap the benefits of my ski buying problem. Bonus would be playing around with mount points, which is something that can make or break a ski for me.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Philly, PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasGortex View Post
    If any of my ski partners were remotely close to my size I would exclusively mount Warden demos so they could reap the benefits of my ski buying problem. Bonus would be playing around with mount points, which is something that can make or break a ski for me.
    Loved the old AAtack demo as it felt just like a regular binding. With the newer gen ones , are.wardens better than the aatacks or are they all essentially the same ?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    563
    Quote Originally Posted by Duffman View Post
    Loved the old AAtack demo as it felt just like a regular binding. With the newer gen ones , are.wardens better than the aatacks or are they all essentially the same ?
    I haven’t been on the Attacks, but I hear they are good. I generally just stick with Salomon due to a 30 year old grudge against Marker.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
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    Gaperville, CO
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    5,855
    My two most used patrol skis both have demos on them. Attack on one, Wardens on the other.

    If you are stack height sensitive but want demos -- first gen attacks are the easiest to find. But the lowest height is the new Salomon strive demo -- but good luck getting one unless you're a dealer.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
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    1,447
    I'm 6'3 and 200lbs and do a good amount of cliffs/drops/jumps and have Attack2 AT demo binders on my daily drivers and have no issues. I have Warden demo binders on my powder skis (less use) but they're holding up good as well. I'd recommend both of them

    90% sure warden demo is not the same mounting pattern as regular warden

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
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    1,281
    I share skis all the time, so demos are really the only option.
    Since around Christmas, we've traded around skis amongst a group of more than a dozen people.
    Probably 3-5 of us share a lot. (I'm mostly the guy with the ski buying problem. But I share, so that makes it ok, right?! )

    All the demo bindings I've tried the last few years are totally fine.
    Attack1/2 & Warden are probably my favorites.
    But Marker ID (Squire/Griffon) are also just fine.
    Soly Z12's are kind of flimsy, but still do the job just fine.
    And stuff like the Look SPX and Tyrolia SP/PR do fine too.

    I think the short answer is, I don't think there's any recent demo binding that I'd have a problem skiing for a DD. I certainly prefer some vs others. For example; I really dislike the old Marker Griffon, with the worm-drive adjust and the huge heel dildo. The dildo will crush your thumb on the top-sheet if you're not careful, they suck to get into in deep snow, are a pain to adjust quickly to a new BSL, the BSL printing wears off, which makes it more difficult, etc. But I have a pair of Jesters on some Bodacious' that are simply going to stay until they cause me some problem. It's not worth replacing - since they're really not "bad," I just don't like them much.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
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    The wormdrive Squire/Griffon Demo's were discontinued years ago and have been replaced by 'lever activated' length adjustment. And the Griffon heel changed a couple of years ago and now has a redesigned pivot making it a lot easier to step in to.

    And unlike the consumer versions the Squire/Griffon Demo's don't have ID toes, they're alpine/GW only. The big benefit with them, assuming you don't want to use at AT boot, is that you can buy the base sets seperately to mount on other skis - which you can't do with other brands.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    I have a set of 4frt deadbolt 13 demo bindings ( Attack ?) which I had on a DD ski,

    I did a lot of back 2 back tests moving boot center on a wailer 112 ( ever thing from -2 to +6 ) and they were great for that

    When I swapped them to another ski it was all pretty easy to measure up without a jig and move the mounting plates

    the only downside was the xtra weight, the most positive thing,



    they are white which matches my oakley goggles
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
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    1,281
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    The wormdrive Squire/Griffon Demo's were discontinued years ago and have been replaced by 'lever activated' length adjustment. And the Griffon heel changed a couple of years ago and now has a redesigned pivot making it a lot easier to step in to.

    And unlike the consumer versions the Squire/Griffon Demo's don't have ID toes, they're alpine/GW only. The big benefit with them, assuming you don't want to use at AT boot, is that you can buy the base sets seperately to mount on other skis - which you can't do with other brands.
    Wha?! Really!?

    You can buy the rails separately?
    Where and how much?

    I probably wouldn't change what I'm doing, but that's quite cool.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Dystopia
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    That would be cool

    I know there have been many threads here trying to buy base plates.

    But if you had a demo fleet. And mounted baseplates only.
    Then slide a binding on the ski that’s headed out?

    Not good for binding sales. But great for the rental biz.
    I’ve just decided to be a middle aged somewhat depressed somewhat anxious fucktard until the end.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    in the shadow of the white rocks
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    3,331
    Friends don’t let friends ski demo clamps. They are vague AF & ruin otherwise functional skis.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thornbury, ON, Canada
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    131

    Thumbs up

    I put Demos on everything, mainly to futz with mount point. I can't sleep at night knowing that 1 or 2 clicks forward or back will bring me to ski+binding nirvana. Plus when I travel, I bring 2 skis and just 1 set of toes & heels to slide on / off. The original Attack 13 Demo ( DIN only, not GW ) had very low stand height, though things have changed higher with the Attack2.

    Phil over at his SkiTalk / Pugski forums always lists an annual Binding Summary of the big 4 brands. There you will find all sorts of great tech info for most every Alpine binding model ( though not Tech bindings ).

    Binding summaries are in the first 4 threads:
    https://www.skitalk.com/forums/gear-...omparisons.11/

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Lapping the pow with the GSA in the PNW
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    5,210
    I used to have hang ups on demos, then my kid grew and he was big enough to ski my skis but had a bigger BSL.

    I use the following demos - OG Griffons, Attack 1 and 2’s and Warden 13’s. I skied all last season with demos on my 184 K108’s and swapped to normal STH2’s this year. Aside from the weight delta, I don’t feel much difference.

    I continue to lean towards Warden 13 demos since the brakes are easy to swap between STH2 models and I have lots of different widths.

    The ability to share skis and therefore justifying owning more models is worth it, IMO.
    In constant pursuit of the perfect slarve...

  19. #19
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    Dec 2009
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    Sun Valley, ID
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    Quote Originally Posted by iriponsnow View Post
    Friends don’t let friends ski demo clamps. They are vague AF & ruin otherwise functional skis.
    Suuure dude. Sure.

  20. #20
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    Quote Originally Posted by ARL67 View Post
    I put Demos on everything, mainly to futz with mount point. I can't sleep at night knowing that 1 or 2 clicks forward or back will bring me to ski+binding nirvana.
    and on that subject what were your findings how much changing boot center affects ski handling ?

    IME I didnt feel 1 cm, it took 2 cms to feel any difference and that was on a DPS wailer which has a short running surface ergo if there is hole interference just move 1 cm

    in any case on TGR there were a ton of where to mount ? questions, folks would just project where ever they mounted and say it was great but how would they know if they didnt test other mounts and its a big hassle to change boot center

    It was such obvious BS so i wanted to know how much BS


    come to think of it I also have a Salomon 977 demo in the fleet
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thornbury, ON, Canada
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    131
    I mostly ski on hard-pack so I'm not your typical TGR'r. I find moving up 1cm ( or even 0.5cm ) can alter the feel of tip engagement on a groomer, or the feeling of less tail. As the skis I'm on are usually less than 90 wide, the added stand height of a Demo ( or System binding ) has its benefits for the front-side.

    I'm in on Marshal's pre-order for the Heritage R87.
    I'm going to put on new PRD 12 binding ( Demo ) as they are:
    A. dirt cheap at Corbetts
    B. comes standard with 85 brake
    C. I still like some stand height in a mid-80s wide
    D. PRD is 400-500 lighter ( per pair ) than Attack 14, Griffon 13, Warden 13 Demos.
    E. I can futz with mount point as the Heritage R87 is built by Blossom and those Italians may have their own idea of where the optimal Line is that might not agree with me, my personal dimensions, and ski stance / style.


    I have a friend whom every time he buys a new ski ( typically 188-192 long ) I always encourage him to slap on a Demo binding so that he can futz with mount point. His answer is "No, I prefer (always) skiing Pivots on the Line" -> of course he has NEVER tried an alternate mount point on any of his skis, EVER, LOL
    Last edited by ARL67; 02-19-2022 at 03:33 PM.

  22. #22
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    Mar 2005
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    Dystopia
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    “The Line”

    As if it’s gospel.
    Even outside of park skiing it can vary based on bsl or height and style.

    If you buy a faction or other young gun sometimes park or switch powder ski good luck with the lines.

    I admit a pivot is the sweetest binding. Clean. Flat. Natural ski flex.
    But demo bindings work fine these days.

    You might look like a gaper.
    Otoh you might look like a skid that scored sweet demo skis for cheap.
    Who cares.
    I’ve just decided to be a middle aged somewhat depressed somewhat anxious fucktard until the end.

  23. #23
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    Dec 2009
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    Sun Valley, ID
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    and on that subject what were your findings how much changing boot center affects ski handling ?

    IME I didnt feel 1 cm, it took 2 cms to feel any difference and that was on a DPS wailer which has a short running surface ergo if there is hole interference just move 1 cm

    in any case on TGR there were a ton of where to mount ? questions, folks would just project where ever they mounted and say it was great but how would they know if they didnt test other mounts and its a big hassle to change boot center

    It was such obvious BS so i wanted to know how much BS


    come to think of it I also have a Salomon 977 demo in the fleet
    0.5cm feels different to me for sure. 1cm can be as big of a difference as switching to a different ski.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sun Valley, ID
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    Quote Originally Posted by Core Shot View Post
    “The Line”

    As if it’s gospel.
    Even outside of park skiing it can vary based on bsl or height and style.

    If you buy a faction or other young gun sometimes park or switch powder ski good luck with the lines.

    I admit a pivot is the sweetest binding. Clean. Flat. Natural ski flex.
    But demo bindings work fine these days.

    You might look like a gaper.
    Otoh you might look like a skid that scored sweet demo skis for cheap.
    Who cares.
    Kind of why I like the older marker royal demo as they basically look, and ski, just like the regular version.

    New flick lever ones are easier to mess with though.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    7B Idaho
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    906
    Quote Originally Posted by iriponsnow View Post
    Friends don’t let friends ski demo clamps. They are vague AF & ruin otherwise functional skis.
    We don't all ski in Vermont. They're fine in western US snowpacks or for nonracers.

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