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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    82

    Not getting along with my touring setup - suggestions?

    Another ski recommendation thread

    About 3-4 seasons ago I got a pair of 4Frnt ravens with kingpins. Iíve never *really* gotten along with them - they feel a little too skittish for my liking. Iím guessing itís the reverse camber and maybe the longer sidecut. I find myself struggling to trust them at times, especially when conditions are firm and steep. Jump turns on a tiny effective edge are scary. They ski soft snow fine, but most of ski touring involves skiing everything from crust and pow to ice.

    Iíd like to figure out what skis should be on my radar.

    In the resort, Iím skiing Enforcer 104ís and BC Animas. Love them both.

    Touring boots are Zero G Tour Pros.

    Other skis Iíve liked include the ON3P wrenegade a and the Dynastar mfree 108. Rustler 11ís, Atris. 4Frnt Kye 110. ON3P Jeffreys

    Skis Iíve been meh on - the Moment Wildcat. (Not sure why, just never really got along with them, they felt kind of dead? theyíre clearly still great skis). Zero G pro 95 (just too light for me to enjoy skiing)

    Iím 5í9Ē and about 165 lbs. Iím a reasonably strong skier, but nothing crazy.

    Live in Whistler, ski the surrounding areas mostly. We deal with a lot of heavy maritime snowpack. Changing conditions, the usual.

    Ideally I think I want a ski in the 100-110 range. Something that can ski steeps and tight spots well in a variety of snow conditions while remaining accessible. If I sell the Ravens, these would be my one ski quiver for dedicated tours.

    Skis on my radar (in no particular order)

    Atomic Backland 107
    Moment Deathwish Tour (Too wide?)
    Black Crows Ferox (Stupidly expensive..)
    Black Crows Corvus Freebird (ditto)
    Line Vision 108 (Too soft?)
    WNDR Intention 110 (Seem solid but heavy)
    WNDR Vital 100 (like the look of this, but maybe kinda narrow?)
    Pagoda 106 C2 Tour (See the BC skis)

    Iíll be mounting the ski I choose with an ATK Raider 12.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
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    voting in seattle
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    Vision is a great ski - probably the one I’d get from your list.
    Ferox is also very very awesome. One of those skis that just instantly clicked and You have a ton of fun on.

    If you liked your wrenegades why not look at a tour build ON3P?

    I never clicked with any of the Hoji skis for what it’s worth

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    82
    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    Vision is a great ski - probably the one I’d get from your list.
    Ferox is also very very awesome. One of those skis that just instantly clicked and You have a ton of fun on.

    If you liked your wrenegades why not look at a tour build ON3P?

    I never clicked with any of the Hoji skis for what it’s worth
    Thanks for the thoughts.

    I figured the Visions might be too soft / unstable for steep jump turns - although I bet theyíre an absolute riot elsewhere. I have a hard time believing a ski that light and soft wouldnít be a chattery ride.

    Iíve heard the Ferox is close to an Atris, and that interests me a lot as I found it a playful ski with some backbone. Would you feel comfortable skiing it as a daily, even in variable?

    The ON3Ps are an interesting option, but the tour layups are an unknown quantity to me. The added issue is that USD to CAD is pricey, and my last pairs of ON3P/Moments got dinged at customs for a pretty penny.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    317

    Not getting along with my touring setup - suggestions?

    Faction Agent 3.0 might be right up your alley. Havenít tried it, but itís pretty appealing to me. Not as heavy/solid probably as the Corvus FB, but heavier than the Backland 107 and gets some good reviews.

  5. #5
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    Jul 2006
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    voting in seattle
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamski View Post
    Thanks for the thoughts.

    I figured the Visions might be too soft / unstable for steep jump turns - although I bet they’re an absolute riot elsewhere. I have a hard time believing a ski that light and soft wouldn’t be a chattery ride.

    I’ve heard the Ferox is close to an Atris, and that interests me a lot as I found it a playful ski with some backbone. Would you feel comfortable skiing it as a daily, even in variable?

    The ON3Ps are an interesting option, but the tour layups are an unknown quantity to me. The added issue is that USD to CAD is pricey, and my last pairs of ON3P/Moments got dinged at customs for a pretty penny.
    Ferox is all it’s stated to be. A bit heavy for a true touring ski IMO. I skied it with Kingpins around Alpental on not a great day. It crushed it. Almost bought a pair.

    Vision doesn’t ski that soft IMO. Maybe I’m biased but it was the most surprising ski I have been on recently. Didn’t expect the level of resort performance it gave. K2 should have marketed under their brand as a way back upgrade.

    My ON3P bias is pretty clear but I have been really impressed by the new tour and hybrid builds (a tour core with thick base). Ski solid.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    771
    I have close to your preferences in skis and recently got Volkl Blaze 106 to give it a try.

    Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    106
    OP, this was my story too. I found the Raven to be totally overrated despite wanting to like it. Of the options you list, I'd go Ferox. They do ski pretty similar to the Atris (a ski I like), and are pretty capable in non-powder conditions.

    Or maybe hang in there a bit longer and see if a Blizzard Hustle or K2 Dispatch are more to your liking.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Idaho
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    1,142
    I ski the resort on heavy set ups…Volkl, Blizzard, Nordica. I just put ATK Raider on that Backland 107 and it has exceeded my expectations for performance while being light as a feather.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
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    1,115
    I think a Corvus FB is a better option then the ferox. The Corvus handles harder snow better and chopped up shit. The ferox is really fun and floaty. But gets tossed around a bit. Don’t get me wrong. I don’t think either would be a bad choice. I have a ferox, a Corvus FB, two Corvus and an Atris, so I have spent some time on each of them.

    I hated all of my kingpin and touring skis until I figured out how to make them ski like my alpine set ups.

    I would put a zero g 105 on the list though from what I’ve read. That’s my next ski choice I believe.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    82
    Quote Originally Posted by SoVT Joey View Post
    I think a Corvus FB is a better option then the ferox. The Corvus handles harder snow better and chopped up shit. The ferox is really fun and floaty. But gets tossed around a bit. Don’t get me wrong. I don’t think either would be a bad choice. I have a ferox, a Corvus FB, two Corvus and an Atris, so I have spent some time on each of them.

    I hated all of my kingpin and touring skis until I figured out how to make them ski like my alpine set ups.

    I would put a zero g 105 on the list though from what I’ve read. That’s my next ski choice I believe.
    Howíd you do that? Whatís your secret?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
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    1,115
    Quote Originally Posted by Bamski View Post
    Howíd you do that? Whatís your secret?
    matched my delta angles of my alpine bindings to my kingpins. I ski marker jesters and found that a 2-3mm shim under the heel changed everything about the feel of the binding. Iím able to engage the tips and I donít feel like Iím fighting to get forward. I had zero ability to start a decent turn with the shovel, felt like I was starting the turns right in front of the toe piece. It sucked. And felt like surfing marbles even on hero snow.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    82
    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    Ferox is all it’s stated to be. A bit heavy for a true touring ski IMO. I skied it with Kingpins around Alpental on not a great day. It crushed it. Almost bought a pair.

    Vision doesn’t ski that soft IMO. Maybe I’m biased but it was the most surprising ski I have been on recently. Didn’t expect the level of resort performance it gave. K2 should have marketed under their brand as a way back upgrade.

    My ON3P bias is pretty clear but I have been really impressed by the new tour and hybrid builds (a tour core with thick base). Ski solid.
    Apparently I owe it to myself to check this ski out. Still wondering how itíll do as a dedicated walking ski with the full twin / lack of skin clip.. kick turns would be interesting. Howís its edge hold?

    Sucks that the traits we want for a pow ski are so opposed to those of a good alpine / steeps ski.

    Ever tried a WNDR? Thereís a few for sale here in town, and they seem well made / damp.

    Iíd love to try a woodsman or DWT, sucks that I need to gamble to even see one here in Canada.. oh well

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    82
    Quote Originally Posted by Beder View Post
    I ski the resort on heavy set ups…Volkl, Blizzard, Nordica. I just put ATK Raider on that Backland 107 and it has exceeded my expectations for performance while being light as a feather.
    This set up is a front runner in my mind. Seems like it would be reasonably versatile? Howís it handle in variable? Howís the edge hold? Retail folks have said itís demanding, but coming from Moment / ON3P I canít imagine theyíre a ďpunishingĒ ski.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    in the trench
    Posts
    14,209
    If its strictly for touring. Get the gpo ul thats in gear swap.182/116 waist and 8lbs . Mount them at -1 to -1.5. Awesome touring ski and i think he's in vancouver. Priced to sell and they'll outlast a lot of those big brands you're looking at

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    82
    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    If its strictly for touring. Get the gpo ul thats in gear swap.182/116 waist and 8lbs . Mount them at -1 to -1.5. Awesome touring ski and i think he's in vancouver. Priced to sell and they'll outlast a lot of those big brands you're looking at

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app
    Good call out, but my BSL looks like itíll conflict pretty good there. Iíll take a closer look. I know nothing about Praxis.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    967
    I love my 0G 105.

    I also liked my navis freebird.

    But if i had to choose, i would go with the 0G.

    There are alot of interessting skis on your list.
    Hard to choose from the desktop.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
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    yer in whistler where there should be no shortages of used gear so instead of wanking about on TGR how many angels can dance on the head of a pin

    just pickup another one try it out maybe you get lucky

    did I mention i have 7 setups that will tour maybe half a doz skins ?
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Golden B.C.
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    458
    I 2nd the vision 108. Iíve been on it since it released, 2 years ago I think. Awesome ski for the weight. Surprisingly damp and super easy to ski in all conditions Iíve encountered (Canadian Rockies in June to mid winter Selkirk waist deep blower) Iím same height as you but only 135lb on the 183 and if I was any bigger Iíd want the 189cm length. So Iíd recommend the longer length.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Golden B.C.
    Posts
    458
    I 2nd the vision 108. Iíve been on it since it released, 2 years ago I think. Awesome ski for the weight. Surprisingly damp and super easy to ski in all conditions Iíve encountered (Canadian Rockies in June to mid winter Selkirk waist deep blower) Iím same height as you but only 135lb on the 183 and if I was any bigger Iíd want the 189cm length. So Iíd recommend the longer length.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    82
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    yer in whistler where there should be no shortages of used gear so instead of wanking about on TGR how many angels can dance on the head of a pin

    just pickup another one try it out maybe you get lucky

    did I mention i have 7 setups that will tour maybe half a doz skins ?
    Trawling Craigslist here is surprisingly disappointing. Then again I also staunchly refuse to get Facebook, and most of the best gear sales (ski and bike) here are usually on marketplace.

    PM me what you got

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    26,588
    Nothing I wana sell but my point is that the key to the used market is you always have the money to buy and so you must wait for the deal

    So you are just chilling/ doing your mediation practise and in mid chant ( well almost) a ski/ binding/ skin combo comes along for 30-40% of what it would have cost to buy that setup and you jump on it

    and then then one day you wake up and realize you have a doz pair of skis

    and you don't really want to sell any of them
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  22. #22
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    Sep 2008
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    Not Brooklyn
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamski View Post
    Good call out, but my BSL looks like itíll conflict pretty good there. Iíll take a closer look. I know nothing about Praxis.
    Those UL GPOs are a great winter touring ski. I've put over 100 days on my pair and they're still going strong. They behave a lot like Rustler 11s. Different feeling with the ultra light layup but you can ski them similarly.



    Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    西 雅 圖
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    Enforcer 104 Unlimited

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    82
    Quote Originally Posted by gregL View Post
    Enforcer 104 Unlimited
    Definitely crossed my mind - reviews arenít exactly common yet. One caveat being from a friend at a shop stocking Nordica who claims the unlimited feels a bit pedestrian compared to his regular 104ís. Heís the only guy I know whoís actually been on Ďem.

    That said, for shape and versatility theyíd be tough to beat.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Idaho
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamski View Post
    This set up is a front runner in my mind. Seems like it would be reasonably versatile? How’s it handle in variable? How’s the edge hold? Retail folks have said it’s demanding, but coming from Moment / ON3P I can’t imagine they’re a “punishing” ski.
    I found it easy, not demanding at all, and I’m not especially skilled. Great edge hold. I did shim the toes of the R14’s so that I have a 7mm drop like my alpine bindings.
    Ski and binder are 1955 grams btw

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