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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    truckee
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    We had a good friend who died in the La Traviata slide near Revelstoke. The assistant guide was uncomfortable but didn't say anything to the head guide/owner. Seven people died. And it just about broke the assistant guide emotionally--as I recall from his book he left the profession.

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    269
    I stand corrected. You guys are heroes. Don't change a thing.

  3. #53
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    Jan 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapow View Post
    I stand corrected. You guys are heroes. Don't change a thing.
    I'm with you bro
    sick of everyone trying to one up each other and point out how you are doing it wrong
    "just trying to save a life brah"

  4. #54
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    Mar 2016
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    Warm parts of the St. Vrain
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    Quote Originally Posted by fastfred View Post
    I'm with you bro
    sick of everyone trying to one up each other and point out how you are doing it wrong
    "just trying to save a life brah"
    Woah. This is so Punk, it sounds better on vinyl.
    If we're gonna wear uniforms, we should all wear somethin' different!

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
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    Wasatch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapow View Post
    I stand corrected. You guys are heroes. Don't change a thing.
    I’m glad the collective put you on notice for your bullshit post. I came back to it multiple times and could not put together a cogent reply but collective came through. Cheers

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    in a suite of vigorous disturbances
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    2,109
    Quote Originally Posted by east or bust View Post
    reading comprehension fail and dick punches for you bud
    This reply was perfect.

    I wonder if wapow even read the thread, or if he just sprayed garbage to make himself feel smart

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    Where the sheets have no stains
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    18,224
    Just ignore them. Some people are not worth the trouble.
    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

    "Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Hell Track
    Posts
    11,637
    It seems like the kind of situation where guidance could be implied, rather than told.

    Ask them if they know if a skin track has been put in in the trees that everyone skis. Ask them if they've heard any reports about when the last time the exposed gully slid. Etc. Imply that the direction they appear to be heading is dumb without actually telling them it's dumb. Which also opens the door for them to give you useful information, in the event that they know more about the situation than you do (which seems unlikely, but you never know).

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapow View Post
    I stand corrected. You guys are heroes. Don't change a thing.
    Really? Having input from a safety perspective is always mansplaining?
    Goal: ski in the 2018/19 season

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    1,485

    To say anything or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shorty_J View Post
    Really? Having input from a safety perspective is always mansplaining?
    Good point. If you’d ask a male guide why they were making those decisions but not a female one because of fear of backlash that’s also sexist and shouldn’t be ok, from your perspective or the guide’s. They’re not immune to criticism for the mere fact they’re women, and if they feel like they are, that’s their problem not yours.

    A Kantian deontological perspective would say that an action is right based on the virtue of the action itself or your moral duty to perform said action, not on the consequences or outcome of action.

  11. #61
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    In a van... down by the river
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    9,642
    Recent remotely-triggered avalanche in the general vicinity:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	sanjuan-avy1.jpg 
Views:	201 
Size:	1.01 MB 
ID:	401012

  12. #62
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    Jan 2008
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    truckee
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    Say something and the worst thing that can happen is everyone thinks you're a douche.
    Don't say something . . . .

    However--if you do say something there's an excellent chance it will make no difference. And whatever you do, don't say something AFTER the bad thing has happened. At that point chances are they've figured it out, if they're still alive.

  13. #63
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    Oct 2003
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    In Your Wife
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    Based on the account of events posted by the OP, and the subsequent photo, the only correct answer here is option E: there is not enough information provided to answer the question.

  14. #64
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    Feb 2007
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    Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapow View Post
    So the slope was deemed stable in the avy report and by your own assessment (had already gone big) but you felt the necessity to tell them that it was dangerous? Seems like you were butting in unnecessarily. What am i missing?
    The one time I went for a ride it was on a west-facing above treeline slope "deemed stable in the avy report" (i.e. no listed problems or concerns) in a zone adjacent to the San Juans.

    Tactfully informing someone they're doing something stupid isn't "mansplaining" just because the person doing stupid things is female.
    "High risers are for people with fused ankles, jongs and dudes who are too fat to see their dick or touch their toes.
    Prove me wrong."
    -I've seen black diamonds!

    throughpolarizedeyes.com

  15. #65
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
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    Wenatchee
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    11,580
    I’m kinda surprised that some people don’t think that safe travel practice in avalanche terrain isn’t priority number one and a habit that needs to be developed regardless of conditions.

    I know it takes discipline and that can be hard but it’s something that should become almost second nature.

    Sure, if your risk tolerance is high you might even ski the slope in question. One at a time and with eyes on, I can’t see the whole runout but lets assume that there’s a nice gradual runout with no trees. If you can access the top safely. There is no reason to ever transition at the bottom of that slope. Even if you were alone or skiing one at a time you would want to move out of the runout zone to a safe area.

    Maybe Wapow can explain his reasoning why what that guided group did was okay.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  16. #66
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Slightly off route
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    151
    Seems like a good pic from an educational viewpoint - I have been guilty of viewing the treed ridge as potentially safer terrain, but what's lurking above or to the side. Pic drives it home.

    Quote Originally Posted by skaredshtles View Post
    Recent remotely-triggered avalanche in the general vicinity:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	sanjuan-avy1.jpg 
Views:	201 
Size:	1.01 MB 
ID:	401012

  17. #67
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    Sep 2008
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    Not Brooklyn
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    I’m kinda surprised that some people don’t think that safe travel practice in avalanche terrain isn’t priority number one and a habit that needs to be developed regardless of conditions.

    I know it takes discipline and that can be hard but it’s something that should become almost second nature.

    Sure, if your risk tolerance is high you might even ski the slope in question. One at a time and with eyes on, I can’t see the whole runout but lets assume that there’s a nice gradual runout with no trees. If you can access the top safely. There is no reason to ever transition at the bottom of that slope. Even if you were alone or skiing one at a time you would want to move out of the runout zone to a safe area.

    Maybe Wapow can explain his reasoning why what that guided group did was okay.
    Strong post.

  18. #68
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    Oct 2003
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    In Your Wife
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCamper View Post
    Seems like a good pic from an educational viewpoint - I have been guilty of viewing the treed ridge as potentially safer terrain, but what's lurking above or to the side. Pic drives it home.
    The ridge that runs parallel to the fall line in that photo did not slide.

  19. #69
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    88
    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    Low risk is not no risk. Moderate risk is not low risk. The problem might be there... the obvious avalanche path says the dragon visits on the regular... how many people to wager at once on that bet when modeling behavior?
    Expose one person at a time and no picnicking in the runout.
    This.
    Newbie here.
    The value of teaching safe travel cannot be overestimated. TT my feeling is you made a good call chatting "off the record" as it were.

    It's always tough to come at this the right way, but I'd hate to be doing CPR on someone I didn't talk to when I thought I should have.

    Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk

  20. #70
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    Dec 2004
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    Where the sheets have no stains
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    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	sanjuan-avy1.jpg 
Views:	98 
Size:	430.0 KB 
ID:	401382

    The ridge that runs parallel to the fall line in that photo did not slide.
    No, it didn't propagate or entrain that portion of the slope which appears to be less steep, a good bit less wind loaded and has a slightly different aspect. What pulled out appears to be a pocket although a big one.

    That said would you feel good traveling up that ridge with the remaining pocket above you? Not saying it could not be safely done after the slide in the photo happened but is that really a safe route?

    ETA:I Re-read this and trying to spark discussion not be a dick, kind of the point of this thread in my opinion.
    Last edited by Bunion 2020; 01-16-2022 at 02:41 PM.
    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

    "Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"

  21. #71
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Bottom feeding
    Posts
    9,522

    To say anything or not?

    Say something, and BTW, it goes both ways.
    5 days ago I was skiing for the 3rd day in a row my local safe-ish spot. I was skiing a spot I have been skiing since 2006, and have never seen it slide. Low angle, etc.
    The trailhead is a very popular spot for everyone and anyone, so as I waited for friends alongside the groomed trail to start skinning, a guy stops, waits for his friend, then says to her, thinking I can’t hear: “I wanted to tell you this so I don’t ruin those folk’s ski.”
    I listen, but can’t hear, so I tell him, “Those are my tracks from the last 2 days”.
    The gal turns and skis by so I say: “Is there an issue or something?” She says “Slab”.
    Well thanks.
    Anyway, it sort of heightened my awareness on this lap, and I indeed re-evaluated my assessments from the previous days, but as I suspected, the slope was even more stable/stuck than before.
    When we finished, we talked with some folks heading out and we shared our experiences with the skiing and conditions, etc. They appreciated it.
    Well maybe I'm the faggot America
    I'm not a part of a redneck agenda

  22. #72
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,929
    Hey Plug if you're talking about skiing above GR I have heard of folks seeing a pretty good sized crown on the main face of C. I had heard about it from someone who has been skiing here for 30 odd years but I can't remember any of the details. I'll try to remember to ask the next time I talk with him

  23. #73
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Bottom feeding
    Posts
    9,522

    To say anything or not?

    Avoid the main face.
    Well maybe I'm the faggot America
    I'm not a part of a redneck agenda

  24. #74
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Posts
    21
    Labeling yourself a guide in America doesn’t mean that much. What’s happened in the San Juan’s is proof of that.

  25. #75
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Alpental
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    4,069
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudimatt7 View Post
    Labeling yourself a guide in America doesn’t mean that much. What’s happened in the San Juan’s is proof of that.
    All you need is a pair of Dynafits and a Trust Fund
    “I have a responsibility to not be intimidated and bullied by low life losers who abuse what little power is granted to them as ski patrollers.”

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