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  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skidog View Post
    yeah i only mentioned this like 3 times...
    Out of all the vile stuff you have posted in here, this comment right here is actually the most telling for me. You should ask yourself exactly why you typed it and take some real time to analyze the answer.

  2. #227
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    Caught this episode on a recent drive and found it to be an excellent listen.

    https://www.npr.org/2021/09/03/10341...d-a-9-11-story
    life ain't guaranteed, love your people while you can

  3. #228
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    guys...

    the intention of this thread has value -

    some time ago, one poster's posts do not.

    as has been done in another thread, Please do not quote, Please do not respond to those posts - please...


    9-11 affected many of us, in many (different) ways...

    there is little value in claiming one was/has More than another ( That is not important )


    what is important is that we remember what happened that day, and

    I would offer, while we remember, we also make conscious choices to minimize the chance of something like that happening again --

    ( pages back, old goat linked an essay that offers one author's opinion. I thought it was a worthwhile read )


    I am saddened by what has happened to / in this thread...

    all of our lives changed after 9-11 - and I am saddened for the changes.


    Please don't quote nor reply to those posts -

    Just let this thread Be About remembering. and grieving. and healing.


    wishing you peacefulness. tj

  4. #229
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    ^^^Well said
    “A society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.”
    ― Milton Friedman

  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by ötzi View Post
    It was such a nice day. Just perfect weather on the Eastern seaboard, crystal clear and not a cloud in the sky. Now every really nice day I think of 9/11. I wish I didn't.
    Perfect weather and after about noon, you picked up how quiet the afternoon was because there were no planes in the sky.

  6. #231
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    I found it interesting that Rick Rescorla (see the New Yorker article I posted earlier) determined that a bomb in the parking garage could take out the building (prior to terrorists trying this). After that he, as security for a firm in the towers, would make all his fellow employees do evacuation drills. Which were mocked by some. But then he marched them all out to safety that morning.

    That article is worth reading if you have 15min.

  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skidog View Post
    yeah i only mentioned this like 3 times...
    Tell us more how the sound of bodies hitting the ground on video was more impactful because you were only 30 miles away. Those people that were only 50 miles away watching it on video have no idea how much more meaningful it was for you.


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  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    Caught this episode on a recent drive and found it to be an excellent listen.

    https://www.npr.org/2021/09/03/10341...d-a-9-11-story
    yeah, this was a good listen.
    Quote Originally Posted by mfcf13 View Post
    The world needs more Donnely and less Stainless.

  9. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by abraham View Post
    If you're not in Afghanistan did you really feel the impact of 9/11? Not really I guess. Strangely, 9/11 changed many things about many people's worlds. This was a thread about marking 20 years since something that likely impacted every poster on this board. Just like the Afghanistan one, there were good, thought provoking posts, and people dragging their balls around to make a point and get attention. It might do you some good to read about how 9/11 had an effect on younger people, or people on the other side of the country. But that would be hard for you because it's not about you.

    It would be interesting if you could be less of a bitch.



    There's a long discussion about the picture of the jumper here, with some of the same arguments for showing it. And not showing it. Shockingly, this is a topic with nuance. https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...d.php?t=303946
    This was posted in that old thread

    https://youtu.be/m3gbxJ4xUDE



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  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by bennymac View Post
    Oh now we’re getting to the real concerns you have about 9/11.

    Fuck off and quit cunting up this thread.
    Oh, and, please tell me what your "real concerns " are about 9/11?

    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  11. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTT View Post
    This thread has rolled down the same hill as almost every other thread of late

    Sad too see
    The upstate NY thread is still flying high.

    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  12. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Oh, and, please tell me what your "real concerns " are about 9/11?
    Hint: it’s got nothing to do with real estate prices

  13. #238
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    What is this, some sort of guessing game? What are your fucking "concerns"?

    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  14. #239
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    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  15. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    I raise you this. Commentary is funny

    https://youtu.be/XVn9OoyGc1o


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  16. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by AK47bp View Post
    I raise you this. Commentary is funny

    https://youtu.be/XVn9OoyGc1o
    "If 9/11 happened in July, 7-11 would be screwed."

  17. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by abraham View Post
    I went back and read some articles about 9/11 recently, it was worth looking at them as an adult and from 20 years in the future.

    This one stood out to me, I bet this is the kind of stuff you were aware of later. Did you guys change things as a result of things learned in the response?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/n...ws-rescue.html
    Counterpoint: there's radio failures and there's radio failures.

    “There’s numerous civilians at all stairwells, numerous burn injuries are coming down. I’m trying to send them down first. Apparently, it’s above the 75th floor. I don’t know if they got there yet. OK, 3 Truck and we are still heading up. OK? Thank you.”

    Pat had also been recorded responding to an explicit order for Ladder 3 to evacuate the building.

    “This is the officer of Ladder Company 3: I refuse the order. I have too many burned people here with me, and I’m not leaving them.”
    I wish he'd done what they told him, but God bless Paddy Brown.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/911-cl...19-years-apart

  18. #243
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    I've been looking for this one for a few days now. It's good.


  19. #244
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    I wonder if all of you reading this might join me in a weird little thought experiment:
    Remember that sense we had…that sense that we were connected and together in something, and that our differences were insignificant? I wonder if we can take this occasion to just think about that, and maybe recapture some of it, just ourselves, in our own lives and in our own minds.

    It was true, it meant a lot, it doesn’t need to be so far away, maybe it’s right there in our memories, ready to be deployed.

    I think if there’s any reason to remember, it’s because that sense of a deep shared human connection is of unmeasurable value.
    We saw the worst of human dysfunction and responded with the best of the human spirit. That spirit is part of us! Capture it, hold on as long as you can.

    I love you guys.

  20. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    I wonder if all of you reading this might join me in a weird little thought experiment:
    Remember that sense we had…that sense that we were connected and together in something, and that our differences were insignificant? I wonder if we can take this occasion to just think about that, and maybe recapture some of it, just ourselves, in our own lives and in our own minds.

    It was true, it meant a lot, it doesn’t need to be so far away, maybe it’s right there in our memories, ready to be deployed.

    I think if there’s any reason to remember, it’s because that sense of a deep shared human connection is of unmeasurable value.
    We saw the worst of human dysfunction and responded with the best of the human spirit. That spirit is part of us! Capture it, hold on as long as you can.

    I love you guys.
    Well said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  21. #246
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    Word brother.


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  22. #247
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    Totally agree. Here's a little story that demonstrates some of that spirit on that day.

    **Some rough images of the buildings going down etc. **


  23. #248
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    Two weeks after 9/11, I met up with my Killington bros for an annual mountain bike ride/party on Rhode Island. A buddy would host at his home, and usually about 20 riders would camp out in his yard.

    We rode a few different loops Saturday, and ended on an out-and-back single-track. I was feeling good towards the end, and pushed the pace on the way out, planning to pick up stragglers on the way back. We picked up Jerry and Sue first, who said our friend Ted was right behind. When we found Ted, he was sprawled out over his bike on the ground, blue and unresponsive. A few in the group immediately started performing CPR, while others rode back to our cars at the trailhead to call 9-1-1.

    I had known Ted for a few years. We weren't as close as he was with some other friends, which might have helped in this situation. While others were in shock, and overwhelmed by emotion, I felt composed enough to act. We performed chest compressions and rescue breaths (poorly), and while none of this was easy for any of us, I remember thinking sort of selfishly, I need to do whatever I can to help. It's what I would want if roles were reversed, and I don't need it hanging over my head that I could have done more if Ted doesn't make it.

    At least 45 minutes passed before the ambulance crew showed up. They took over CPR/treatment, and packed Ted for transport. Once they cleared, the rest of us rode back to the trailhead, mostly in silence, then drove back to my buddy's house.

    We learned a short time later that Ted had a massive heart attack, and in all likelihood was deceased before he hit the ground. He had been prescribed medication for high blood pressure, but didn't like the way it made him feel, so had stopped taking it. I'm guessing this was a contributing factor, but who hasn't ignored their physician's advice at one time or another? His family came to the hospital, and thanks were relayed to everyone who had helped. It was a pretty somber evening, with most of us still in shock over what we'd just been through. We did an abbreviated ride Sunday morning, and most of us would return in a week for Ted's funeral.

    Ted was ex-military (can't remember what branch), and so was interred at a Veteran's cemetery (can't remember which one). I remember the priest mentioning 9/11 in his eulogy, suggesting that the traumatic events of that day somehow contributed to Ted's collapse. OK, sure whatever. I just know that every year since 9/11, I try unsuccessfully to avoid re-visiting the impressions from that day, only to have them spill out unexpectedly, usually in response to someone else doing the same. This year was no exception, and is maybe the first time I recognized the primary emotion I feel on this anniversary is anger. I also expressed in a facebook post, my regret for having begrudged others their reactions to 9/11. I literally just said last Saturday that my history, growing up in north Jersey, working in mid-town through the 80's, my family being from Staten Island, my dad working in the Empire State building, my uncle helping to organize the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade year after year, my seeing a smoldering ground zero on a mountain bike ride the next Sunday, being surrounded by images from the day for months afterwards at my post-production workplace, none of that gave me an exclusive on being impacted by the events of that day.

    I believe I mentioned earlier, but bears repeating; there are pieces of the twin towers placed as memorials across the country. No one should stand in judgement of another's impression of that day. As soon as we start invalidating those raw emotions, we begin to strip away the strong evidence we saw that day of our ability to unite behind a common cause. It's interesting to me that it's taken me 20 years to come to terms with my avoidance of 9/11 observations, and judgement of people I didn't think were close enough, didn't know a victim personally, weren't from the area, didn't have a connection with the buildings, the NY skyline, etc. I think I understand how a person's own impressions might lead them to be dismissive of others, having been guilty of this myself, and while I'm trying to do better, I can see where this could be a pretty common pitfall for many.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilovetoskiatalta View Post
    Dude its losers like you that give ski bums a bad rap.

  24. #249
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    ^^^^All through the soccer adult league playing, coaching kids with other adults "helping", and scout hikes my greatest fear was to either have a Ted in our group or to be Ted. I actually had a nightmare once of hiking at a park we have camped at several times and being paralyzed on the ground staring up unable to speak or move while my daughter is freaking out trying to get help. We had several doctors in the scout troop and did wilderness first aid along with annual CPR refreshers. I've never been in a situation where I had to use it and/or find the defib. But the annual refreshers gave a clue that it is HARD to do for more than a few minutes alone.

    Props to you for trying and I know that tragic experience will be with you forever :-(
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  25. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by ötzi View Post
    Totally agree. Here's a little story that demonstrates some of that spirit on that day.

    **Some rough images of the buildings going down etc. **

    I watch that one every year. The captain of the Amberjack is my hero.

    Also 9/11 boat related......


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