Mysterious death of entire family while hiking

[JayPowHound]

.

[mud]

https://www.latimes.com/california/s...le-dehydration

Read people, read.

Now I'm just pissed off the dog died due to their stupidity.

[old goat]

Anecdote: A friend of mine who also happens to be an ER doc in Flagstaff, once told me that electrolyte imbalances send way more Grand Canyon hikers/tourists to the ER than dehydration

Dehydration by sweating loses water and salt, folks drink tons of water but don't get any salt--low sodium in the blood is bad for the brain.

Is this what they said was the cause or just a story of yours?

That is what the was reported in the news article I read. I don't recall if it was a direct quote from the sheriff. A report I read today (WP) said 109, steep hill exposed to the sun.
Apparently these were SF people who moved to Mariposa in March 2020. Might have had something to do with not appreciating the danger.
Edit--reread the WP article. Sheriff says they had one empty 85 oz water container when found.

But why believe the Sheriff when you can believe the internet sleuths.

[MarcusBrody]

Dehydration by sweating loses water and salt, folks drink tons of water but don't get any salt--low sodium in the blood is bad for the brain.


That is what the was reported in the news article I read. I don't recall if it was a direct quote from the sheriff. A report I read today (WP) said 109, steep hill exposed to the sun.
Apparently these were SF people who moved to Mariposa in March 2020. Might have had something to do with not appreciating the danger.
Edit--reread the WP article. Sheriff says they had one empty 85 oz water container when found.

But why believe the Sheriff when you can believe the internet sleuths.

I don't think most really disbelieve the sheriff, things have just become a bit confused as the sheriff's department (or reports out of it), said that they didn't suspect dehydration, partially due to the remaining water. Then later, the bottle was reported as empty and it was a big part of the death. Now, I'm sure that the bottle probably had 5 oz of water in it and that was seen in two different lights, but that's why you have the people talking about water/not water.

Same with the temperature. The reports varied greatly. I think the Sheriff's most recent suggestion that it was 103 is probably close to correct given the record from the nearest weather station.

But overall, I think (some) people are dissatisfied by the early comments from the sheriff's department that it was a possible but not likely cause of death, then their later definitive statement without finding any more positive evidence (just having other options look less likely). A statement like "We now believe that hyperthermia/dehydration is most likely" would have seemed very reasonable vs. "they died of hyperthermia".

[SumJongGuy]

Dehydration by sweating loses water and salt, folks drink tons of water but don't get any salt--low sodium in the blood is bad for the brain.

When I was a teenager I spent a couple days with some country cousin farm boys standing on the back of a flatbed pickup loading hay bails in the field then hauling them to various barns and stacking them to the rafters.. It was sometimes over 100 degrees. In the pre Gatorade days we ate SALT PILLS while drinking lots of water. Not good for long term heart health.. But definitely did the job as needed at the time..

[Yonder_River]

Can confirm, worked with the PSAR folks at the Canyon a couple years. People think chugging water is the right move, then their brains act all funny when there’s no salt left in their bodies from peeing and sweating.

Yup. I know of someone who was backpacking across the Olympics last summer during a heatwave and his wife nearly died of hyponatremia if it hadn't been for a chance encounter with a hiker earlier that day that they remembered had an inreach. After a night filled with seizures and vomiting, he was able to find the guys campsite and they had a helicopter rescue in the nick of time.

Interestingly, hyponatremia can also occur from overdoing prescribed opiates after a surgery as my sister developed it. A week in the ICU and luckily no brain damage from swelling. Shit is scary..

[Falcon3]

Another interesting fact from the Canyon rangers is how many people lack critical thinking skills during stressful situations.

The North Kaibab trail heads north toward the North Rim from Phantom Ranch.
Now, this trail parallels Bright Angel Creek almost the entire way, but the number of people that get into heat danger on the trail and need rescue is staggering. Most of them don’t even think to jump in the creek. Then the rangers show up and dump them into the creek and drop their core temp and they improve miraculously quickly.

I also loved talking to idiots from Phoenix.

Them: “I live where it’s regularly 120 degrees what do you mean you won’t give me a permit to backpack 30 miles a day during the summer?”

Me: “I understand you live where it’s hot but I’m guessing you go from your air conditioned house to your air conditioned car to your air conditioned office and then back. Put on a 30-lb pack and walk around for a couple hours in the sun at 3pm and then come back and we can talk about this permit”

[old goat]

There is a map of their route in this article https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/10/...ifornia-trail/

You don't have to be dehydrated to die of heat stroke, although it helps.

If they had died in a blizzard I don't think anyone here would question that they died of hypothermia, after all other causes had been ruled out. As skiers that is something we can understand. Heat stroke not so much. It was hot in the Sierra this summer. I can't remember ever before canceling a planned hike because of high temperature but I did last summer.

Every year heat waves kill people in the shade of their apartments, doing no exercise. (Yes I know this tend to be older people with medical problems.)

[TWINS]

Used to work summers in Palm Springs.
The norm was 120+ during the day.
Water doesn't get it done at all.
We would pop Thermotabs to keep our salt levels up.
You know when your depleted of salt when you start cramping up.
Its debilitating.
No possible way to hike out of anywhere if that happened to them.
RIP++++

[mcski]

Sadly, I can envision a scenario w the baby overheating first and becoming lethargic and unresponsive and it spiraling from there and/or the dog overheating and putting on the brakes. Weird tho that it came on so fast that neither of the parents recorded anything on their phones.

[old_newguy]

There is a map of their route in this article https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/10/...ifornia-trail/

You don't have to be dehydrated to die of heat stroke, although it helps.

If they had died in a blizzard I don't think anyone here would question that they died of hypothermia, after all other causes had been ruled out. As skiers that is something we can understand. Heat stroke not so much. It was hot in the Sierra this summer. I can't remember ever before canceling a planned hike because of high temperature but I did last summer.

Every year heat waves kill people in the shade of their apartments, doing no exercise. (Yes I know this tend to be older people with medical problems.)

Everyone is an expert on the internet, from why that dude in Florida killed his girlfriend (or where he is, or the motives of his parents, etc), or how much trouble Baldwin is in trouble (or how firearms should be handled in set, loaded, grainsize, whatever).

It’s less about “understanding” and some weird thing where people make conjecture based on thin information andover confidence in their knowledge.

IMO it is essentially the same as the people doing their own “research” on vaccines, 5G, etc.

[PB]

whoa, whoa WHOA! There's a big difference between questioning the last remaining possibility in a mysterious death (whatever happened to "cause undetermined"??) and claiming that we're under the thumb of the lizard pedophiles.

Do lizards have thumbs?
The overlord lizards do, I suppose.

[old goat]

Unwitnessed deaths by heat stroke are usualy diagnoses of exclusion, although sometimes there may be supportive evidence on autopsy.
https://www.aaimedicine.org/journal-...34-02-0114.pdf
The coroner didn't make it up out of a desire to diagnose something, anything--they followed established guidelines for diagnosing death by heat.

[AK47bp]

Alec Baldwin did it, I heard.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[JimmyCarter]

Alec Baldwin did it, I heard.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

Epstein made Hillary get it done, Hillary made Alec Baldwin take the fall. Allegedly.

[SumJongGuy]

Were they able to ascertain what order they died in and how far apart the deaths were.. Lile within an hour for all of them or did some hang on for several hours longer than the others? With one person this is a no brainer to visualize.. Three with two phones and a dog not so much..

[irul&ublo]

Epstein made Hillary get it done, Hillary made Alec Baldwin take the fall. Allegedly.

Vince Foster re-do

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Were they able to ascertain what order they died in and how far apart the deaths were.. Lile within an hour for all of them or did some hang on for several hours longer than the others? With one person this is a no brainer to visualize.. Three with two phones and a dog not so much..

No, I’m pretty sure that’s why they used the word probable


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[SumJongGuy]

Someone shared a nice hack that might help if you're stranded and your phone is dying.. Before you run out of battery, change the voicemail to a message that tells rescuers where you think you are, the situation, etc. After the phone dies if someone calls your number it will still deliver that info that they can share with the authorities trying to find you..

[old goat]

Someone shared a nice hack that might help if you're stranded and your phone is dying.. Before you run out of battery, change the voicemail to a message that tells rescuers where you think you are, the situation, etc. After the phone dies if someone calls your number it will still deliver that info that they can share with the authorities trying to find you..

When they call you to renew your extended warranty, do you think they'll report it to the authorities or will they just hang up and call the next sucker?

[mcski]

Someone shared a nice hack that might help if you're stranded and your phone is dying.. Before you run out of battery, change the voicemail to a message that tells rescuers where you think you are, the situation, etc. After the phone dies if someone calls your number it will still deliver that info that they can share with the authorities trying to find you..

This is absolutely the wrong thing to do

Instead Send a txt or txts w detailed info to people you know. Trying to connect to voicemail will kill the battery faster than you can say “after the beep”

Plus you need service longer to connect to vmail versus sending a txt

[SumJongGuy]

This is absolutely the wrong thing to do

Instead Send a txt or txts w detailed info to people you know. Trying to connect to voicemail will kill the battery faster than you can say “after the beep”

Plus you need service longer to connect to vmail versus sending a txt

Or send the texts first. It all depends on how much battery you have on whether or not connecting to voicemail is an wise option. You can also set the phone to reply with custom text instead of voice to phone calls.

[seano732]

That “hack” has been making the rounds on SM the last few days, and has been universally roasted by the professional SAR folks…..

[highangle]

[dan_pdx]

Years ago in my feckless youth, I did an extended cycle tour in SE Asia. I was drinking 4-6 liters of water a day, and one day noticed that my sweat didn't taste salty anymore, which was weird / unsettling. Reading this discussion, maybe I was in danger, but I didn't notice any ill effects at the time, just a craving for salt. I took it as an opportunity to eat salty snacks, and added some soy sauce to my meals.