Greece. Or? (Also Italy beta)

[Benny Profane]

Well, he's also working, too, conferring with his guides.

[Tech Tonics]

Thanks for everyone’s feedback so far, this is where we are:

No more Greece. We are going to be in Italy, and given the shifting-sands of European covid restrictions and the small-window we have, we are just going to stay in Italy.

So, a week in Lucca with family. Certainly day trips from there but will mostly be local to Lucca. We plan on a couple days biking around, but otherwise will be hanging with family (lazy and boozy).

Then, we have a full week (7/24-31).

My vote was to go north to lake como then onto the Dolomites.
My family, however, wants to head to Amalfi Coast. Thoughts?

Their thought is that we live at the foot of the San Juans and spend all of our time in the mountains. I recognize that the Dolomites are not the same as Colorado. At all. But, that’s where my family is coming from. (A few days ago after a big hike in the alpine we were biking to get dinner in Telluride. A big rainbow to the west and the waterfall to the east and golden clouds overhead and the wife was like “how much better could the Dolomites be?”).

And I get it, as the kids have had a fraction of the number of days near a coast or beach.

So, if they get their way (they will) and we head to the beach : what to do? Amalfi coast for a few days? Maiori?

Maybe a couple days at Cinque Terre then down to Amalfi?

The wife heard that because there are no cruise ships right now the coast is more quiet than usual.

We fly out of Venice on the 31st and are thinking a couple days there

A few questions:

- is this a bad idea? Should we go to the Dolomites and see some huge mountains and hike to villages?

-other than the last couple days in Venice, do we *need* reservations? We’d like to travel with the freedom to decide where to go, but Italy is probably much different than other places we’ve travelled as a family (Central America, South America, SE Asia, Indonesia, Mexico, etc). Do we need to book ahead?

-2 days in Venice? Good food is more important to us than a touristy scene. What to do?

-what else am I missing? Advice?


Thanks collective!

[Benny Profane]

Thanks for everyone’s feedback so far, this is where we are:

No more Greece. We are going to be in Italy, and given the shifting-sands of European covid restrictions and the small-window we have, we are just going to stay in Italy.

So, a week in Lucca with family. Certainly day trips from there but will mostly be local to Lucca. We plan on a couple days biking around, but otherwise will be hanging with family (lazy and boozy).

Then, we have a full week (7/24-31).

My vote was to go north to lake como then onto the Dolomites.
My family, however, wants to head to Amalfi Coast. Thoughts?

Their thought is that we live at the foot of the San Juans and spend all of our time in the mountains. I recognize that the Dolomites are not the same as Colorado. At all. But, that’s where my family is coming from. (A few days ago after a big hike in the alpine we were biking to get dinner in Telluride. A big rainbow to the west and the waterfall to the east and golden clouds overhead and the wife was like “how much better could the Dolomites be?”).

And I get it, as the kids have had a fraction of the number of days near a coast or beach.

So, if they get their way (they will) and we head to the beach : what to do? Amalfi coast for a few days? Maiori?

Maybe a couple days at Cinque Terre then down to Amalfi?

The wife heard that because there are no cruise ships right now the coast is more quiet than usual.

We fly out of Venice on the 31st and are thinking a couple days there

A few questions:

- is this a bad idea? Should we go to the Dolomites and see some huge mountains and hike to villages?

-other than the last couple days in Venice, do we *need* reservations? We’d like to travel with the freedom to decide where to go, but Italy is probably much different than other places we’ve travelled as a family (Central America, South America, SE Asia, Indonesia, Mexico, etc). Do we need to book ahead?

-2 days in Venice? Good food is more important to us than a touristy scene. What to do?

-what else am I missing? Advice?


Thanks collective!

By going to the Amalfi, you'll be bypassing what, well, I think, is the most beautiful region of Italy, a place you're already in, and that's Tuscany. But, I get it, the wife and maybe kids want beach time. There's so much to see in Tuscany, though, but maybe you guys arent into old churches and sixteenth century art. I get that, we had a wife of a friend who visited us in our month long AirB&B in Siena that could give a fuck. She was miserable and turned into a real pain in the ass, all the while I was wondering, why did you even bother coming here?
So, I guess I'm just saying, stay in Tuscany, definitely rent a vehicle, and experience that place. Siena, Volterra, Montalcino, Montepulciano, the Val d'Orcia, almost any town in Chianti. Then there's Umbria, next door. Spoleto, Orvieto. Dig the architecture, food, wine, people. The people are great. Sure, a few days at the end in Venice should be on the itinerary, because everyone should see Venice, it's such an amazing place. I was always astounded at it's mere presence. Like, how did they do this? How did they build this spectacular city in a big wetlands without machines? Just be prepared for crowds, although you may be hitting the least crowded summer in decades, after, of course, last summer. And, as always, stay away from squares and tourist attractions when choosing a place to eat. The back streets of Venice have the best food. That's usually the rule for most any city in Italy.
If you have difficulty finding a place in Venice, stay in Padua, two train stops away. Padua is worth a few days on its own.

I didnt realize you were in the San Juans. Yeah, that would be silly, going from there to vacation in the Dolomites, although the Dolomites are spectacular. Save it for a ski trip.

One thing you have to know about the Italian beach scene in summer - it's pretty highly regimented and organized for the Italian middle class. You're not going to be wandering remote beaches and hanging anywhere you want in most places. You're going to be renting a spot under an umbrella with hundreds of others, and eating junk food. Never been to the Amalfi, maybe it's not like that there, but, good luck on that.

[alpinevibes]

Was going to plug Slovenia more, along with Albania and Montenegro, but 2 days in Venice is good


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[old goat]

The Cinque Terra isn't really a beach scene like Benny describes, except for the one bigger town at the end (too lazy to look up the name) although there are certainly beaches. But it's not really the kind of place you go to lie in the sun all day.

Of all the places we've been in Italy Venice was the hardest place to find good food. Not that it's not there, just that it's too easy for the average tourist, which is what I consider myself, to find bad food. But it's Venice. Every traveler in the world should see it. Just not necessarily all at the same time. It's been a tourist trap for centuries for a reason.e

I've not been to the Dolomites, but if mountains are still an option, consider Courmayeur or one of the other little towns at the base of Mont Blanc. Massive glaciers, the massive south face of Mont Blanc (the little cliff band near the top is 2000 ft high). Hike a little of the Tour du Mont Blanc. Take a cable car up to the Mer de Glace. Mountains like you won't see in the US except for Alaska.

[claresdad]

A few from 2019. Three generations of family including my four year old piled into a van we rented near the Rome airport. Stayed in a multi-family house with 3 other families in some little town south of Rome and set off exploring. Amazing.

Somebody's wedding in Ravello:



Amalfi Coast



Somewhere south of Rome...

[Buster Highmen]

A few questions:

- is this a bad idea? Should we go to the Dolomites and see some huge mountains and hike to villages?!

It's hard to make a truly bad decision in Italy, but the Dolomites are awesome. The food, the lifts, the views, the booze. Did I mention the food?

We spent every day riding cable cars or gondolas and then doing basically traverses to some refugio where there was incredible cured meats, wines, weirdo local aqua vite, cheese, bread and espresso to die for. The espresso alone is worth it.

The San Juans are awesome in every regard and that's where we have a toehold. But the Dolomites are an entirely different deal with the geology alone. But it's the food and the scene is great. Plus it's cool in the mornings.

There's a huDge mtb scene there, rentals of all types and lots of people riding gondies with bikes and ripping dh.

I would make reservations.

[patxi]

Many good suggestions in this thread. You can't really go wrong with where you go in Italy. You will be able to enjoy yourself in any random corner. One of the best Italian meals I have had was at a truckstop somewhere near Piacenza. The best way to go is to not plan too much. Just take it as it comes and you will normally not be disappointed.

Lucca for a week: good idea. Plenty of options as a basecamp. If you have a car, it is better though. We stayed outside Lucca a few years back in Massaciuccoli. Managed daytrips to Florence, Pisa, Lucca and Cinqueterre. Cinqueterre was a longish day but not bad: drive to the train station in La Spezia. Take the train to Monterosso al Mare and hike back to Corniglia. Grab the train back to La Spezia.

Amalfi Coast area: lot's of options. We based ourselves in Sorrento a few years back and managed day trips to Pompeii, Vesuvio, Capri and Amalfi. Great hikes in the area (North end of Capri, Sentiero degli Dei above the Amalfi coast). This trip was completely with public transportation: buses, trains and boats. Expect to be warm so plan your days accordingly.

I normally don't book ahead but if you are going to count on setting up basecamps, it's not a bad idea. Plus, you are going right before the peak time in Italy. Hard to say how busy it will be this summer. We were in Verona/Venice last July and it was empty except for Italian tourists and the odd German or Dutch. In Milano a few weeks ago and it is definitely starting to pick up again.

You could do 2 days in Venice but I would get bored. Quick train out to Verona or Padova would be a good alternative.

[PNWbrit]

Greece sounds like a far better destination if the rest of the family want a beach vacation.

Italy is more awesomer in other regards though.

[old goat]

Back when we were younger we would go to Europe with few reservations, go where we wanted when we wanted. We always traveled in shoulder season and closer to the off season then to high season. We found that we spent a lot of time finding a place to stay although we were never skunked so we started planning our trips and booking ahead of time. We know ourselves well enough as travelers that we seem to stay the right amount of time in each place. (OK, we could have skipped Maastricht). I don't know if the kind of free and easy traveling we used to do is still possible, except maybe in the true off season. There really isn't a shoulder season any more, at least not in Western Europe. And my wife and kid nearly were skunked in Bratislava--happened to be during the World Hockey Championships.

Things have changed. Or we have.

Like Buster said--there are no mountains in the Western Hemisphere (of which I've personally experienced at most 1%) that compare to the Alps for food. Especially the Italian Alps.

[Benny Profane]

Two days in Venice would be boring?

[patxi]

Two days in Venice would be boring?

It really depends on your interests and point of view. If you are making a once-in-a lifetime, 2 week trip to Italy (no plans to ever return), then 2 days in Venice is worth it. I've been to Venice several times and enjoy it everytime. It is an extremely cool place and always a good experience. Just wandering around aimlessly with no agenda is normally how we approach it. Aside from my first visit (1998), I haven't looked at a guidebook for Venice. Sure, if you follow a guidebook and try to visit every last corner of the place, 2 days won't be sufficient.

At the same time, aside from our visit last summer, Venice is normally too busy and touristy for my tastes (all other visits have always been in the off season). One day is about all I can handle but I will definitely return for another dose.

[Benny Profane]

Well, yeah, I've only been there in off season, too, and can't imagine how awful summer seasons are with the crowds, although the high season tourists don't have to deal with the aqua alta, or the tidal flooding that puts San Marco and the square under a few feet of water, which happens late fall/winter.
It is one big Disney Historyland tourist trap, but everyone should see it before it's gone. Just try to avoid the Hard Rock cafe garbage and, yeah, hit the back streets. Take a vaperreto out to a few islands. Lord knows how long San Marco itself can survive when flooded like that every year.

[old goat]

The Jewish quarter of Venice is pretty quiet--especially on Yom Kippur, which by chance was the day we were there. Absolutely no one on the streets.

[skaredshtles]

<snip> Definitely take the train. And if I did have that second glass of wine I wouldn't drive.

This should be reiterated. When in Tuscany, plan to take the train/bus if you're leaving town. Because you're *definitely* going to want that 2nd (and 3rd, and probably 4th) glass of wine with dinner. And don't forget the aperitivo... and the digestivo...

Also - do the Dolomites if you can convince the crew. The Amalfi has the possibility of being hotter than Hades in July/August. NTTAWWT, I guess - you presumably will be on the coast/beach.

I'd counsel not trying to do *too* much - IME, Italy is best done slowly.

But when you go to Florence, have a sandwich here: https://goo.gl/maps/doet6Su2dM73srDa7

Get the lardo... mmm... lardo.

[Bronco]

My wife and daughter were nice enough to let me include a couple of these locations on a trip to Italy a few years ago. Kind of cool if you're into Alpinism history: http://www.messner-mountain-museum.it/en/

[schindlerpiste]

Taverna Nychthimeron:
My brother-in-law/sister-in-law's restaurant in Spetses, Greece. If you are there, the guy is a good cook and it is a great value

[old goat]

A German born friend of mine gets very upset when I point out that Messner is Italian. "But he's from Sud Tyrol. He's basically Austrian". Sorry Michael, but if you're from Italy you're Italian.

[plugboots]

So let me get an update here. You’re still going to Lucca for sure, right? Then why wouldn’t you stay in the area and visit Florence, Sienna, etc. if you’ve got to hit the coast, then just visit Pisa, do the stupid tourist pictures and go to the coast? Pick any place they’re all good


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[house]

Lots of good advice in here. If you want just one very specific activity recommendation, here’s my top Tuscany touristy tip-
https://www.viator.com/tours/Florenc...pAvD_BwE<br />

Stop in Florence on your way back to Venice to catch your flight and take this cooking class. I’ve done it twice over three stays in Florence. If your lazy/boozy family will be in tow, all the better. I appreciated it as a change of pace from the “check shit off the list” tourist mode I often get caught up in.


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[Tech Tonics]

Having a great trip, will do a photo dump and TR once we are back.

Quick update though: we spent a week in Tuscany, mostly around Lucca. Barga was awesome, so was Bagni di Lucca and a little town N. of Castlenuevo (Silica IIRC). The food and wine was amazing. Few tourists. Great hiking and vibes

Have been in Cinque Terre for a few days. Good scene but tons of tourists (locals say it’s 1/4 pre-covid which sounds bananas)

Question:
We will be in Venice for 1.5 days. Not a lot of time, I know. Suggestions? St. Marks, boat ride on a canal, getting lost wandering around.

Any restaurants to not miss?

We are staying in Cannaregio.

[fool]

Glad to hear, TT!

Re: Venice, I'm not sure your teenage kids would be into it, but we did a Rick Steeves walking (podcast) tour, which was 40mins. I enjoyed the history/perspective, especially since I'm not a huge history buff. It's simple, cheap, and quick to get a good overview of Venice. I think we listened to "The Grand Canal Cruise."

https://www.ricksteves.com/watch-rea...io-tours/italy

[Tech Tonics]

Glad to hear, TT!

Re: Venice, I'm not sure your teenage kids would be into it, but we did a Rick Steeves walking (podcast) tour, which was 40mins. I enjoyed the history/perspective, especially since I'm not a huge history buff. It's simple, cheap, and quick to get a good overview of Venice. I think we listened to "The Grand Canal Cruise."

https://www.ricksteves.com/watch-rea...io-tours/italy

Dude, those look great. Thanks

[skaredshtles]

Had good seafood at this place:

https://goo.gl/maps/kNdHkaP1B3Zem95QA

[Benny Profane]

Having a great trip, will do a photo dump and TR once we are back.

Quick update though: we spent a week in Tuscany, mostly around Lucca. Barga was awesome, so was Bagni di Lucca and a little town N. of Castlenuevo (Silica IIRC). The food and wine was amazing. Few tourists. Great hiking and vibes

Have been in Cinque Terre for a few days. Good scene but tons of tourists (locals say it’s 1/4 pre-covid which sounds bananas)

Question:
We will be in Venice for 1.5 days. Not a lot of time, I know. Suggestions? St. Marks, boat ride on a canal, getting lost wandering around.

Any restaurants to not miss?

We are staying in Cannaregio.

Of course you're going to walk into and around St. Mark's square, but, if I had just one to choose, I'd tour Doge's palace rather than the church.
Can't really recommend a place to eat, but, do not eat at the schlock tourist restaraunts near the Rialto bridge, and, well, the best I can place it, the avenue of restaraunts northeast of the train station, or, as you're exiting the train station, anything within a few blocks left. Pretty bad food and service in both.

Take the vaperretto for kicks.