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  1. #1
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    Stump under snow ruled inherent risk: Standish v. Jackson Hole Mountain Resort Corp

    Searched but didnt see any reference here.


    Couple sued Jackson for him hitting a stump under newly fallen snow.
    In January 2017, California residents Thomas Standish and his then-fiancée, Megan Keiter, traveled to Jackson Hole Mountain Resort as part of a "bucket list" ski trip. From January 8 through 10—the three days prior to Standish's arrival—Jackson Hole had received about 27 inches of new snow, and on the morning of January 11, Jackson Hole received an additional 18 inches of snow. Over these four days, the mid-mountain depth of the snow increased from 56 to 80 inches.[1]

    On January 11, the couple purchased ski passes for Jackson Hole. The backs of these "J Cards" bear language indicating that the pass-holder "acknowledges that participation in any and all winter recreation activities at [Jackson Hole], including . . . skiing . . . involves SUBSTANTIAL AND INHERENT RISKS, HAZARDS, AND DANGERS THAT MAY RESULT IN SERIOUS INJURY, DEATH or damages to property." Aplt. App. 41. The couple first skied a few groomed runs. They then ventured down an off-piste run near the Thunder Chairlift line, with Standish—the more experienced skier—leading the way. "Off-piste" is a term for a ski run or area that is ungroomed and left in its natural state. See Roberts v. Jackson Hole Mountain Resort Corp., 884 F.3d 967, 970 (10th Cir. 2018). About halfway down the mountain, Standish's right ski hit the top of a six-and-a-half-foot-tall tree stump that was covered with about two inches[2] of fresh snow. His ski came off on impact, and he broke multiple bones in his right leg.
    From here: https://www.sportico.com/law/analysi...it-1234630403/

    "In an opinion on behalf of a three-judge panel, 10th Circuit Chief Judge Timothy Tymkovich affirmed the ruling for Jackson Hole. He expressed sympathy for Standish, saying “his injuries from his accident were severe and painful.” But the judge didn’t see a viable case. “Everyone,” Judge Tymkovich wrote, “familiar with the sight of the intertwining runs of a ski area knows that cutting and otherwise managing trees is necessary for the runs’ creation and upkeep. The vast majority of ski-able terrain simply could not exist in the first instance without the ministrations of sawyers and forest managers.”


    Always a bit nervous these days some judge is going to rule the wrong way and skiing at resorts as we know it ends.

  2. #2
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    "From January 8 through 10—the three days prior to Standish's arrival—Jackson Hole had received about 27 inches of new snow, and on the morning of January 11, Jackson Hole received an additional 18 inches of snow. Over these four days, the mid-mountain depth of the snow increased from 56 to 80 inches"

    Sounds like epic conditions to me.
    what's orange and looks good on hippies?
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  3. #3
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    Stump under snow ruled inherent risk: Standish v. Jackson Hole Mountain Resort Corp

    They did leave that stump 6’ tall right next to a groomer like an asshole though. Agree with the legal decision but it’s not like he was in a glade.



  4. #4
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    well that is kinda sticking up like a sore thumb but it looks like maybe the tree broke off so they moved the tree and the stump got left

    but it is an inherent risk, if you wander around on a ski run with no snow there are inherent risks everywhere and its just not possible to remove them all

    we cut runs by dropping/ limbing/ leaving flat, having cut runs/run the crew I would tell them if you are ok with skiing over it or your family skiing over it then you did a good enough job

    if you aren't then process it somemore
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  5. #5
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    Looks like Jackson dodged a bullet here, as in typical ski resort fashion they half assed the shit out of something and this seems pretty negligent at face value. However, if the courts ruled in favor of the plantiffs here, the slippery slope would basically make anything but the tamest of green runs a massive liability for ski resorts across the country and would basically ruin skiing.
    Live Free or Die

  6. #6
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    "People suing ski areas should be shot"

    - I forget who

  7. #7
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    Agree with the decision that skiing is inherently dangerous, and came in here to say just that. But if that photo above is what this guy actually hit IMHO there is a bit a negligence there. Doesn’t exactly look like the tree just snapped there to me, more like they cut it at some point mid seasons past and never went back to finish the job.

    If he was in the woods, totally different take.


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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdironRider View Post
    Looks like Jackson dodged a bullet here, as in typical ski resort fashion they half assed the shit out of something and this seems pretty negligent at face value. However, if the courts ruled in favor of the plantiffs here, the slippery slope would basically make anything but the tamest of green runs a massive liability for ski resorts across the country and would basically ruin skiing.
    They’re not negligent or half assed. Wtf is wrong with you?


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  9. #9
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    As a consolation prize, he can still commiserate with the rest of us who didn't sue in Gimp Central.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    They’re not negligent or half assed. Wtf is wrong with you?


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    Playing devils advocate here because I’ve experienced this card played before. If JHMR did cut the stump like that one could posit that it was cut because it imposed a hazard of some kind. If JMHR recognized the hazard and failed to fully mitigate it then they could be held liable. If they never touched the tree and it just broke off like that, then they wouldn’t be held liable.

    We have gotten burned on that one before, so just sharing an experience.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    They’re not negligent or half assed. Wtf is wrong with you?


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I'd love for you to be my supervisor if that tree passes as a job well done to you. Easy street.

    Like I said, it would ruin skiing if they ruled the other way so settle down Francis.
    Live Free or Die

  12. #12
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    Who was the mag who got impaled by a branch while skiing in the trees in the last year or two?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Looking View Post
    "People suing ski areas should be shot"

    - Scott Schmidt
    There you go.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by east or bust View Post
    Playing devils advocate here because I’ve experienced this card played before. If JHMR did cut the stump like that one could posit that it was cut because it imposed a hazard of some kind. If JMHR recognized the hazard and failed to fully mitigate it then they could be held liable. If they never touched the tree and it just broke off like that, then they wouldn’t be held liable.

    We have gotten burned on that one before, so just sharing an experience.
    yup if the resort knew about and failed to mitigate a hazard of which they were aware

    i got a new oil pan out of the town on that concept

    that looks to me like a tree that fell and the stump got left, maybe the cat pushed the stem out of the way or it just got covered in snow, happens all the time
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by abraham View Post
    Who was the mag who got impaled by a branch while skiing in the trees in the last year or two?
    Dunno, but I only ski in full helmets now after taking a broken off branch above the ear wearing an old first gen boeri shorty on Ajax. raddam had to drive me to AVH for stitches.

  16. #16
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    Sheesh, tough crowd. Either that tree broke naturally like that, or it was cut down (likely because it was about to fall down) when the snowpack was at that level. There is no conceivable reason to cut it that high up (and it would be much more difficult than just cutting it at the bottom).

    Moot point anyhow, because: how is that broken/cut tree (it is not a stump) any more hazardous than any other tree on the edge of a run?

    100% bullshit lawsuit.

  17. #17
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    100% agreed that the lawsuit was bullshit and it's good that he lost.

    Also 100% agreed that cutting off the tree like that is severely half assed and poor form on Jackson's part. And Jackson's certainly not alone in that regard - I've seen plenty of ski areas leave janky timber in the middle of cut runs, oftentimes in kinda bad locations.

  18. #18
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    when does a tree become a stump
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdironRider View Post
    Looks like Jackson dodged a bullet here, as in typical ski resort fashion they half assed the shit out of something and this seems pretty negligent at face value. However, if the courts ruled in favor of the plantiffs here, the slippery slope would basically make anything but the tamest of green runs a massive liability for ski resorts across the country and would basically ruin skiing.
    Slippery slopes are what make skiing skiing.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    when does a tree become a stump

    When it goes on at least a five year run of ski films that inspired a generation of people to move west and go big

  21. #21
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    Guy should stay away from Montana Snowbowl

  22. #22
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    I hit a stump off the side of the trail this year and almost ate a tree. Didn't even occur to me to sue someone if I had gotten hurt. Sounds like they should have stuck to groomers.
    Also, the language of that article and that picture don't seem to line up to me.
    No longer stuck.

    Quote Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn View Post
    Just an uneducated guess.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    when does a tree become a stump
    Dead and cut lower than 2 feet

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    100% agreed that the lawsuit was bullshit and it's good that he lost.

    Also 100% agreed that cutting off the tree like that is severely half assed and poor form on Jackson's part. And Jackson's certainly not alone in that regard - I've seen plenty of ski areas leave janky timber in the middle of cut runs, oftentimes in kinda bad locations.
    This.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by skizix View Post
    Sheesh, tough crowd. Either that tree broke naturally like that, or it was cut down (likely because it was about to fall down) when the snowpack was at that level. There is no conceivable reason to cut it that high up (and it would be much more difficult than just cutting it at the bottom).

    Moot point anyhow, because: how is that broken/cut tree (it is not a stump) any more hazardous than any other tree on the edge of a run?

    100% bullshit lawsuit.
    Or countless boulders covered by snow.

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