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  1. #501
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    Sandy
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    14,040
    Quote Originally Posted by wooley12 View Post
    When he was 2, we put our kid into a "drown proofing" class that was being offered. Came in handy. When he was 5 he was with me a a few other adults on a small boat dock admiring the view. Someone say's "Where's the kid?" and we turned to see him looking up at us from the lake and "Grabbing The Wall" like he was taught. Holding onto a piling. We never heard the splash. Probably a Youtube that could show a parent how to teach and practice the move.
    Damn, glad that worked out. As a dad, I’m not sure what could scare me more. That’s a terrifying situation.
    "boobs just make the world better really" - Woodsy

  2. #502
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    8,401
    Jeezus. Horrifying.

    Quote Originally Posted by wooley12 View Post
    When he was 2, we put our kid into a "drown proofing" class that was being offered. Came in handy. When he was 5 he was with me a a few other adults on a small boat dock admiring the view. Someone say's "Where's the kid?" and we turned to see him looking up at us from the lake and "Grabbing The Wall" like he was taught. Holding onto a piling. We never heard the splash. Probably a Youtube that could show a parent how to teach and practice the move.
    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post
    If I lived in WA, Oft would be my realtor. Seriously.

  3. #503
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    19,811
    Quote Originally Posted by GiBo View Post
    Am I missing something here? I've never had a swim lesson in my life. I consider myself a pretty good swimmer. My kids, I just took into the pool, showed them some basics and they just swam. We have a pool, so that's a big advantage, but I never knew swim lessons were such a universal thing. To me, that'd be similar to bicycle riding lessons. I mean don't most kids just swim with floaties and supervision and kinda figure it out?
    How long can they tread water (float) without struggling?

    I see kids with floaters flailing their arms staring at the sky. It’s a bad way to learn. It’s survival, not just getting from the diving board to the ladder.

  4. #504
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    19,811
    Quote Originally Posted by ::: ::: View Post
    did that disguise the pee?
    I ran a commercial spa too. What is that foam?

  5. #505
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Where the climate suits my clothes.
    Posts
    5,601
    Double edged sword here: goggles that cover the nose.

    Helped all 3 of my kids get comfortable jumping in and swimming under water, but now they're all nose holders...

    We're working on it, and I'm trying to keep my ridicule to a minimum the best I can.

  6. #506
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Last Best City in the Last Best Place
    Posts
    7,269
    We made our kids suffer through the freezing cold early morning outdoor lessons at the public pool. Builds character.

  7. #507
    Join Date
    Dec 2021
    Posts
    249
    Swimming is a life skill. Mine all had to take swim lessons until they were confident enough to know that they could swim a long distance without panicking. They all chose to continue past that point but really, swimming is a life skill. It really should be taught in school. If you end up in the water unexpectedly, flailing around is just going to zap your energy.

  8. #508
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Back in SEA
    Posts
    9,657
    Seattle peeps get on a waiting list at one of the Summer Swim league pools, may through September, swim team starting at age 5… there ya go! About $1000 give or take for the summer. 8 north end pools and 8 south end. https://www.teamunify.com/TabGeneric...eam=reclssslwa

    Only downside is long waiting lists so hurry up and get your name on it!

  9. #509
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    In a van... down by the river
    Posts
    13,647
    Quote Originally Posted by yeahman View Post
    We made our kids suffer through the freezing cold early morning outdoor lessons at the public pool. Builds character.
    That's good parenting right there.

  10. #510
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    11,736

    Fatherhood anonymous; an open discussion on being a dad.

    My father was from Hawaii so me and my brothers all got tossed in the ocean. It was probably my earliest memory, and not an especially good one but I learned to absolutely love the water. I’d rather save the money but I’d prefer for the kids to have a healthy respect and foundation, so we marched them around to lessons but after a season or two, you just let them loose on the pool with supervision and they will take it from there. Hell, my seven year old was swimming out to the floating dock this summer with no jacket.

    Now if I could only get my Polish speaking wife to speak Polish to my girls so I don’t have to pay for Polish lessons, I’d be a happy man.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  11. #511
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    I can still smell Poutine.
    Posts
    24,504
    Quote Originally Posted by skaredshtles View Post
    That's good parenting right there.
    My parents did that to me, except it was a "lake". I did that to my kids. They at least were in a pool. The younger two also did the outdoor summer swim team for a while. They had practice even earlier in the morning than the lessons.

    However, our kids also benefitted from a variety of programs at the indoor pool. I think there were some state or federal dollars for free programs for really young kids.

  12. #512
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    my own little world
    Posts
    5,838

    Fatherhood anonymous; an open discussion on being a dad.

    We lived on a lake when the kids were young (and just moved into a house with a pool over the summer) so prioritized swim lessons for our older two when they were younger. Gave them something to do during the winter months and they’re damned good swimmers.

    My youngest didn’t get lessons and it shows. She can dog paddle but she doesn’t turn into a fish in the water like the other two. It’s false to imagine that being able to swim and not being at risk of drowning are the same thing, but I watch my youngest like a hawk when she’s in the pool and I really don’t worry a lot about the other two, even when they were younger.
    focus.

  13. #513
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Paper St. Soap Co.
    Posts
    3,303
    Anyone have experience with au pair and nanny? Our nanny had to go back to school and finding a new one that is a good fit has not been going well. I like the idea of getting the kids some exposure to someone from a different country(hopefully Spanish speaking), but not sure about someone living with us. Don't have a big house, but they could have own bedroom with shared with kids bathroom. We actually don't want a nanny with much experience(plus they want $35/hour, often cash). Located in San Diego.

  14. #514
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Ogden
    Posts
    9,103
    Quote Originally Posted by 406 View Post
    Anyone have experience with au pair and nanny? Our nanny had to go back to school and finding a new one that is a good fit has not been going well. I like the idea of getting the kids some exposure to someone from a different country(hopefully Spanish speaking), but not sure about someone living with us. Don't have a big house, but they could have own bedroom with shared with kids bathroom. We actually don't want a nanny with much experience(plus they want $35/hour, often cash). Located in San Diego.
    I'm going to open a private browser and do some research for you. Standby....

  15. #515
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    527
    We had 3 Au Pairs. 2 we liked and extended with us, 1 short timer was just ok. The main reason we went for it was even considering food and expenses it was cheaper than daycare.

    Living situation was no big deal for us and we always got along- but we are a very laid back family. Definitely set expectations and rules well before they arrive- we thought it was silly but we made a house handbook and was good to have it all in writing and let the girls ask questions etc. We had to move our youngest into our room which sucked but we made it work. Friends of our Au Pairs had lots of drama going on. I was hearing one side of the story, but it did not surprise me people were assholes to the 'help'.

    I think the 'cultural exchange experience' and 'be a part of a new loving family' thing gets oversold to both parties respectively a bit. For us one of the best parts was seeing/helping the Au Pairs grow and thrive in their new situation. One thing I do regret was not putting our youngest in preschool/structured situations while we had the AuPair- post COVID you can tell he is figuring all the social and emotional stuff later than his peers now- maybe just him though.

    It's a weird process- you do online dating essentially and they have these bizarre videos they were obviously coached on as they are all the same. Racism is allowed as you can block countries or regions and people will tell you all about where the horrible and best ones come from. But we were happy and would do it again.

    My neighbor gave me some advice I wish I had taken- pick the hottest one. Somehow my wife's choices never cracked the 6 barrier. The Mannys always get rave reviews and probably would be great if you have boys.

  16. #516
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    none
    Posts
    8,334

    Fatherhood anonymous; an open discussion on being a dad.

    Quote Originally Posted by 406 View Post
    Located in San Diego.
    My sister lived in Kensington and they always had one. They always went with the more matronly type that cooked and cleaned.
    Both of my nieces are now fluent in Spanish.

  17. #517
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by riser3 View Post
    My parents did that to me, except it was a "lake". I did that to my kids. They at least were in a pool. The younger two also did the outdoor summer swim team for a while. They had practice even earlier in the morning than the lessons.

    However, our kids also benefitted from a variety of programs at the indoor pool. I think there were some state or federal dollars for free programs for really young kids.
    Oh man, bringing back memories. I did all of my swim lessons in an outdoor pool to Bronze Medallion. My wife started off her swim lessons in Jumbo Lake in SK and froze..

    Kids have been in lessons since they were old enough and still are, my son starts Bronze Medallion in a few weeks. Gonna stop at Life Guard.. Good money too.

  18. #518
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Paper St. Soap Co.
    Posts
    3,303
    Thanks guys. Did you or Shredheads sister have a private bathroom for the au pairs?

  19. #519
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    527
    We did not have a separate bathroom, no car either but we are in the city. We were upfront and clear about everything on our interviews. Did not seem to be a big deal to the ones we were courting- you don't want a princess.

  20. #520
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Schruns
    Posts
    839
    Got 3: 5(g) - 4(g) - 9mo(b)

    Oh boy the first one freaked me the fuck out. I really struggled to come to grips with things over the first year. I was always there and playing, but it forced me to be less of a lazy POS and it worked. Just forced me to be better. Wish I had kids earlier for that reason.

    2nd one was only 21mo behind so that was a little quick, but I never got out of practice. Me and #1 were super fucking tight by that point, because my wife was useless the last month of her pregnancy. But gelled with the 2nd one quick. #1 was a cat, #2 was a dog, if you know what I mean.

    3rd has down syndrome, which we didn't know till half a day after he was born. He had a congenital heart issue which was misdiagnosed as something much more urgent so he spent the first week in Intensive Care even though he didn't need to. Two weeks in the hospital, open heart surgery at 3 months, 3 more weeks in the hospital. I would say a total nightmare but he's doing great now so I wouldn't say I got PTSD, but it was tough for a while.

    It was funny how the looming surgery turned out to be such a positive thing. Having a child diagnosed with down syndrome can make you think there's a mistake or something bad happened to "me". I was so scared he was going to die or be harmed by the surgery that I just took every second I could to focus on him. Get him smiling, get him talking, repeat. I have good kid play endurance, but it was a whole other level. I couldn't be distracted. I gave #1 10 kisses a day, #2 100 kisses a day, #3 got 10,000. And the threat of mortal danger made me pick a side of the fence. Did something bad happen to me, or did I just get a sweet baby? And it was clear that something good had happened. I love him the same as his sisters.

    I think most parents with a child with a disability take a while to come to grips with it. The surgery deadline pressure cooked that whole thing for me. Being at a children's hospital for a few weeks also puts things in perspective.

    Back to the nuts and bolts of this whole parenting thing:

    I'm USA, wife is Germany. We live in Austria. I've got a decent view from both sides. My wife made most of these calls.

    Sleeping: Babies nursed in bed with my wife. They still haven't left. I loved it from the start, although I did move out of the bed with #1 for a couple months on my choosing (light sleeping hadn't been beaten out of me). I didn't do shit at night unless somebody was sick. I was up early, then took the baby, wife could sleep in. I've always slept good, unless I choose not too. The girls will move into their own beds this Spring because they want to. I basically had my own bed as they all crowd up with mom. Can't complain.

    Baby nursing next to mom is a dad's best friend. Just be ready to let mom sleep in. I understand this is a contentious issue in the US, no one in my family supported it, but when no babies suffocated they STFU about it.

    Feeding: 100% breastfed, even #3 which given the surgery and down syndrome is rare and basically, no one in the medical establishment thought it was a remote possibility. My wife fought hard for this one, and it wouldn't have been possible if she didn't have the experience from before. The girls stopped around 2. We know people that have gone longer. Less of a big deal here, but not so common either.

    Work: Wife went on her 1 year mother break, then extended and then had another baby, then never went back, then had another. We have our european wellfare babies. I'm sole income, which is ironic, I'm a college dropout (go Utes) and she's got a masters. I always worked from home and #1 forced me to stop being lazy there too, slowly, I was making enough to support a family.

    Sports: Round 1 was hard. I had a bit of crisis and decided I should do freeride competitions. I didn't ski much at all that season so I was super out of shape and wasted all my time traveling, and sucking, but whatever. After I had a nervous breakdown (work, kid, tired), then I started going on long walks with #1. 2,3,4,5 hours I built it up. The longer I could keep her away from mom. I just carried her in my arms, or she slept in the carrier. When she was 1 we move to a little ski town and I got hiking with her daily. Lots of vert. I got a few ski days in when #2 came on Dec 31, then I was a little screwed. I could get out when both of them were sleeping for like 2 hours door to door. Then not at all sometimes. Then I started hiking with both. 3mo in the carrier and almost 2yo in my arms, switching sides. I would just look up at epic spines, cry inside, then plow up the hills out of desperation. I got fucking jacked. We'd go 6 days a week.

    This really saved me and got me through those "I don't want to play with the kids" times because I was kinda doing what I wanted, but I was doing my part and my wife had free time. I almost forget how psycho I would be sometimes. I had to cut the girls off and let them walk on there own, so the hiking mellowed, but I was allowed more solo free time. A couple of hours a day. Running, skateboarding, skiing. Doing something is key, then I can sit down and play barbies for 3 hours.

    Luckily #3 was stable by the time this winter started, but now my wife's saying it's her turn to go today! I drop my daughter off at kindergarten, then can ski for 1.5 hours, then do some work, then give my wife a few hours to ski or do whatever and I finish up work in the evening. She recreates less than me, gives more than me, and so I'm very thankful for that. I'm skiing as good as I was when I was 23 (35 now).

    I would say I'm more around my kids than your average full-time working dad, because I work from home and have a super flexible schedule. The more time I spend with the kids, the more I like them, the less I spend, the more their BS gets to me. If you can't sit for 2 hours and play with your kids (when you have time) then you've gotta ask yourself, "why?" Everybody has a different answer, but that answer is important to your relationship with your kids. They're skiing and I'll train them how to do mountain stuff, but I want to spend time with them outside of that stuff as well.

    When you split them up they are easy, the girls together skiing is fun as hell now. And just having the baby is super fucking easy at this point. What initially makes that stuff hard is paying attention. You just wanna be somewhere else so it's tough, simple as that. Babies cry, bounce them. Can you bounce them for 20 minutes? Yes, you can.

    If I pay attention I realize that it's more fun and rewarding than anything. Just this morning I had to give up a powder day as I had the girls, so I skied with them and had a blast. I could have even left them with Granny who's visited, but I just manned up and played with my kids.

    Even while not skiing, If I don't pretend I need to be doing other things we have tons of fun.

    It's hard being a dad, but now I'm way less nervous or less often wishing I was somewhere else. A big part of that is doing something I find satisfying personally and doing a little of that. We're all humans and need to have our fun. No one gives a flying fuck about my kickflip, but a good one will get me through the day.

    As far as #3, he's doing great and we don't do anything different with him, so I'm sure he'll be out there skiing soon enough. He might be around forever, or he might find his wings, things are a lot different in the information age so we're not gonna limit him. Maybe empty nests are overrated!

  21. #521
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    108
    Your a badass papa Jrainey.

  22. #522
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Making the Bowl Great Again
    Posts
    13,779
    Seriously.

  23. #523
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Schruns
    Posts
    839
    Forgot to mention, my wife was an Au Pair, and my neighbor in the SL,UT. I sussed out if she'd be a good mom I guess...

  24. #524
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Ellensburg
    Posts
    1,236
    Quote Originally Posted by JRainey View Post
    Got 3: 5(g) - 4(g) - 9mo(b)

    Oh boy the first one freaked me the fuck out. I really struggled to come to grips with things over the first year. I was always there and playing, but it forced me to be less of a lazy POS and it worked. Just forced me to be better. Wish I had kids earlier for that reason.

    2nd one was only 21mo behind so that was a little quick, but I never got out of practice. Me and #1 were super fucking tight by that point, because my wife was useless the last month of her pregnancy. But gelled with the 2nd one quick. #1 was a cat, #2 was a dog, if you know what I mean.

    3rd has down syndrome, which we didn't know till half a day after he was born. He had a congenital heart issue which was misdiagnosed as something much more urgent so he spent the first week in Intensive Care even though he didn't need to. Two weeks in the hospital, open heart surgery at 3 months, 3 more weeks in the hospital. I would say a total nightmare but he's doing great now so I wouldn't say I got PTSD, but it was tough for a while.

    It was funny how the looming surgery turned out to be such a positive thing. Having a child diagnosed with down syndrome can make you think there's a mistake or something bad happened to "me". I was so scared he was going to die or be harmed by the surgery that I just took every second I could to focus on him. Get him smiling, get him talking, repeat. I have good kid play endurance, but it was a whole other level. I couldn't be distracted. I gave #1 10 kisses a day, #2 100 kisses a day, #3 got 10,000. And the threat of mortal danger made me pick a side of the fence. Did something bad happen to me, or did I just get a sweet baby? And it was clear that something good had happened. I love him the same as his sisters.

    I think most parents with a child with a disability take a while to come to grips with it. The surgery deadline pressure cooked that whole thing for me. Being at a children's hospital for a few weeks also puts things in perspective.

    Back to the nuts and bolts of this whole parenting thing:

    I'm USA, wife is Germany. We live in Austria. I've got a decent view from both sides. My wife made most of these calls.

    Sleeping: Babies nursed in bed with my wife. They still haven't left. I loved it from the start, although I did move out of the bed with #1 for a couple months on my choosing (light sleeping hadn't been beaten out of me). I didn't do shit at night unless somebody was sick. I was up early, then took the baby, wife could sleep in. I've always slept good, unless I choose not too. The girls will move into their own beds this Spring because they want to. I basically had my own bed as they all crowd up with mom. Can't complain.

    Baby nursing next to mom is a dad's best friend. Just be ready to let mom sleep in. I understand this is a contentious issue in the US, no one in my family supported it, but when no babies suffocated they STFU about it.

    Feeding: 100% breastfed, even #3 which given the surgery and down syndrome is rare and basically, no one in the medical establishment thought it was a remote possibility. My wife fought hard for this one, and it wouldn't have been possible if she didn't have the experience from before. The girls stopped around 2. We know people that have gone longer. Less of a big deal here, but not so common either.

    Work: Wife went on her 1 year mother break, then extended and then had another baby, then never went back, then had another. We have our european wellfare babies. I'm sole income, which is ironic, I'm a college dropout (go Utes) and she's got a masters. I always worked from home and #1 forced me to stop being lazy there too, slowly, I was making enough to support a family.

    Sports: Round 1 was hard. I had a bit of crisis and decided I should do freeride competitions. I didn't ski much at all that season so I was super out of shape and wasted all my time traveling, and sucking, but whatever. After I had a nervous breakdown (work, kid, tired), then I started going on long walks with #1. 2,3,4,5 hours I built it up. The longer I could keep her away from mom. I just carried her in my arms, or she slept in the carrier. When she was 1 we move to a little ski town and I got hiking with her daily. Lots of vert. I got a few ski days in when #2 came on Dec 31, then I was a little screwed. I could get out when both of them were sleeping for like 2 hours door to door. Then not at all sometimes. Then I started hiking with both. 3mo in the carrier and almost 2yo in my arms, switching sides. I would just look up at epic spines, cry inside, then plow up the hills out of desperation. I got fucking jacked. We'd go 6 days a week.

    This really saved me and got me through those "I don't want to play with the kids" times because I was kinda doing what I wanted, but I was doing my part and my wife had free time. I almost forget how psycho I would be sometimes. I had to cut the girls off and let them walk on there own, so the hiking mellowed, but I was allowed more solo free time. A couple of hours a day. Running, skateboarding, skiing. Doing something is key, then I can sit down and play barbies for 3 hours.

    Luckily #3 was stable by the time this winter started, but now my wife's saying it's her turn to go today! I drop my daughter off at kindergarten, then can ski for 1.5 hours, then do some work, then give my wife a few hours to ski or do whatever and I finish up work in the evening. She recreates less than me, gives more than me, and so I'm very thankful for that. I'm skiing as good as I was when I was 23 (35 now).

    I would say I'm more around my kids than your average full-time working dad, because I work from home and have a super flexible schedule. The more time I spend with the kids, the more I like them, the less I spend, the more their BS gets to me. If you can't sit for 2 hours and play with your kids (when you have time) then you've gotta ask yourself, "why?" Everybody has a different answer, but that answer is important to your relationship with your kids. They're skiing and I'll train them how to do mountain stuff, but I want to spend time with them outside of that stuff as well.

    When you split them up they are easy, the girls together skiing is fun as hell now. And just having the baby is super fucking easy at this point. What initially makes that stuff hard is paying attention. You just wanna be somewhere else so it's tough, simple as that. Babies cry, bounce them. Can you bounce them for 20 minutes? Yes, you can.

    If I pay attention I realize that it's more fun and rewarding than anything. Just this morning I had to give up a powder day as I had the girls, so I skied with them and had a blast. I could have even left them with Granny who's visited, but I just manned up and played with my kids.

    Even while not skiing, If I don't pretend I need to be doing other things we have tons of fun.

    It's hard being a dad, but now I'm way less nervous or less often wishing I was somewhere else. A big part of that is doing something I find satisfying personally and doing a little of that. We're all humans and need to have our fun. No one gives a flying fuck about my kickflip, but a good one will get me through the day.

    As far as #3, he's doing great and we don't do anything different with him, so I'm sure he'll be out there skiing soon enough. He might be around forever, or he might find his wings, things are a lot different in the information age so we're not gonna limit him. Maybe empty nests are overrated!
    Damn. I really enjoyed reading this and super appreciate your insight and mindset. Our baby girl is 13mo, and we are working on the second. I'm way more nervous about having two than I was about one, but now I'm imagining backpack baby (she's all about it atm) plus arm baby on the local trails and that is something for me to look forward to. Love giving mama that time off.

    I very much relate to what you said about the initial difficulty coming from having to pay attention. There were a lot of habits to rewire in the beginning, and that was not easy or fun. We're having a whole lot more fun now.

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

  25. #525
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    5,351
    JRainey what I took away from that is that I need to move to a ski town in Austria stat so that I can get a year of parental leave and ski in 2 hours door-to-door

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