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  1. #76
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    Not sure I want to live in a world where the seller is 100% responsible for whatever delivery shit show the buyer has.

    If I live in a frat house with 18 bros and I order a pizza and it’s delivered when I’m in the bathroom manscaping and my bro’s munch it and don’t tell me, does Dominoes owe me my money back?


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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by AK47bp View Post

    If I live in a frat house with 18 bros and I order a pizza and it’s delivered when I’m in the bathroom manscaping and my bro’s munch it and don’t tell me, does Dominoes owe me my money back?


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  3. #78
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    Apr 2006
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    On the other side I have had buyers say they don’t want signature and take risk. If they won’t accept risk I get insurance on high value and signature for protection.

    TGR is a buyers dream and everything I have sold and bought worked except one. He claimed he did not get package and I had to eat it. This was a log time ago. I also got so many great purchases over the years it really was in the noise.

    Main thing is communication and clear rules on the sale so that if they are met it’s done. This is one mags opinion


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    I need to go to Utah.
    Utah?
    Yeah, Utah. It's wedged in between Wyoming and Nevada. You've seen pictures of it, right?

    So after 15 years we finally made it to Utah.....


    Thanks BCSAR and POWMOW Ski Patrol for rescues

    8, 17, 13, 18, 16, 18, 20, 19, 16, 24, 32, 35

    2021/2022 (13/15)

  4. #79
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    Mar 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    Ah, I got a feeling when something sells here it’s “$____ shipped” or “$_____ +ship”. That’s whatcha get. I don’t tie my sales to the independent actions of 3rd parties. If a buyer wants something in their hands when they hand over money they can go to REI and pay rack rate. That’s not a reasonable system here. On numerous occasions I’ve used the buyers preferred handling company- sometimes the buyer even provides the shipping label. Listing says shipped, not delivered. Words have meanings.
    Quoted for the ultimate truth and I wish we could sticky a single post.

    $__/shipped = it will be shipped at lowest cost across all possible shipping options, unless the buyer requests something specifically. Which has happened to me and I've then adjusted the price accordingly. To think otherwise is not reality, nor should it be expected.

    Maybe the end game in this convo here is to not list things as $__/shipped and start listing as $__/+shipping. Then work out with the buyer as to what they want, cheap ass shipping or all the tracking bells and whistles with the tiptop best ever shipping company's. Or have the buyer handle shipping, which I have also done and is actually the smoothest. Open attachment, print, drop off, done.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soups View Post
    Quoted for the ultimate truth and I wish we could sticky a single post.

    $__/shipped = it will be shipped at lowest cost across all possible shipping options, unless the buyer requests something specifically. Which has happened to me and I've then adjusted the price accordingly. To think otherwise is not reality, nor should it be expected.

    Maybe the end game in this convo here is to not list things as $__/shipped and start listing as $__/+shipping. Then work out with the buyer as to what they want, cheap ass shipping or all the tracking bells and whistles with the tiptop best ever shipping company's. Or have the buyer handle shipping, which I have also done and is actually the smoothest. Open attachment, print, drop off, done.
    For real - as we move into solutions in this thread - this is the solution.

    I have shipped skis here extensively with UPS and USPS. Never FedEx (for convenience reasons).

    UPS I did for a while while I could ship from work and that was my best deal. For a pleb, USPS had the best prices - wasn’t that long ago I could get flat skis across the country for $20-25.

    Now USPS and UPS are about the same. But with the ease and convenience of UPS (at least where I am) with making labels, a local UPS store or home pick up, I’ve only been shipping skis with them.

    Id be all for the new norm as all sales +ship, and buyer provides ship label. They can fill out the deets, get whatever protection they want, and helps to get it out the door faster. It is crazy tho that in an unspoken way we are all transacting hundreds of bucks in goods and then letting someone else decide exactly how we get our stuff. Really ripe for situations like this.

    This makes a shit ton of sense. I will be doing it this way from now on.

  6. #81
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    Dec 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    Id be all for the new norm as all sales +ship, and buyer provides ship label. They can fill out the deets, get whatever protection they want, and helps to get it out the door faster. It is crazy tho that in an unspoken way we are all transacting hundreds of bucks in goods and then letting someone else decide exactly how we get our stuff. Really ripe for situations like this.

    This makes a shit ton of sense. I will be doing it this way from now on.
    Honestly, I really like this idea too. I'm probably also going to do this.
    I've always charged my buyers actual shipping costs (and thanks to Amazon and others making free shipping the standard for commercial businesses, most people are cheap fucks when it comes to shipping). So that means -
    -price stays the same
    -buyer gets to see what it actually costs
    -buyer has the power to submit a claim if there's a problem
    -buyer can pick the options they actually want need
    -it's on the buyer to spell their address correctly
    -all I gotta do is print the label, tape it on, and drop it off. Easy.

  7. #82
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    Mar 2008
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    Aloft
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    Yep. Think I'm doing this going forward. They'll also for sure have the tracking number and I won't have to rely on my own dumbass to keep it.

  8. #83
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    Dec 2007
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    Denver
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    Is the seller going to chime in with his side of the story?

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    Ah, I got a feeling when something sells here it’s “$____ shipped” or “$_____ +ship”. That’s whatcha get. I don’t tie my sales to the independent actions of 3rd parties. If a buyer wants something in their hands when they hand over money they can go to REI and pay rack rate. That’s not a reasonable system here. On numerous occasions I’ve used the buyers preferred handling company- sometimes the buyer even provides the shipping label. Listing says shipped, not delivered. Words have meanings.
    As I stated buyers can arrange shipping and it's all on them. "Words have meanings" but they can be interpreted in different ways unless there is discussion beforehand.

    "$____shipped, buyer bears all risk of loss in transit" is certainly clear to all, but "$____shipped" is not. It's a matter of actually putting words together that can only have one meaning.

  10. #85
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    Feb 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    What do you mean? How is the seller out anything here?
    You are right. I'll walk.
    Is it radix panax notoginseng? - splat
    This is like hanging yourself but the rope breaks. - DTM
    Dude Listen to mtm. He's a marriage counselor at burning man. - subtle plague

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner View Post
    As I stated buyers can arrange shipping and it's all on them. "Words have meanings" but they can be interpreted in different ways unless there is discussion beforehand.

    "$____shipped, buyer bears all risk of loss in transit" is certainly clear to all, but "$____shipped" is not. It's a matter of actually putting words together that can only have one meaning.
    Huh?

    Interpret “shipped” beyond “I as the seller am going to pack and ship these to you”

    If I ship skis, and for whatever reason they never get to you, I’ve shipped the skis. Now If I fuck up and send it to the wrong place, I’ve shipped the skis but not to the buyer- so I guess you can read that in. But whatever interpretation you are reading in that mandates my responsibility is to get the package into your hands is preposterous, not at all reasonable, and is not the controlling standard on GS, nor should it be.

    Even more reason to create the new standard that buyer procures and emails paid ship label, to not have to be faced with insane expectations like this.

  12. #87
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    Feb 2018
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    Salt Lake City
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    OP, what kind of helmet were you buying?
    I have 3 that aren’t being used and will send your way if you want one.
    I have a Smith (L) in white, POC (XL-XXL) in white, and an Atomic (XL) in black.
    I am currently using an Oakley MOD1 (L) in blue and am ready to replace it.
    Let me know.

  13. #88
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    Hence why no one ever has ever posted "$__/delivered"

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    Huh?

    Interpret “shipped” beyond “I as the seller am going to pack and ship these to you”

    If I ship skis, and for whatever reason they never get to you, I’ve shipped the skis. Now If I fuck up and send it to the wrong place, I’ve shipped the skis but not to the buyer- so I guess you can read that in. But whatever interpretation you are reading in that mandates my responsibility is to get the package into your hands is preposterous, not at all reasonable, and is not the controlling standard on GS, nor should it be.

    Even more reason to create the new standard that buyer procures and emails paid ship label, to not have to be faced with insane expectations like this.

    Really not sure what your arguing about. If you've read the entire thread I have backed the SELLER in this case(other than reneging on the $40, which he should never have offered to begin with.)


    I say now for the 3rd time, let the buyer arrange shipping - it's all on them.


    Where did I say anything about "mandates my responsibility is to get the package into your hands"?


    Please point me to the "controlling standard." I'd like to read it.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner View Post
    "Words have meanings" but they can be interpreted in different ways unless there is discussion beforehand.

    "$____shipped, buyer bears all risk of loss in transit" is certainly clear to all, but "$____shipped" is not. It's a matter of actually putting words together that can only have one meaning.
    Here. I’ve pointed you to where you said the stupid things.

    "$____shipped" only has one meaning: “buyer pays this amount and the skis get shipped to their chosen location.”

    I don’t think we are in disagreement about the outcome of the OPs transaction. Nor about the best way to do things moving forward: buyer arranging shipping.

    But if you need me to direct you to the operational standard of GS transactions you demonstrate clearly your three month presence here. I’ve probably completed hundreds of transactions here, 90% as seller. Nobody has ever taken such a strained and unnatural interpretation of “shipped”. Just sayin man, “shipped” is not ambiguous.

  16. #91
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    Clearly the OP is butthurt about the loss of his package so the "GS operational standards" don't seem to mean anything because he still thinks Seller is somehow at least partly responsible.

    When you write "shipped", I understand that as "cost of goods and cost of shipping, buyer bears all responsibility for damage and loss in transit" that's all anyone needs to know about how you and perhaps others sell and that's fine.

  17. #92
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    Jul 2008
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    3,673
    I have nothing to add except to say USPS has been a hot dumpster fuck of poop since about September 1 of 2020.

    Carry on.

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by volklpowdermaniac View Post
    I have nothing to add except to say USPS has been a hot dumpster fuck of poop since about September 1 of 2020.

    Carry on.
    FedEx is no better. I’ve had a pair of blizzard bodacious sitting in Memphis since the 19th. They promise I’ll see them this week... fuck shippers.

  19. #94
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    Jul 2004
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    Who's "at fault"? It's the thief who accessed the OP's shared mailroom.

    OP seeks a solution: OK, make a reasonable effort to prevent a theft beforehand.

    1) Buyers can take responsibility and make an effort to provide a secure address to the Seller.
    A shared mailroom can be risky for theft, even in a snobby upscale apartment building.

    You don't need to pay for a UPS mailbox in order to use their secure holding service (at least the last time I checked, years ago). Buyer can ask Seller to use UPS to ship to the Buyer's sketchy mailroom address, but while package is in transit, Buyer can use web to "redirect" the package to be held at the nearest UPS Store/Location. After tracking info indicates the package arrived at the UPS Store, then Buyer can go pick it up at his/her convenience. Thieves can't get it there, need ID/driver license or whatever.

    2) Buyers can take responsibility and make an effort to check tracking status every day, even on the early days---just in case the package arrives early.

    3) Sellers can resist the urge to resort to Radio Silence. Radio Silence usually makes things worse, and tends to drive the other party to seek a 2nd opinion or post a public thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    ...If I ship skis, and for whatever reason they never get to you, I’ve shipped the skis. Now If I fuck up and send it to the wrong place, I’ve shipped the skis but not to the buyer- so I guess you can read that in...
    IMO, Seller is not 100% done right after giving the box to the shipping company, unless Seller explicitly states that in advance. "Official" TGR Gear Swap guidelines for Sellers includes stuff like:
    "The seller is responsible for packaging and shipping the item so that they arrive in the same condition in that they were sold."
    See https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...SELL-READ-THIS

    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    ...Even more reason to create the new standard that buyer procures and emails paid ship label, to not have to be faced with insane expectations like this.
    I like that idea, but does USPS reject prepaid labels for a 198cm box of skis? Whenever I go to USPS to let them weigh/measure it and generate the label, they give me a hard time and say "There's no way we can ship a long box like that"...until I finally convince them to just measure and weigh it and give the computer a chance to approve me (and then the computer approves me EVERY time). I've never tried a pre-paid label, but I suspect the USPS workers won't believe it until they measure it themselves and see if the computer approves it---at which point they'll probably just generate the new label that they trust is accurate, right? Or no?

    .
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  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vitamin I View Post



    IMO, Seller is not 100% done right after giving the box to the shipping company, unless Seller explicitly states that in advance. "Official" TGR Gear Swap guidelines for Sellers includes stuff like:
    "The seller is responsible for packaging and shipping the item so that they arrive in the same condition in that they were sold."
    See https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...SELL-READ-THIS



    I like that idea, but does USPS reject prepaid labels for a 198cm box of skis? Whenever I go to USPS to let them weigh/measure it and generate the label, they give me a hard time and say "There's no way we can ship a long box like that"...until I finally convince them to just measure and weigh it and give the computer a chance to approve me (and then the computer approves me EVERY time). I've never tried a pre-paid label, but I suspect the USPS workers won't believe it until they measure it themselves and see if the computer approves it---at which point they'll probably just generate the new label that they trust is accurate, right? Or no?

    .
    I’m gonna nitpick out the official guidelines. But to start, yes the seller has the responsibility to reasonably package the product. Slapping a label and tape on some Lotus 138s is not reasonable packing- so you can read into “shipped” that it’ll be in a box.

    Where the rubber meets the road on adjudicating damaged goods is if the box shows up pristine and the skis are damaged in transit -> sellers fault. If the box shows up damaged, and skis are damaged -> handling company’s fault.

    So I disagree in the sense that the seller is done at drop off only insofar as he has verifiably upheld his end of the bargain. If you order skis and only one ski was ever put in the box, or the skis are demonstrably not as advertised, seller is most assuredly not 100% done. Same can be said for the skis getting damaged in transit due to a CLEARLY SUBSTANDARD packing job. The seller is not responsible for any and all damages in transit and the language of the sticky is flawed in this regard.


    As for USPS I have never made a prepaid label with them and I won’t because they are as much or more expensive than UPS for ski boxes. If it isn’t a FRB or a tiny box shipped locally or illicit drugs I am going to UPS- where prepaid labels for me have been a game changer making ski shipping so easy.

    Any label generation made by buyer must be done in conjunction with the seller so they can input dimensions/weight. If the buyer needs to have sent via USPS due to PO Box Stuff (or whatever) the buyer can request the seller to ship and make requests for insurance etc accordingly. This is more information to communicate and more work/risk for both parties, but that happens sometimes. The buyer generating the label - to me - seems like a better SOP that just like anything in life will never cover 100% of circumstances perfectly, but is a big improvement in protection and responsibility over the current SOP.

  21. #96
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    Oct 2008
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    Jesus what a stupid thread. Never had any problems here with GS transactions. Done several different ways with UPS, USPS and FedEx.

    The buyer had his package stolen after delivery. End of story, seller has no responsibility here.


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  22. #97
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    Jan 2009
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    Park City
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    I sold a pair of boots to a low post dude. I said $x for shipping he said great, lll pay that when they arrive.

    No fucking way. No one allows shipping after goods are delivered. This was a mystery to him but he paid shipping and I sent the boots. And stopped selling to low post jongs


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    I rip the groomed on tele gear

  23. #98
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    Oct 2005
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    Idaho
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    Depending on the buyer, I'll ship and get paid for everything or charge actual shipping after it's shipped. Some folks I won't.

  24. #99
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    Nov 2006
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    kinda halfway twixt NH & CO
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    this is the new powderskirt

  25. #100
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    Nov 2018
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    750
    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    Jesus what a stupid thread. Never had any problems here with GS transactions. Done several different ways with UPS, USPS and FedEx.

    The buyer had his package stolen after delivery. End of story, seller has no responsibility here.


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    yup. amazing that the thread has continued so long - this seems pretty obvious

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