Social Media and Avalanche Incidents

**stealurface831** · 02-17-2021, 11:05 AM

https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ent_Weak_Layer

I am writing a research paper on the topic of social media use and risk tolerance in avy terrain and came across this article. With everything that has happened lately and the paper's due date creeping up, I figured it would be interesting to hear some discussion from mags on the heuristic traps of social media and how that applies to our risk tolerances, specifically power posing.

I'm not positing that social media has been all bad for bc travelers. I think the platforms have allowed information on awareness and education to reach many. But that is essentially what i am trying to answer. Does that good outweigh the bad?

**Bunion 2020** · 02-17-2021, 11:09 AM

https://arc.lib.montana.edu/snow-sci...W16_O10.02.pdf

Have fun, get a B

**stealurface831** · 02-17-2021, 11:13 AM

Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

https://arc.lib.montana.edu/snow-sci...W16_O10.02.pdf

Have fun, get a B

already got that one in the quiver. i've already scoured the internet pretty thoroughly for sources. i'm really looking to hear what each of you thinks.

**skifishbum** · 02-17-2021, 11:20 AM

i think if ya show up with a gram
ill help smoke it in an instant
and mother nature gives 0 fucks

**Foggy_Goggles** · 02-17-2021, 11:23 AM

Have fun, get a B

That's pretty good life advice! I think it was you who talked about "pulling the blinds" to avoid sidecountry looking at 9990 while patrolling. I think about that all the time whether it is other people's actions in avalanche terrain or just the world making in anxious.

**stealurface831** · 02-17-2021, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by skifishbum

i think if ya show up with a gram
ill help smoke it in an instant
and mother nature gives 0 fucks

i'll smoke ya out one day, sfb.

**MTT** · 02-17-2021, 11:48 AM

My social media reach is very narrow, but based on what I see here on TGR. The people who tour alot and post trip reports.
They seem to be very responsible. Not much daredevil look at me stuff. I think if someone posted evidence of doing stupid dangerous shit. The would be piled on by the others here. It would be humiliating not the attaboys they want.

**TahoeJ** · 02-17-2021, 11:50 AM

People wanting to get rad on days when they should probably be meadow skipping is definitely a thing. Gotta get that sick footy for the gram, right?

**Bunion 2020** · 02-17-2021, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

That's pretty good life advice! I think it was you who talked about "pulling the blinds" to avoid sidecountry looking at 9990 while patrolling. I think about that all the time whether it is other people's actions in avalanche terrain or just the world making in anxious.

Twas not me who pulled the blinds, that was ex-coworkers who elected to remain in Utah after we all got fired from PCMR. They went to the Wolf, I went to the Big.

**muted** · 02-17-2021, 11:58 AM

We are all too old to comment on how social influence works. I can read an article and understand it, sure, but I think you need to ask a social influencer or ski pro that is under 30 and lives this shit every day. I'm sure a few influencers have discussed things like that over beers, and I'm sure some sponsors have set up guidelines for their pros, and probably avie professionals have discussed what can and can not be posted during high avie days to avoid giving people the wrong impression. So hit those type of people up.

**mtnjam** · 02-17-2021, 12:01 PM

AAA just had a really good Zoom meeting last Wednesday night about this very topic. I don't see the meeting posted anywhere on YouTube from the AAA channel or from the Sawtooth Avalanche Center's social media page yet either, but I bet if you sent an email to Amy at media@sawtoothavalanche.com she could get you in contact where you could view that.
Good discussion from Tom Nichols in that meeting also. Look him up if you don't know who he is.

**Core Shot** · 02-18-2021, 12:44 AM

Ironically, the one time I almost died in an avy was the time we waited in the smoke shack for the rest of the party to arrive.

Judgment may have been hazy.

No social media was present.
Ymmv

But interesting idea about social bro brah stoke as a heuristic. Kodak courage was the old name for that.

**MakersTeleMark** · 02-18-2021, 01:45 AM

6:05pm Social Media and Decision Making in Avalanche Terrain.
- Presented by Jerry Isaak, Chair of Expeditionary Studies, Plattsburgh University

https://us02web.zoom.us/webinar/regi...RM6xn8yeiOzhNg

It's $7 live tomorrow. Probably required viewing for your paper.

**powdork** · 02-18-2021, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by Core Shot

But interesting idea about social bro brah stoke as a heuristic. Kodak courage was the old name for that.

It was a heuristic, but as I remember that was specific to going big and more often than not inbounds rather than what we're seeing today which is being in the wrong place in hazardous conditions. I think the way we gather the content plays a role too. If there was no social media, the ease and pervasiveness of helmet cams, iphones, drones would cause the same effect.
In my argument social media started with web 2.0 which is post-TGR

**whipski** · 02-18-2021, 08:09 AM

‘Staying alive in avalanche terrain probably
has more to do with mastering yourself than mastering any knowledge of avalanches’” (Tremper,

Maybe your paper should be titled, Social Media, Dick Waving and Avalanche Incidents

**doebedoe** · 02-18-2021, 08:11 AM

Originally Posted by skifishbum

i think if ya show up with a gram
ill help smoke it in an instant
and mother nature gives 0 fucks

In my experience, some of the best academic works start with a quote to reflect the tenor and wisdom of what follows.

This is your quote.

**Bunion 2020** · 02-18-2021, 08:41 AM

Use Whips title and that intro and I can see a B+ in young Skywalker's future.

**Hacksaw** · 02-18-2021, 08:52 AM

Originally Posted by mtnjam

AAA just had a really good Zoom meeting last Wednesday night about this very topic. I don't see the meeting posted anywhere on YouTube from the AAA channel or from the Sawtooth Avalanche Center's social media page yet either, but I bet if you sent an email to Amy at media@sawtoothavalanche.com she could get you in contact where you could view that.
Good discussion from Tom Nichols in that meeting also. Look him up if you don't know who he is.

https://theavalanchereview.org/avala...ation-seminar/

**smartyiak** · 02-18-2021, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by MTT

My social media reach is very narrow, but based on what I see here on TGR. The people who tour alot and post trip reports.
They seem to be very responsible. Not much daredevil look at me stuff. I think if someone posted evidence of doing stupid dangerous shit. The would be piled on by the others here. It would be humiliating not the attaboys they want.

I making shit up b/c I don't know much about social media or avalanches...but: maybe it's the new folks who are most in danger? The snow equivalent of: let me get this sick selfie on the rim of the....whoooaaaaaaaa....splat.

Not saying experienced people don't make bad decisions, but I think we'll be seeing more new folks get into some trouble...and not just in the mountains.

**Foggy_Goggles** · 02-18-2021, 09:18 AM

I'll be on that FoCAIC Zoom tonight. I do notice a trend is in society to great as many demographic buckets as is necessary to make the problem look something other than us.

In Colorado, every avalanche fatality this season has been males 40+. I have no idea their knowledge or skill, but I do not they are no the hypothetical newbie young punk that is supposedly at risk.

So, make sure to not fall down the trap of correlation equals causation. The socials can of course lead to bad decision making. And so can a lot of other things. The chat tonight sound be interesting.

**TahoeJ** · 02-18-2021, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by smartyiak

I making shit up b/c I don't know much about social media or avalanches...but: maybe it's the new folks who are most in danger?

Nope, it's very much the opposite in reality.

**powdork** · 02-18-2021, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

In Colorado, every avalanche fatality this season has been males 40+. I have no idea their knowledge or skill, but I do not they are no the hypothetical newbie young punk that is supposedly at risk.

Being 55 makes me want to stay inside. Another one south of Jackson yesterday. Male 55 on a snowmo.
Red Flags - age (48-56)

**mtnjam** · 02-18-2021, 10:34 AM

I think the FOMO factor is strong this season. As more and more users are hitting the easy pickings, it's driving the more experienced users further out and up to get further away from what used to be the norm. Which is what I believe we are seeing in the demographics of accidents. Someone else correct me if I am wrong as I'd love to understand the human psyche a little better, thus understanding myself a little better.

**smartyiak** · 02-18-2021, 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by TahoeJ

Nope, it's very much the opposite in reality.

Proving that I'm correct 1/2 or the time!

**Foggy_Goggles** · 02-18-2021, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by mtnjam

I think the FOMO factor is strong this season. As more and more users are hitting the easy pickings, it's driving the more experienced users further out and up to get further away from what used to be the norm. Which is what I believe we are seeing in the demographics of accidents. Someone else correct me if I am wrong as I'd love to understand the human psyche a little better, thus understanding myself a little better.

Yes, you described one of may major challenges to good decision making. The safe areas are busy when they didn't use to be. No, I do not believe that is a statistically significant trend from my basic knowledge of accidents this year. Why do we want to keep trying the parse the data such that we can draw a homogenous picture of the victims?

It appears to be very hard to determine why people make bad decisions but that is where the learning will come from.