Thanks COVID, I'm an instructor now! Need tips for 7 y/o

[Duffman]

So given the amount my 7 year old boy actually listens to me, I've been keeping him in group lessons over the past season. Since these aren't an option around here this year, and he would rather ski with Dad anyway now, which is cool, I would love to help him progress but have no idea for tips and tricks to get the stance and body position correct. Last year he got pretty good at being parallel more often than not , and was generally forward , but had a wide cowboy stance. This year after growing a bit and a late start to the season, he keeps going into that wide legged stance , even when straight running parallel, and seems to be more wedge dependent. Also he is more backseated and unless constantly reminded , keeps his hands down near his pockets (no poles yet). He has good turn shape and decent control, but I really want the wide legged backseat stance to not become a habit.

I still want skiing with dad to be fun, but also want to work on these basics with him. Any tips or fun drills than could help him here?

[Hood26]

Maybe time to add the poles to the mix and start getting some bug squishing practice?

[old goat]

Let him dial in stance and body position on terrain he's completely comfortable on. Any chance you're pushing him onto more difficult runs than he's ready to really ski rather than just survive? I don't mean never take him on harder runs but he needs to spend a fair amount of time on easier runs, runs that probably bore the heck out of you.

IME kids that age learn more by imitating than by instruction. Does he follow you or do you follow him? Instructors I see spend most of their time leading their students.

And yeah, give poles a try. Might make him feel more secure. You can always take them away if they make things more complicated.

[BCMtnHound]

Wide stance? Sorry to break it to ya, but he might be a snowboarder waiting to be set free.
Look on the bright side, at least he isn't showing signs of bending the knee!

[Sirshredalot]

So given the amount my 7 year old boy actually listens to me, I've been keeping him in group lessons over the past season. Since these aren't an option around here this year, and he would rather ski with Dad anyway now, which is cool, I would love to help him progress but have no idea for tips and tricks to get the stance and body position correct. Last year he got pretty good at being parallel more often than not , and was generally forward , but had a wide cowboy stance. This year after growing a bit and a late start to the season, he keeps going into that wide legged stance , even when straight running parallel, and seems to be more wedge dependent. Also he is more backseated and unless constantly reminded , keeps his hands down near his pockets (no poles yet). He has good turn shape and decent control, but I really want the wide legged backseat stance to not become a habit.

I still want skiing with dad to be fun, but also want to work on these basics with him. Any tips or fun drills than could help him here?

I've taught that age and skill level plenty in the past and I'm unwillingly back at it with my 3 and 5 year olds this year.

I'd make sure that you keep the terrain mellower than you think you should. I'd also refrain from giving him poles unless he really gripes about it. Get him to hop and jump a lot. A lot. Watch some ski movies together. Keep an eye out for rippers on the hill so you can point out good skiing.

Get him out on snow and enjoy your ski time together as much as you can.

If you can stick to that plan, little dude's skiing will progress and his instructor will be stoked next season.

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[FlimFlamvanHam]

you should go take your Level 1 coaching cert. It's so worth it.

He's widelegged thru turns as well? Turns are entered parallel? loooong turns on terrain he's comfortable on. When he's turning get him to lift his uphill ski up and down (he's following you and you're going to be doing it). It will hopefully cause him to favor the inside edge of dh ski more and bring his uphill leg in. Airplane turns. Hand on downhill knee. All do similar. Anything to get him weighting the edge he should be and not using his opposite leg so much for suppoort as it sounds like he's doing.

And I'm also sure he'll just naturally bring his legs more together in a very short amount of time on his own.

Edit to add: make sure you are always venturing into the little rollers/mini "jumps" that are inevitably on the side of any green run. It's so easy to ignore those once you're not a kid.

[Duffman]

Wide stance? Sorry to break it to ya, but he might be a snowboarder waiting to be set free.
Look on the bright side, at least he isn't showing signs of bending the knee!

Wow, uh , I mean it's 2021 and I totally support him , and he can like whatever he wants, but wow. Isn't there like Conversion therapy or something like that ? 😁

[Duffman]

Thanks for the tips. Yeah he's pretty much using it for balance , like an outrigger. Happens whether he's running straight on real mellow terrain or turning, not just something that's coming out of a wedge initiation.

As far as little rollers and hits on greens , the kid loves this stuff. He rides up on the side of every trail, regardless of if there is snow, brush , dirt , whatever. It's fun. Also loves any small track through the woods , or as the Alta instructors call them ,"bear trails". The funny part is when on these little singletrack runs in the trees, he tightens up the stance a bit without realizing.

As far as overterraining and developing bad habits, I've really tried to avoid that. He's wanted to follow his few year older family friends down some steeper blues and bumped up woods runs by his own choice, and gets way more intimidated by the wide open groomed steeper sections than he does in a woods area, even with similar pitch. It's here where the sitting back wedge really comes out. I guess he can get visually intimidated or overthink it in the trees.

One mistake it looks like I'm making is I've been following him alot so I can help easier when he eats it. Having him follow me makes more sense, thanks !

you should go take your Level 1 coaching cert. It's so worth it.

He's widelegged thru turns as well? Turns are entered parallel? loooong turns on terrain he's comfortable on. When he's turning get him to lift his uphill ski up and down (he's following you and you're going to be doing it). It will hopefully cause him to favor the inside edge of dh ski more and bring his uphill leg in. Airplane turns. Hand on downhill knee. All do similar. Anything to get him weighting the edge he should be and not using his opposite leg so much for suppoort as it sounds like he's doing.

And I'm also sure he'll just naturally bring his legs more together in a very short amount of time on his own.

Edit to add: make sure you are always venturing into the little rollers/mini "jumps" that are inevitably on the side of any green run. It's so easy to ignore those once you're not a kid.

[Lostintime]

So given the amount my 7 year old boy actually listens to me, I've been keeping him in group lessons over the past season. Since these aren't an option around here this year, and he would rather ski with Dad anyway now, which is cool, I would love to help him progress but have no idea for tips and tricks to get the stance and body position correct. Last year he got pretty good at being parallel more often than not , and was generally forward , but had a wide cowboy stance. This year after growing a bit and a late start to the season, he keeps going into that wide legged stance , even when straight running parallel, and seems to be more wedge dependent. Also he is more backseated and unless constantly reminded , keeps his hands down near his pockets (no poles yet). He has good turn shape and decent control, but I really want the wide legged backseat stance to not become a habit.

I still want skiing with dad to be fun, but also want to work on these basics with him. Any tips or fun drills than could help him here?

Without seeing him tough to say. What looks like wide stance to us may be a stable platform of support. Obviously , if its so wide that he's always riding on his inside edges that is too wide. Often times kids depend on a wide stance, in order to preset themselves for the next turn. If this is the case, the backseat stance is impeding his ability to do a proper transfer of weight into the next turn. Your child is skiing the way they are because it works for them. In order to change his skiing you have to teach him something that works better. There are a few things I have found effective. While skiing in front, if the stance gets wide I use a prearranged cue of a slow clap to indicate, bring your skis together. I also have them use the cue, "tall to turn". This gets them in an appropriate stance so they can flatten their skis and initiate the new turn. Foot steering is very important to reach the next level. In a static position you can have them turn their feet. Now have them turn their feet on gentle terrain creating an over initiated inside ski. They can't do it with a wide stance. Take it into parallel skiing. Have them gain speed straight down the hill and turning across and up the hill to a stop. J turn. With practice he should be able to develop a very mellow hockey stop. Link not quite complete j turns with the tall to turn cue. Once he is able to run parallel on gentle terrain, dial it up to 11. Linked hockey slows are what I use to develop linked skidded parallel. Another drill to teach him to be "boss of his feet is wedge change ups. Wedge parallel, wedge parallel, again and again. If he is really struggling with the backseat stance tapping the uphill ski in a traverse works. In a static position have him raise only the tail and tap it. In order to do this he will have to find his fore aft balance. Now have him practice the tapping in a traverse. Another effective drill is to have him ski backwards in a wedge, he will be forward. Now have him turn around and take that stance into downhill skiing.
Hope this helps.

[iriponsnow]

We hired a broke FIS college kid for same purposes - worth every penny.

[Ottime]

All good advice. You mention he skis better on the bear trails. If you have some decent low angled trees or gullies, I found this improved my son’s skiing. He really likes being off piste, but it forced him to turn more. My kid is kind of a lazy skier and won’t attack a mogul field fall line, but instead will look for the easiest turns. But put him into a bumped up chute and suddenly he LINKS his turns perfectly as he has no choice.

No saying to throw your kid down a chute, but low angled terrain that has features may help him develop the muscle memory.



And stop often and rest. Bring hot cocoa. Build a fort. Keep him in the snow. Part of it at that age is muscle strength and endurance. The stance you describe may be his comfort stance when his legs get tired. We stop less now but around that age we would still stop for mid trail break every few runs.

[Sirshredalot]

Wow, uh , I mean it's 2021 and I totally support him , and he can like whatever he wants, but wow. Isn't there like Conversion therapy or something like that ?

I taught my 5 year old a basic telemark turn the other day. I'm assuming CPS will lock me up indefinitely.

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[gregorys]

My kid is kind of a lazy skier and won’t attack a mogul field fall line, but instead will look for the easiest turns.

And stop often and rest. Bring hot cocoa. Build a fort. Keep him in the snow. Part of it at that age is muscle strength and endurance. The stance you describe may be his comfort stance when his legs get tired. We stop less now but around that age we would still stop for mid trail break every few runs.

Dude - that's not just your kid - that's me. Always looking for the easiest turns down!

And yes - snacks!
Just the other day, I rode up with a dad and his little girl. Probably 3-4. For riding the "big" lift she got a gummy worm. It was super sweet to see.

Personally, I think teaching family members to ski is simply fraught. We simply aren't on our best behavior (you'll say and do stuff to family that you wouldn't to anyone else, sad to say) and we know how to push each other's buttons.
Good luck. (Says the guy teaching his wife to ski at 50+. Surprisingly it's gone better than I'd have expected, at least so far.)

Clutch/accelerator exercise, perhaps?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTkyqZjUMYQ

[BCMtnHound]

Wow, uh , I mean it's 2021 and I totally support him , and he can like whatever he wants, but wow. Isn't there like Conversion therapy or something like that ? ��

I taught my 5 year old a basic telemark turn the other day. I'm assuming CPS will lock me up indefinitely.

Ha! I must admit that this year my 7yo daughter will not likely even strap on alpine gear as the local ski hill is too low elevation for this year's freezing levels. But she is absolutely killing it on the nordic gear, and seeks out any and every hill she can.
This from a father that transitioned from fixed heel alpine => telemark => snowboard => telemark, with a underlying very strong nordic base. There is no wrong way to slide on snow to have fun! Kudos on all parents that spend the time with their young ones to continue the tradition, especially during these times!

[Ottime]

Dude - that's not just your kid - that's me. Always looking for the easiest turns down!

Did I mention he imagines he is a Pokémon battling others while he is on his way down groomers. Often with intricate hand gestures and random wide turns to chase down imaginary villains?

Which brings me to: make it fun.

[gregorys]

Did I mention he imagines he is a Pokémon battling others while he is on his way down groomers. Often with intricate hand gestures and random wide turns to chase down imaginary villains?

Well, ok. I *only* imagine I'm Candide!

[Hood26]

Here is a ski dad for us all to follow. Catch little Mikala wedging at the end:

https://youtu.be/jK36bgs453U

Here is Mikala's first memory of skiing:

https://youtu.be/Qfya-SPNG7s

Here is a Vonn with that same wedge and wide stance we all started with:

https://youtu.be/ghXI7t70Bnw


Bro, just have fun for now. In coming years, hand him off to the coaches and encourage from the sidelines.

As you work with your boy, prioritize:

1. Why (hopefully a lifelong chair buddy)
2. How
3. Lastly, what (that's the whole technical component.

But fuck don't listen to me I am just a fucking Jerry. So here's Johnny:

https://youtu.be/9CjHNcLnu90

[Bushwacka]

cant be skiing a wide stance if one ski is in the air. I would personally just skiing around on one ski, and see if he copies you. We should be more balanced on the outside ski but learning to ski on a balanced inside skis is great as well.

I also suggest find side wedges and off cambered sections to turn up as well 3d terrain that is mellow.

If he isnt parrallel on blues I d avoid poles, they usually hurt and dont help. If you get pole though make sure they are short enough that they dont force his body upward and back.

Hows the boot fit and ski tune?

[cobblehiller]

The wide legged is not really a bad thing. The backseat is. Everyone has given you great advice and esp the most important one, Keep it Fun. Does he play basketball? If he does try to get him to pretend to dribble. Dribbling a ball brings the shoulders and head forward right away. It also puts you in a balanced athletic stance. (second) skiing is unnatural. In almost everything else he does, pushing his foot forward and putting the weight on the ball of his foot is how he stops. If you are running too fast and need to slow down you put your foot further out in front of you and lean back. His brain is telling him to weight the ball of his foot. Thats what a ski boot does, lean your shin into the front of your boot to transfer weight to the forebody of the ski. Shallow well groomed terrain, get him to try to catch you, short straight line, one J turnat a time. keep it exciting,( probably with some kind of referene to gaming) keep him on your uphill side as you cross the fall line and even coast up a little as you slow down and let him "get" you. He will reach forward bringing his body position forward and will pay attention to his downhill ski because thats the side you are on. If he is going too fast on a runout he will lean back so his feet crash first, if he is going to hit DAD he will put his hands out in front cause kids trust DAD to stop them. If he feels controlled, he leans forward to " get " you , if he feels scared, he leans forward to " push " on you. Either way he leans forward weights the ski and stops. once he trusts the outside ski, the other ski will move in.I would be willing to bet he skis better in the trees, because they give him comfort in the ability to stop. He's 7 in his brain if he gets going to fast he can body check or hug a tree to slow down. He leans forward getting prepared to body check probably even with his hands up and out to absorb some of that speed before he checks it. and then skis well enough he never has to. Out in the open, his brain says " hey if we get going to fast we're going to fall and go even faster with no way to stop." And then stretches his neck up and back so his head is as far away from the " bottom" of the hill as possible. Or, maybe I have just been under a stay at home order for too long and am just typing for the sake of it and none of this makes any sense at all.

[Conundrum]

[mufasa5446]

This. I taught skiing for many years before my career switch and this pretty much sums up many a lesson. Keep it super mellow, lots of jumping and hoping on that mellow, lead, and when you’re riding the chair watch the cool skiers with him. Eventually he’ll ask how you can tell that guy is good and then you can point out his stance or whatever may be meaningful for improving his own skiing.

I've taught that age and skill level plenty in the past and I'm unwillingly back at it with my 3 and 5 year olds this year.

I'd make sure that you keep the terrain mellower than you think you should. I'd also refrain from giving him poles unless he really gripes about it. Get him to hop and jump a lot. A lot. Watch some ski movies together. Keep an eye out for rippers on the hill so you can point out good skiing.

Get him out on snow and enjoy your ski time together as much as you can.

If you can stick to that plan, little dude's skiing will progress and his instructor will be stoked next season.

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[Duffman]

Thanks for all the advice here. Went back out to the local molehill yesterday and played a bunch of follow the leader and jumped off anything and everything in sight. He went off the "big" jump in the little park and was super stoked on his big air! Still has the wide.stance going on but much more forward and more parallel.

Biggest thing I notice (probably because my hand position sucks ass) is that even when reminded he tends to go back to hands in the pocket . Not sure a good cue for that one. I tried to have him "drive the bus" and "aim the machine gun" down the hill but limited success

[mufasa5446]

For myself, I remind myself to keep my hands in my periphery vision. For kids, driving, catching a ball... it’s a tough one for kids and adults


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[waxloaf]

Biggest thing I notice (probably because my hand position sucks ass) is that even when reminded he tends to go back to hands in the pocket . Not sure a good cue for that one. I tried to have him "drive the bus" and "aim the machine gun" down the hill but limited success

I have the same issue with my daughter (6 y/o); I've been finding that the more jumping we do (lots of jumping over little humps of snow, etc.) it forces her forward more -- its tough to jump when you're in the backseat. Who know whether that will work long term though. She also can't stand when I am constantly bugging her to get forward, so its a good way to keep her happy.

And thanks all for the tips - some really good stuff in here.

[Bushwacka]

hands should be low wide and slight forward. You dont want high out streached hands and end up looking like a fucking zombie as you ski. It also tend put people back to have high hands.

With that said hands are about the most meaningless thing for skiing well, how our body and legs interacts is way more important than hands. With kids hands are typically not their biggest issues.

I basically wouldnt worry about the hands to much......

the wide stance though. I have question for the Duffman. Do you teach your son to stand on the outside ski or press on it? Is it the same thing?