Who’s using a Runt?

[joetron]

With a 34 stepcast on the way via my new xc bike, this review is awesome. Thanks for taking the time to write it out.

We should get ya Runted.


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[Mudfoot]

We should get ya Runted. ]

I've known Diaz for many years and he is a excellent guy. Recently had him tune my wife's and my Fox Shocks. I'm 225 lbs and she's 105. We are both serious riders but too old to be catching much air and really shredding any more. He completely re-valved and set them up for our individual weights and riding styles. We were both immediately blown away by how our bikes rode. Glued to the ground in every kind of terrain. Spooky smooth. We did not go for the Runt (his invention) but we can attest that the man is a wizard. Have not met anyone who runs a Runt that didn't like it.

[Terrapin Ben]

I have a 2020 Fox 36 170mm Fit4 performance elite fork that I Runted this spring. I consider myself to be physical rider and weigh about 185 lbs fully geared up with a hydration pack/full face/pads/etc. Surprisingly, my riding weight varies a fair amount according to riding kit - trail vs bike park enduro vs backcountry ride. Enter the runt.... I used to be extremely frustrated with my fork diving in big turns or generally being unsupportive in the midstroke. The Runt has changed all that. Supple off the top, supportive through the whole stroke, and finely tunable. I am not a tinkerer and more of a set and forget guy, however, the ability to set my fork up for courses has been a revelation. Highly recommended product!

[XtrPickels]

With a 34 stepcast on the way via my new xc bike, this review is awesome. Thanks for taking the time to write it out.

Happy to do it.

In almost any situation, I think the Runt is an improvement. It really makes a more linear feeling air spring and I'm realizing this paired well with the EVO. Because the anti-squat is a little low, I'm running higher pressure to keep it efficient. This works because the EVO is somewhat progressive then turns linear and maybe even a bit regressive at the end stroke. Therefore you can get full travel with a relatively stiff set up if there are no spacers... creating a more "linear feeling" air-spring.

So, when there was a progressive fork with a stiffer back end, they just felt mismatched.

The biggest thing with the Runt though, is that you can tune it to get what you want and because I'm a tinkerer, I enjoy that.
E.g. if you're putting the 34 onto a progressive frame, (E.g. a Transition Spur), then I'd start with the baseline from DSD- Low= 20% Sag, High = ~2x the Low.

[NW_SKIER]

We should get ya Runted.


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I'm thinking yes, we should.

Happy to do it.

In almost any situation, I think the Runt is an improvement. It really makes a more linear feeling air spring and I'm realizing this paired well with the EVO. Because the anti-squat is a little low, I'm running higher pressure to keep it efficient. This works because the EVO is somewhat progressive then turns linear and maybe even a bit regressive at the end stroke. Therefore you can get full travel with a relatively stiff set up if there are no spacers... creating a more "linear feeling" air-spring.

So, when there was a progressive fork with a stiffer back end, they just felt mismatched.

The biggest thing with the Runt though, is that you can tune it to get what you want and because I'm a tinkerer, I enjoy that.
E.g. if you're putting the 34 onto a progressive frame, (E.g. a Transition Spur), then I'd start with the baseline from DSD- Low= 20% Sag, High = ~2x the Low.

It'd be going on a Revel Ranger I ordered through Joetron

[Conundrum]

'18 Fox 36 here. I went from I need to sell this fork and buy something worth a shit to putting in the Runt and really liking the front of my bike. Before runt, I'd set the sag to about 25%, go for a ride and blow through the first 2/3rds of travel climbing. Then on the descent, have about 10-20mm of useable travel and leave about 20mm of unaccessible bottom that wouldn't go. With a runt, same sag, stay well in the top half on the climbs, and will bottom the fork once about every 2-3 rides. I think it saved a fork for me.

[mmmm...pow!]

Count me in the happy Runt owner club. I'm 210 buck naked and ride pretty hard and could never get my 36 to feel quite right. The Runt has made it much better. Took a few rides to get it set up, now I don't touch it. Traction is better, almost never bottom out unless I have a real big impact or flat landing, but feels super smooth using 90-95% of travel most rides. Still wish it was more supple over small bumps, but I think that's more a fork issue. After seeing some of the above comments, I'm now considering sending in my shock, and maybe the fork, too, for servicing over the winter.

[XtrPickels]

Count me in the happy Runt owner club. I'm 210 buck naked and ride pretty hard and could never get my 36 to feel quite right. The Runt has made it much better. Took a few rides to get it set up, now I don't touch it. Traction is better, almost never bottom out unless I have a real big impact or flat landing, but feels super smooth using 90-95% of travel most rides. Still wish it was more supple over small bumps, but I think that's more a fork issue. After seeing some of the above comments, I'm now considering sending in my shock, and maybe the fork, too, for servicing over the winter.

If you were happy with the small bump at one point, do seals and a fluid change. That ought to bring it back.

It seems people have had good luck with Fox forks. Does the Runt fix an inherent issue with Fox product that Rockshox doesn't have?

[CantDog]

With Diaz not taking out of town orders, any Durango mags willing to facilitate and drop a fork/shock by?

[abraham]

I'd pm joetron.

[gramboh]

bike24.com has a bunch of Maxxis in stock, roughly $50ish USD for Assegai or DHF 3C MaxxGrip DoubleDown casing. 20EUR flat shipping (at least to Canada, assume US as well), I grabbed a bunch of spare Assegai and DHRII tires and cheap jerseys to dilute the shipping cost.

[NW_SKIER]

bike24.com has a bunch of Maxxis in stock, roughly $50ish USD for Assegai or DHF 3C MaxxGrip DoubleDown casing. 20EUR flat shipping (at least to Canada, assume US as well), I grabbed a bunch of spare Assegai and DHRII tires and cheap jerseys to dilute the shipping cost.

What does this have to do with Diaz?

[gramboh]

What does this have to do with Diaz?

Oops! No idea how that got posted in here, meant to be in the tire thread where people were asking about Maxxis.

[garuda]

Back to the Runt discussion...

Those who are happy with the Runt, what ratio of High to Low pressure are you running?

I have a 38 with a runt and haven't found the sweet spot yet, albeit with limited time so far. Diaz's recommended 2:1 ratio is unrideable for me. That results in a huge progression wall at 2/3 travel and no chance of ever using full travel. 1:6 or 1:5 to 1 seems better. But not necessarily better than a stock 38 with one token. I am finding I need to go down to below Fox's recommended pressure settings (for the Low chamber) for decent small bump sensitivity. Have already done a full lower service to remove excess grease and ensure proper oil levels.

[joetron]

I’ve been using 2:1 H:L as a baseline….sometimes going a little lower on L if I want a touch more grip.
Is all your compression damping opened up?
I recommend just calling Diaz. Either he or Omar will pick up the phone and can help you troubleshoot.


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[XtrPickels]

Back to the Runt discussion...

Those who are happy with the Runt, what ratio of High to Low pressure are you running?

I have a 38 with a runt and haven't found the sweet spot yet, albeit with limited time so far. Diaz's recommended 2:1 ratio is unrideable for me. That results in a huge progression wall at 2/3 travel and no chance of ever using full travel. 1:6 or 1:5 to 1 seems better. But not necessarily better than a stock 38 with one token. I am finding I need to go down to below Fox's recommended pressure settings (for the Low chamber) for decent small bump sensitivity. Have already done a full lower service to remove excess grease and ensure proper oil levels.

I don't have a 38, just a 36 and a 34, so YMMV.

I pretty much always disregard Fox's pressures because I don't think I've ever found a recommendation that's worked for me.
Additionally, I also feel the ramp in the travel when I'm compression the fork by hand when trying to get a feel for the pressure. However, I've never noticed that on trail and have definitely used full travel but only on harsher drops. One of the things I like about the Runt is the fork rides higher in the travel through most trail garbage.

However, everyone's weight, terrain, riding style are different. So you may land on a completely different setup.

I'd start with the low chamber pressure to get a descent sag (20-25%) then go from there. Whether you land at 1.5x, 2x or 2.5x is what feels best to you.

[Terrapin Ben]

I'm on a 36 so YMMV

I start by making sure my rebound is all the way open (fastest/full rabbit).
Then I set my low pressure to get 20% sag.
I take that number and multiply by 1.8 to set the high.
I might play with the rebound a tiny bit, but that's pretty much it.

[carlh]

Just picked up a runt for my 160 lyric. Was using ~100PSI at 6 clicks of compression, ~200lbs on a sentinel. Put in 90/170 and it feels pretty stiff but haven't ridden yet does this seem like a good starting point?

[Dantheman]

Seem high. I'm only 160 lbs kitted up but I run my 170 Mezzer at 32/65.

[joetron]

Have you asked Diaz what his recommended starting point would be? He usually has a pretty good spot for each fork, going off what you ran pre-Runt.
Is it stiff feeling off the top or as you push deep into travel? If it’s stiff initially, drop the Low Speed side 5 psi.



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[carlh]

website said pressure stock -10 in the main and 2x in the high. I need to mess around on the trail this weekend but might start by dropping the main to 85. I also tend to like my fork a touch softer in mud season than in the summer and the 100 was a summer pressure.

[mmmm...pow!]

I'm looking to move from a 36 to a 38. I like how the Runt has been working in my 36, so will likely pick one up for the new fork. Any thoughts on a Runted 38 with Grip 1 vs. Grip 2?

[NW_SKIER]

Runt or no runt, grip 1 sucks. Fit 4 is better in my opinion. Grip 2 is where it's at.

[Wes Mantooth]

Found a cheap ish used one of these and dropped it my fork yesterday and holy shit. Still figuring out the tune but the small bump performance is literally night and day for me. It’s on a Pike select so having more adjustability is huge. Only used up all the travel once on a 5’ drop to flat and didn’t get a harsh bottom out feel like I’ve had before on the same hit. Started with 70/140 (was previously at 90+) and experimented with 75/150 and 65/130 but think I’m liking 70/140 the best so far. Still not sure how riders that are 20+ lbs heavier than me are able to ride this at 60/120 though…

I do feel like my fork rides lower in the travel now which will take a little getting used to from a stack perspective. Don’t notice the Runt as much at higher speeds in very chunky terrain but it does feel quite a bit smoother overall. Still working on the tune to see if I can get it more supported in the mid stroke when pumping. I also had a few moments riding yesterday where I hit a bump in a certain way and the front end felt super strange so I need to spend some more time getting used to it to see what adjustments would help in those situations

For those who have Runts did you mess with your rebound when tuning it? Not sure if it’s happier with rebound in one direction or another or if it doesn’t matter much

[joetron]

General DSD rebound tuning idea (if you have HSR and LSR) - which I don’t think you’ve got on the Pike Select - is to bury the HSR so it maintains control and spring energy when you go deep in travel, then you can use your LSR to tune your preferred ride feel - stick to the ground Mr Plow style or more poppy playful.
When DSD does their custom tune they set this up in the damper, so if you have one rebound knob it becomes that ride feel adjustment, but the shim stack is heavy on HSR.
With one knob you’ve got one rebound adjustment covering a whole lot of different spring energy needs. Factory tunes tend to be a bit light on HSR.


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