Ferox Freebird vs Line Vision 108

**em_yeti** · 01-25-2021, 11:21 PM

Anybody been on one? The other? Better yet both? Was thinking of throwing some tectons on the ferox but those lines have got me rethinking that. Plan to use as primary touring set up in the Wydaho region. Thanks all.

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 02:32 AM

I have a ferox. I like it. Stupid light and skis well. The tune was bad enough out of the package though that they were unskiable for me. But maybe I’m just that picky.

Haven’t been on the line. I do have a Corvus FB and a nocta set up for touring and my ferox is my go to

**em_yeti** · 01-26-2021, 07:58 AM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

I have a ferox. I like it. Stupid light and skis well. The tune was bad enough out of the package though that they were unskiable for me. But maybe I’m just that picky.

Haven’t been on the line. I do have a Corvus FB and a nocta set up for touring and my ferox is my go to

Thanks for the input. Did a basic detuning of the edges make it “skiable” or was more it work than that?

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 08:06 AM

It’s better. But I’m currently headed with them right now to go get on a lift and ski them a few laps. The tune comes from BC at 1 and 1 supposedly which makes zero sense to me being an ex racer. They wanted zero to do with hard snow initiation. They float killer and wanna pivot anywhere though. I just put the bevel to a 2 degree side.

I totally understand 1 degree bevels on reverse camber and full rocker skis, not on a ski with camber. I called them about it. It’s the most ass backwards list of bevels I’ve ever seen. The anima has a 2 and 1 but not the ferox or the Corvus FB and those have just as much camber. The orb has a 2 and 1 as well and skis great. My nocta on 1 and 1 is killer as well. My Justis was a shit show and I’d still rather ski my Corvus. And my Corvus I put a 2 and 1 on just like a race ski and the fucker rails and pivots still.

**madriverfreeride** · 01-26-2021, 08:31 AM

I love how the vision skis but they are not durable in the slightest, tagged a rock early season that I didn’t even feel while skiing and didn’t eject from my tech bindings, compressed 2 inches of edge right underfoot.

Your luck may very and they are super fun skis, but I was pretty annoyed.

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 08:45 AM

Getting better

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 10:16 AM

That’s the one thing I will say. Black crows are bomb proof. I have two laps in. It’s better with a 2 degree side bevel. Base bevel is shit though. I can actually see where the machine missed the tips and tails in the rocker on both skis.

**gregL** · 01-26-2021, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

It’s better. But I’m currently headed with them right now to go get on a lift and ski them a few laps. The tune comes from BC at 1 and 1 supposedly which makes zero sense to me being an ex racer. They wanted zero to do with hard snow initiation. They float killer and wanna pivot anywhere though. I just put the bevel to a 2 degree side.

I totally understand 1 degree bevels on reverse camber and full rocker skis, not on a ski with camber. I called them about it. It’s the most ass backwards list of bevels I’ve ever seen. The anima has a 2 and 1 but not the ferox or the Corvus FB and those have just as much camber. The orb has a 2 and 1 as well and skis great. My nocta on 1 and 1 is killer as well. My Justis was a shit show and I’d still rather ski my Corvus. And my Corvus I put a 2 and 1 on just like a race ski and the fucker rails and pivots still.

My chart from Black Crows says 1.5 degree side edge bevel for the Ferox, but obviously you can make it whatever you want. I'd do 2 degrees as well since I don't have a 1.5 bevel guide . . .

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by gregL

My chart from Black Crows says 1.5 degree side edge bevel for the Ferox, but obviously you can make it whatever you want. I'd do 2 degrees as well since I don't have a 1.5 bevel guide . . .

Ya. That’s what the chart says.

On the base edge The first 10 inches of the tips and tails was 0 degrees according to the bevelometer. And the bevel didn’t pick up to a 1 until in front of the toe and then back to a .75 behind the heel and then nothing out the last foot of the ski.

And ya. 2 works a little better for the hard east coast snow and 1.5 seems a little too precise for what I just saw.

**gregL** · 01-26-2021, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

Ya. That’s what the chart says.

On the base edge The first 10 inches of the tips and tails was 0 degrees according to the bevelometer. And the bevel didn’t pick up to a 1 until in front of the toe and then back to a .75 behind the heel and then nothing out the last foot of the ski.

And ya. 2 works a little better for the hard east coast snow and 1.5 seems a little too precise for what I just saw.

Another reason never to ski a ski until you've laid a file with a known bevel guide on it . . .

**chicken feathers** · 01-26-2021, 08:22 PM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

That’s the one thing I will say. Black crows are bomb proof. I have two laps in.

I gotta disagree with ya there. I have friends who raved about their freebird's, so I bit on a pair of 18/19 Navis's.

I've been pretty underwhelmed by the construction and materials on my freebirds since day one. Compared to other skis I've owned & tuned the Navis is poorly constructed, seems to be made with cheap materials, and shows poor quality control. Mine showed up new with several spots where the edge sits 1mm off from the base, which had been filled in & ground (base too narrow for edges, or edges not seated flush w/ base). Maybe I received a pair of 2nds...I couldn't find this in any other skis currently in the quiver (Volkl, Voile, Fischer), and I don't remember it on past skis (Salomon, dynastar, head).

One night I actually gouged the base good when I slipped a plexiglass scraper off them. Anyone else ever do that to a ski? Probably, but I haven't in 15 years of tuning skis, even learning with a metal scraper.

The edges seem too soft, get trashed way more than my other skis, skis which have found more rocks.

I don't think they ski that great either. I like the waist width enough that I find my self on them often.

wah.

But people get stoked on them so that's cool

**SoVT Joey** · 01-26-2021, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by gregL

Another reason never to ski a ski until you've laid a file with a known bevel guide on it . . .

Bingo. First two out of 7 pairs though. So it was a decent gamble that they would be ok. Alpine skis have been great.

**SoVT Joey** · 01-27-2021, 04:12 AM

Originally Posted by been in it

I gotta disagree with ya there. I have friends who raved about their freebird's, so I bit on a pair of 18/19 Navis's.

I've been pretty underwhelmed by the construction and materials on my freebirds since day one. Compared to other skis I've owned & tuned the Navis is poorly constructed, seems to be made with cheap materials, and shows poor quality control. Mine showed up new with several spots where the edge sits 1mm off from the base, which had been filled in & ground (base too narrow for edges, or edges not seated flush w/ base). Maybe I received a pair of 2nds...I couldn't find this in any other skis currently in the quiver (Volkl, Voile, Fischer), and I don't remember it on past skis (Salomon, dynastar, head).

One night I actually gouged the base good when I slipped a plexiglass scraper off them. Anyone else ever do that to a ski? Probably, but I haven't in 15 years of tuning skis, even learning with a metal scraper.

The edges seem too soft, get trashed way more than my other skis, skis which have found more rocks.

I don't think they ski that great either. I like the waist width enough that I find my self on them often.

wah.

But people get stoked on them so that's cool

Ya. My regular black crows are built better. I think that’s the difference between the freebirds and the regular. My regular black crows I will tell you 100% are built like a moment or a on3p. I’ve hammered the shit out of them and come up with no damage. I think the freebirds are built like a regular ski. Extruded bases, factory bullshit edges, etc.

I actually found a spot on my ferox last night that the edge is separated for like a half inch and there is space between my edge and base. Not a lot but a mm or so.

I agree that the quality control on the freebirds sucks. I think the subbing ski builds to four different factories is biting them in the ass

**em_yeti** · 01-27-2021, 10:13 AM

Any comments on how the Ferox ski?

**Sargentdrufus** · 01-27-2021, 01:49 PM

Yeah my Camox Freebird 2017 edition, are great skis, but next to my Deathwish Tour which they are the same weight. The DWT feels way more robust, in hand , and on snow.

That being said, I have no plans on parting with the Camox Freebird, but build wise it isn't close to my Moments

**SoVT Joey** · 01-27-2021, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by em_yeti

Any comments on how the Ferox ski?

They ski well. I have faith that when the tune is good they will be great. The turns I can make they rail. The transition is just hooky right now so I have to compensate for it. But when they are up on edge they scream. I had them in the powder yesterday as well and tight trees and they float and pivot. You can tell they are a light ski, they are soft, they feel more torsionally stiff then my Corvus freebird.

**em_yeti** · 01-27-2021, 05:53 PM

Thanks again. Suggestion on mount point? I have found nada on this about the ferox.

**SoVT Joey** · 01-27-2021, 06:08 PM

I’m on the line. Feels good. I’m on the 181. If I wasn’t in Vt, I’d be on the 186.

**skisurfmirth** · 01-27-2021, 06:48 PM

Joey you mean 183? I've been on the 183 with mtn as do all bc ski for 2 years. Really fun touring ski. Very damp for the such a light weight ski. Inbounds skis are Rossi sickle 186 and blackops so if you like those I bet you'd like the vision.

**SoVT Joey** · 01-28-2021, 03:07 AM

No. I’m on the 181 ferox. At least that’s what the tail says.... I’ve been know you smoke a lot of herb though... so maybe someone pulled a fast one.

**Ville** · 01-28-2021, 05:50 AM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

I have a ferox. I like it. Stupid light and skis well. The tune was bad enough out of the package though that they were unskiable for me. But maybe I’m just that picky.

Haven’t been on the line. I do have a Corvus FB and a nocta set up for touring and my ferox is my go to

When do you take out corvus? I love corvus fb, but this is probably last season they have left, so need to start looking for new goto touring ski.

Lähetetty minun LYA-L29 laitteesta Tapatalkilla

**NWFlow** · 01-28-2021, 06:24 AM

I'll agree that BOTH the vision series (i tour with the 98) and the freebird series (navis freebird) are underwhelming in terms of construction, although the navis FB is step up from the vision.

The visions are light and fun, but the bases have to be the softest material I've ever used. You can lightly tag a rock that on a normal ski would be maybe a scratch, and on the vision it's a 5 inch long core shot. This is not hyperbole.i would seriously take this into consideration if purchasing a vision.

The navis is better, but i never got along with that ski (like the atris though) and that could factor into my overall negativity regarding them.

**Ville** · 01-28-2021, 06:28 AM

Originally Posted by NWFlow

I'll agree that BOTH the vision series (i tour with the 98) and the freebird series (navis freebird) are underwhelming in terms of construction, although the navis FB is step up from the vision.

The visions are light and fun, but the bases have to be the softest material I've ever used. You can lightly tag a rock that on a normal ski would be maybe a scratch, and on the vision it's a 5 inch long core shot. This is not hyperbole.i would seriously take this into consideration if purchasing a vision.

The navis is better, but i never got along with that ski (like the atris though) and that could factor into my overall negativity regarding them.

I haven't had any durability problems with my old corvus fb. I have around 100 days on them, some scratches have needed ptex, but so does all the other skis I have. Maybe I have been lucky

Lähetetty minun LYA-L29 laitteesta Tapatalkilla

**NWFlow** · 01-28-2021, 07:16 AM

Yeah, to be fair I ski in a very rocky area, often in the dark so am hard on skis.

The Navis FB i have are also partially broken from me faceplanting in a wind hole on the local glacier, but have held up to abuse for 3 seasons now. I guess I just didn't find them that compelling of a ski.

The visions, on the other had, I get along with as long as i'm on light boots, but i doubt they'll last me 100 days this season.