To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

[Mofro261]

Unless some of those 5-11 yro's have already gone through puberty... risk of myocarditis should be very low to extremely low, and even lower in girls.

Turns out the hormone Testosterone will also influence the immune response, or in some cases the magnitude of that response, by upregulating a pro-inflammatory cytokine (IL1-β) that is also induced as part of the innate response to either viral infection or mRNA vaccination via recognition of those same TLR, RLR, and NOD innate signaling sensors in cytoplasmic and endosomal compartments. IL1-β is involved in cardiac remodeling and recruitment of tcells, macrophages to heart tissues with resulting inflammation.

Chances are still 6-10X higher for myocarditis from actual viral infection with Sars2 vs an mRNA vaccine in boys 15-17 which have the highest rates vs all other age/sex.

(Of course, consult your dr.)

[SorryBro]

BRO - lots of nice sentences...

tj

Fully understand your views as I DO read your posts even with the syntax oddities. That's interesting info about your previous work in Risk management and agree that the test in a box is probably the way to go.

I have to disagree with added stress RE: kids. My stress has gone DOWN now that my littlest can finally be vaccinated. The statistics say chance of long term harm is much higher getting Covid than any side affects from vaccine. I'm listening to the consensus of doctors.

[skiJ]

while I agree Public Health (Medicine) has become a political process, I would claim that is an unfortunate 'side effect' of the times in which we now live ( as mentioned up-thread, in today's social climate, we could never eradicate polio ).

However, I take exception to attacking a parent who is gathering information about vaccinating a child with a heart defect based on claiming the parent's process is ,,, a political campaign.

good night ( Good grief ). tj

[Casey E]

For what it’s worth, my 6 year old grandson in Chile got his two shots zero problem. Here, 70% of kids 6-11 have now had their first shot, and about 70% of those 12-17 are fully vaccinated, plus university students are about 95%. Helps that the Chinese vaccine is a tried and true format, but still, I have heard of literally no issues.

Most of the kids are getting vaccinated at school, and it is working very well.

However, in spite of the high rate of vaccination, the relaxation of restrictions and Delta is now causing an uptick in cases, mainly in the unvaccinated, who are also those that are being admitted to hospitals. Fortunately, deaths are way down.




Those over 55 now have to have had their booster for travel purposes, and 80% have. A fourth dose is being discussed for sometime next year. Dynamic stuff, this.

[The SnowShow]

It's really fascinating to see how the states differ. Yes, cases in CO are going up it appears, but if you look at the death rate it's somewhat flat, and definitely nothing like the southern states where vaccination is low. Florida had a clear spike in deaths that followed the spike in cases...deaths are going up but not at the rate of cases. That has to be because the vaccine is working well and maybe people in CO are healthier relative to FL or other southern states.

Agree with that. In my little Denver bubble, it seems like people are still taking this all seriously, still masking indoors and getting boosters, but obviously much of the state is not.

[bodywhomper]

I posted this before, here’s the infection data that came out the scientific advisory committee to the FDA for USA kids 5-11 (somebody please check my math):

>1.9M infected

>8300 hospitalized (that’s 1 in 229)

1/3 of those hospitalized went to the ICU (that’s >2739 or 1 in 694 of those infected)

30% of those hospitalized did not have an underlying condition (that’s >2490 or 1 of 763 of those infected)

There’s been 5,217 MIS-C cases reported (that’s 1 of 364 of those infected)

94 deaths (1 of 20212 of those infected)

7-8% of kids experience long COVID19 (that’s 133000-152000 between 1 of 14 and 1 of 12.5)

[ex-powderbroker]

CO numbers keep getting worse. Biggest one day report of new cases in the whole pandemic today (+4k). Shit is getting out of control here.

Maine had 660 cases today. granted, that is down from yesterday’s 800 when shit was getting really real (source: some guy on tgr), but at this point the whole tele skiing population of the east coast could be gone before the ground freezes!

hopefully in colorado people have had 2 vaxxes and their heels are locked; it seems safer.

[old_newguy]

I posted this before, here’s the infection data that came out the scientific advisory committee to the FDA for USA kids 5-11 (somebody please check my math):

>1.9M infected

>8300 hospitalized (that’s 1 in 229)

1/3 of those hospitalized went to the ICU (that’s >2739 or 1 in 694 of those infected)

30% of those hospitalized did not have an underlying condition (that’s >2490 or 1 of 763 of those infected)

There’s been 5,217 MIS-C cases reported (that’s 1 of 364 of those infected)

94 deaths (1 of 20212 of those infected)

7-8% of kids experience long COVID19 (that’s 133000-152000 between 1 of 14 and 1 of 12.5)

If this is accurate it needs to be blasted all over the news because what’s out there from the usual suspects is that COVID poses an “infinitesimally small risk to kids”.

[old goat]

Unless some of those 5-11 yro's have already gone through puberty... risk of myocarditis should be very low to extremely low, and even lower in girls.

Turns out the hormone Testosterone will also influence the immune response, or in some cases the magnitude of that response, by upregulating a pro-inflammatory cytokine (IL1-β) that is also induced as part of the innate response to either viral infection or mRNA vaccination via recognition of those same TLR, RLR, and NOD innate signaling sensors in cytoplasmic and endosomal compartments. IL1-β is involved in cardiac remodeling and recruitment of tcells, macrophages to heart tissues with resulting inflammation.

Chances are still 6-10X higher for myocarditis from actual viral infection with Sars2 vs an mRNA vaccine in boys 15-17 which have the highest rates vs all other age/sex.

(Of course, consult your dr.)

Thank you for that. I would hope cardiologists would be aware of the testosterone issue. The biochemistry of it maybe not so much.

[bodywhomper]

If this is accurate it needs to be blasted all over the news because what’s out there from the usual suspects is that COVID poses an “infinitesimally small risk to kids”.

Here’s my source: https://yourlocalepidemiologist.subs...ds-fda-meeting

Her summary came from the discussion that accompanied this presentation:
https://www.fda.gov/media/153508/download

Apparently, the long Covid percentage data came from the uk (my mistake - sorry)

[altasnob]

here’s the infection data that came out the scientific advisory committee to the FDA for USA kids 5-11:

>1.9M infected

>8300 hospitalized (that’s 1 in 229)

1/3 of those hospitalized went to the ICU (that’s >2739 or 1 in 694 of those infected)

30% of those hospitalized did not have an underlying condition (that’s >2490 or 1 of 763 of those infected)

There’s been 5,217 MIS-C cases reported (that’s 1 of 364 of those infected)

94 deaths (1 of 20212 of those infected)

7-8% of kids experience long COVID19 (that’s 133000-152000 between 1 of 14 and 1 of 12.5)

Kids should get vaccinated for COVID just like kids should get the flu shot, but to put those CDC stats above in perspective, here's some data from the CDC regarding flu related deaths in children:

From the 2004-2005 season to the 2019-2020 season, flu-related deaths in children reported to CDC during regular flu seasons have ranged from 37 to 199 deaths. (During the 2009 H1N1 pandemic, 358 pediatric flu-related deaths were reported to CDC from April 2009 to September 2010.) It is noteworthy that among reported pediatric deaths, about 80% of those children were not fully vaccinated. Also of note, even though individual flu deaths in children must be reported to CDC, it is likely that not all deaths are captured and that the number of actual deaths is higher. CDC has developed statistical models that account for the underreporting of flu-related deaths in children to estimate the actual number of deaths. During 2019-2020, for example, 199 deaths in children were reported to CDC but statistical modeling suggests approximately 434 deaths may have occurred.

Another interesting stat I read, "according to one federal scientist, by June an estimated 42 percent of [of all children aged 5 to 11 in America have] already been infected with the coronavirus." However, this conclusion has been highly scrutinized by other experts (the study was based on children who had blood drawn for routine medical care or other illnesses). And of course, even those infected should still be vaccinated. There is approximately 29 million 5 to 11 year olds in the US, to give you an idea of just how many may have actually been infected if that 42% figure is even remotely true.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/28/h...-children.html

[bodywhomper]

The peer academic debate is why I didn’t include the seroprevalence data.

[teletech]

Don’t you know you’re not supposed engage with me. My days of teleing ended the day I hit some good ole fashioned New England blue ice in that stupid stance. Colorado has 5 times the population of Maine, we’ve been through this before. Maybe if you took more vax you’d be smarter. Something to think about.

[teletech]

If there is 29,000,000 kids add a zero to all your numbers whomper

[Ski220]

Going to get my booster shot at 4:30 today.
My COVID-19 vax was the two shot Pfizer regime.
I will be getting a Moderna shot as the booster
7 months after my last Pfizer shot.

PSA.
In researching for the shot that I wanted, I
have found out that -
CVS offers the Moderna.
Walgreens offers the Pfizer.
RiteAid offers the J & J.

This info is valid for my area at least. SW Connecticut.
Cannot vouch for other areas of the country.

[ill-advised strategy]

I have a work buddy I don’t always see, with our different roles and shifts. Same high school class as me; real, real nice guy and generally reasonable. He was worried about Covid, so not one of the denier-types, but wouldn’t shave and do a real mask pre-vaccine. Then, I guess, wife and him didn’t get vaccinated. I stopped in to see him at work and he wasn’t there, again…found out, apparently, his wife is now in the hospital and he’s been super sick for 2 weeks.

The other guy giving me this news says he also still hasn’t gotten vaccinated, he can’t decide which vaccine to take. I’m just like aaargh dude take either, if you have to choose, pick moderna…he had some kind of retort. god damn…you know? Last month there was a drive through clinic at our job, 30 yards from where these guys work. They were doing covid and flu, I walked over there and got a flu shot, it took 5 minutes.

There’s 2 others who have been missing lately. Ugh.

I dunno man. I can’t mind-meld with these people and understand what’s going haywire. I can’t understand it.

[skiJ]

freedom, i-as --

a hundred excuses...

I will ask the people I care about. and continue to cite the References.


sad for your friend... tj

[skaredshtles]

<snip> if you have to choose, pick moderna…he had some kind of retort.

But that Moderna has Lucifer's glow-in-the-dark shit in it!!

[XXX-er]

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health//child...phac-1.5653533

children ^^ under 12 now account for the highest # of new covid infections,

CTV had an interesting artical I can't find today the province is saying infections are at < 1 so every infected person infects < 1 other,

found it:
https://bc.ctvnews.ca/b-c-covid-19-m...ines-1.5652078

the province had also done modeling on what would happen with out vax

every person would infect 3.43 others

they province said half the people dying are unvaxed and the rest are twice vaxed old people

[basinbeater]

I got my booster yesterday. Little achy before bed, but then I slept like crap, had crazy dreams and tossed and turned all night. Feel better now, just tired from crappy sleep last night. Arm is sore.
I had moderna for the first two, with the second 7 months ago, and got a Pfizer booster at cvs inside a target.

[TBS]

I dunno man. I can’t mind-meld with these people and understand what’s going haywire. I can’t understand it.

When I ran a software company our board chairman was a Dunning-Krueger poster child. His advice was off the wall and the one time he showed up unannounced and gave a motivational speech to the staff (including copies of his self-published book Self Made in America, I lost two people (out of 30) and spent a month calming down the rest.

After one contentious board meeting the sanest of the Board Members called to commiserate. He told me “TBS, you are letting your thinking be bounded by rationality. While that’s admirable in 99% of situations, it sadly doesn’t work with John. Contemplate his fears and address those”

Some of the best advice I ever received. Thanks Walter. RIP

[schwerty]

Waiting in the holding tank after PFE boost. No real stiff problems with the first two. Fingers crossed I don’t end up sweating through my sheets tonight.

Get one if you can.

[PNWbrit]

Just got the Pfizer boost on top of J&J with a flu shot thrown in.

JFC you'd think Walgreens would have the in store process better sorted out though, what a shitshow.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Just got the Pfizer boost on top of J&J with a flu shot thrown in.

JFC you'd think Walgreens would have the in store process better sorted out though, what a shitshow.

Wife and I got our two first Pfizer shots at Walgreens and that was my thought back then as well...I figured it was just a shit show because they were getting a lot of people in short periods of time. Guess not.

[RootSkier]

5 and 7-year-olds jabbed yesterday. They were fucking stoked. It's 50% for them and 50% for the grandparents (all vaxxed and boosted).



Fuck anti-vaxxers, especially Aaron Rodgers.