To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

[MontuckyFried]

Alright. Hear me out on this one, guys. Perhaps some of you might even agree...

So, we keep hearing about the fact that like 99% of the people in ICUs these days are those who have not received the vaccine. SOOOOOO, perhaps instead of trying to get in the way, maybe, just maybe, step aside for a bit and let that wildfire burn its way through that forest full of deadfall. Like Louis CK's bit about the whole nut allergy thing, except replace "people with nut allergies" with "the unvaccinated.":



Boom.

[frorider]

This is roughly the last 30 pages in this thread summarized in one excellent article.

https://insidemedicine.bulletin.com/522108225713159

Yeah I’m not as impressed by the article. It posits that a central objective of the pro-vaccine crowd is avoiding hospitalization of an increasing number of those who chose to not get vaccinated. I.e. the classic ‘empathetic Liberal’.

In fact, repeatedly in this thread many who are pro vaccine don’t particularly mind if misinformed unvaxxed get gravely ill or die—but their central concern is that high rates of COVID will create more and more generations of viable mutations and trap us and the world in uncontrolled cycles.

Maybe you can send the author a link to this thread

[jono]

This is roughly the last 30 pages in this thread summarized in one excellent article.

https://insidemedicine.bulletin.com/522108225713159

Pretty close. Covers what should be the discussion well. Doesn't address two things, though. Pockets of unvaccinated where overwhelming the healthcare system is already happening. And (typical of the parallel stupidity pandemic) the argument of the dumbass/disingenuous that manages to take everything that either side gets wrong and combine all errors to argue for maximum chaos, despair and death.

ETA, yeah, I was waiting for a discussion of new variant risk, too, but maybe we turn a corner on that argument if the US stops being the world's best Petri dish (either because it's less concerning or because other places are moreso).

[MultiVerse]

A new U.K. study of vaccination protection from Delta breakthrough infections found effectiveness of ~60% with combined AstraZeneca and Pfizer vaccines. The U.K. relied more heavily on the AZ vaccine so that's probably inline with what we're seeing elsewhere, something approaching 80% for mRNA and 50% for viral vector vaccines.

Although so far all the studies about Delta breakthroughs have wide confidence intervals. And the CDC P-town report cannot be considered a generalizable study because the sample size is so small and because the sample isn't very diverse, mostly affluent middle-aged gay men partying over the course of a weekend.

https://www.ft.com/content/df4db947-...b-e46bd86ba915



Also, it seems like the discussion here more or less arrived at (before devolving) into the huckbucket article's conclusion versus a minority arguing don't bother because vaccines don't work at all:

"Renewed interest in vaccinations among the undecided is good news. But time is short. Delta moves quickly and is less forgiving for the unvaccinated. The vaccines still work, though a bit less well against Delta. The time to shore up vaccination efforts is now. Delta appears to be formidable enough a foe that we can’t simply ignore it."

[ticketchecker]

In fact, repeatedly in this thread many who are pro vaccine don’t particularly mind if misinformed unvaxxed get gravely ill or die—but their central concern is that high rates of COVID will create more and more generations of viable mutations and trap us and the world in uncontrolled cycles.

this

[mtuhockey33]

Shit’s getting real guys:

he was told by his doctor to not get the vaccine since he has GSB and could have a severe reaction to the vaccine… but nobody wants to talk about that…

[buttahflake]

Sucks that Louie CK was a casualty of early cancel culture, I caught him twice at Caroline’s before it all went south for him. I laughed so hard my abs hurt for two days. He was easily the funniest guy of his generation.

[tuco]

What's to talk about? He can still get Covids and transmit virus. Is the virus a better option for his condition than the vax?
Seems like they did the dude a favor.....

and what kinda dumbass argues S-E-A-S-O-N-A-L-I-T-Y, when it's NOT even fucking flu season(slapz forehead)?

[mcphee]

pretty fitting that MF and BF defend a serial sex pest.

letting a highly contagious virus just spread is still going to affect the vaccinated and cause variants. Get jabbed and stfu.

[The AD]

and what kinda dumbass argues S-E-A-S-O-N-A-L-I-T-Y, when it's NOT even fucking flu season(slapz forehead)?

To be fair nobody wants to be outside in Florida in the summer, so it's not real surprising that their Covid numbers would increase in the summertime.

[tuco]

But even then, this is not the typical flu season. Out west it's a hundo+ and smoky AF in a lot of areas. Nobody wants to be out in that either.

[abraham]

Shit’s getting real guys:

Huh, not like their singer knows anything about viruses.

[riser4]

Perfectly happy talking about folks who have legit medical reasons to not get the vax. They are exactly the reason we a) need every last person that CAN get the jab to fucking stop being a twatwaffle and get it; b) need continued masking, social distancing, crowd size restrictions, etc until every last twatwaffle gets the jab. And we also need a vax for the under 12 crew, along with research into alternative vaccines for at least some of the folks who currently can't get it. My mom had some allergy that made certain vaccines a challenge for her. Fortunately I do not have that allergy. That was a long time ago and I cant remember which it was. Possibly her egg allergy.

[tuco]

I get the legit medical reasons thing. But covids not going to help his condition. He needs to stay away from people for now. Why is this so hard?

[skaredshtles]

To be fair nobody wants to be outside in Florida in the summer, so it's not real surprising that their Covid numbers would increase in the summertime.

I'm just here to state that Florida SUCKS.

[stuckathuntermtn]

One of my college friends has gone off the deep end and is saying the same thing on social media lately. "If you're worried about the Delta variant, boost your immune system with natural herbs!"

Do they also have an alphabet after their name?
Because Dr sister-in-law, DVM, MPH, and whatever else, Equine acupuncturist, board certified something or other and Epidemiological Information Service fellowship graduate (it's one of the uniform services, look it up!) and soon to be some kind of instructor or professor at UM Western, fucking knows better.
Oh and she currently works for the MT department of health and human services doing whatever and has for a while.
🤬

[skaredshtles]

<snip> I cant remember which it was. Possibly her egg allergy.

Almost CERTAINLY her egg allergy...

[old goat]

Almost CERTAINLY her egg allergy...

The current vaccines don't use eggs. For the most part people with allergies can get the vaccine. I'm allergic to amoxicillin and one of my kids to sulfa drugs and we both got shots without problems. Allergies are pretty specific.

[CarlMega]

he was told by his doctor to not get the vaccine since he has GSB and could have a severe reaction to the vaccine… but nobody wants to talk about that…

Isn't people with pre-existing conditions like this^ the exact people you've abandoned and ignored w/ your anti-vax rhetoric? Guess the poor guy drew the short stick since you all need 'your choice' and this guy would have to swim in a sea of viable but militantly unvax'd so now he has to stay at home.

[riser4]

The current vaccines don't use eggs. For the most part people with allergies can get the vaccine. I'm allergic to amoxicillin and one of my kids to sulfa drugs and we both got shots without problems. Allergies are pretty specific.

Ya, this was a long time ago. She and her dad were also allergic to horse serum.

[mtuhockey33]

Isn't people with pre-existing conditions like this^ the exact people you've abandoned and ignored w/ your anti-vax rhetoric? Guess the poor guy drew the short stick since you all need 'your choice' and this guy would have to swim in a sea of viable but militantly unvax'd so now he has to stay at home.

the guy already had Covid, said it wasn’t bad and he’d rather take his chances with natural immunity and getting it again vs taking the vaccine and having an unfortunate outcome. Kind of seems like the same stance I have on it ����♂️

[paulster2626]

pretty fitting that MF and BF defend a serial sex pest.

letting a highly contagious virus just spread is still going to affect the vaccinated and cause variants. Get jabbed and stfu.

Louis CK acknowledged that what he did was wrong, apologized for it, and has been trying to get on with his life. Personally, I hope he's successful.

IMO the worst thing about "cancel culture" isn't the outing of the deeds persay, it's the permanence of the hate. It's like, great, you've outed this person and ruined their life, but at what point do they get to try to change and get another chance to have any form of a life again?

If you're an actual convicted rapist like Cosby/Weinstein, of course that's different so don't bring that shit up.

[abraham]

Ya, this was a long time ago. She and her dad were also allergic to horse serum.

I misread that last bit. Seemed like there was a story to tell for a minute.

[CarlMega]

the guy already had Covid, said it wasn’t bad and he’d rather take his chances with natural immunity and getting it again vs taking the vaccine and having an unfortunate outcome. Kind of seems like the same stance I have on it ����♂️

Maybe, I'm not an offspring stan. Does sound like he has a plausible reason and condition vs. being stubborn & ignorant. In the end, the public health landscape being what it is means he's out of work. So there's that. Probably has more in common w/ Montucky than you on that front.

Q: What do you call a guy who hangs out with musicians?

A: A drummer.

I kid, I kid.

[mcphee]

Louis CK acknowledged that what he did was wrong, apologized for it, and has been trying to get on with his life. Personally, I hope he's successful.

IMO the worst thing about "cancel culture" isn't the outing of the deeds persay, it's the permanence of the hate. It's like, great, you've outed this person and ruined their life, but at what point do they get to try to change and get another chance to have any form of a life again?

If you're an actual convicted rapist like Cosby/Weinstein, of course that's different so don't bring that shit up.

he denied it for years. admonished metoo. only until "cancel culture" got him and he lost deals, tours, and fans did he admit what he did. he doesn't deserve sympathy.