To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

**topwater** · 11-04-2021, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by Not DJSapp

I can book an appointment for a booster for today in my local area at multiple locations within 20 miles. Why shouldn't people get one if the people we're supposed to be waiting for aren't lining up?

Bingo, got my booster at a CVS in rural NC yesterday and there was nobody there for shots. Far cry from the drive in location for my initial shots last April in UT.

**altasnob** · 11-04-2021, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Ted Striker

Some kids in my neighborhood have regular house parties like pre-pandemic. Their attitude is "we're all vaxed because of our shitty service jobs, so it's all good" The thing is, (statistically) at least a few of their friends' friends aren't.

Have you been to a concert yet? It is basically just like an un-masked house party because everyone has a drink in their hand and is dancing away. Things are pretty much back to normal.

And now that the last demographic who is ineligible for the vaccine (kids under 5) is also is the the lowest risk COVID demographic, the moral argument for protecting the ineligible unvaccinated is less. At some point, society is going to have to say fuck it, and in my observation, we've already hit that point.

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush

My question to folks like Gretch is, how many kids need to get vaccinated for you to feel comfortable? There will be cases of kids that have adverse reactions to the vaccine. Is there a threshold of adverse reactions that you're comfortable with?

It is probably a bit like porn for me....I can't really define it, but I know when I see it. 1 in 5,000 experiencing myocarditis is too high for me to be comfortable at this point. Especially for a kiddo with a heart defect (no matter how common or minor it may be). He is still, and probably always will, have heart scans every couple years to make sure everything is staying the course. If I as a parent made the decision to give him a vaccine that has only been tested on 4,700 kids his age and only has emergency use approval for something non-fatal and he was 1 in 5,000, I would feel pretty freaking terrible for making that decision if things went bad. Especially since we have confirmation that he has been exposed within the home, probably twice already.

If that 1 in 5,000 figure is proven false after a million kids get the vaccine, it is a whole different story. Not like he isn't up to date on all his other vaccines.

This cold/flu season is going to be a nightmare I think. Luckily, I can work from home when I have the snivels, but shit, with two young kids in school, the shit they bring home (none covid stuff)...someone in the family has a sore throat, cough, runny nose pretty often. Then you have allergy season, or just generally a runny nose when playing outside in the cold. Simply no way people are getting tested enough and doing the right things....its frustrating. We are weeks away from the mass of tourist coming to town for the holidays. I don't believe for one second a family is going to cancel their week vacation to Aspen (or even risk it by being tested) if someone in their family has cold symptoms that might be delta. Lose out on the $10K or $15K or whatever they are dropping on the trip (non-refundable portion). Not gonna happen.

Leads me to believe we are just gonna have to live with this virus and hope the vaccine can keep high risk people from getting dead.

**dunfree** · 11-04-2021, 10:36 AM

Lol.

**Adolf Allerbush** · 11-04-2021, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by gretch6364

It is probably a bit like porn for me....I can't really define it, but I know when I see it. 1 in 5,000 experiencing myocarditis is too high for me to be comfortable at this point. Especially for a kiddo with a heart defect (no matter how common or minor it may be). He is still, and probably always will, have heart scans every couple years to make sure everything is staying the course. If I as a parent made the decision to give him a vaccine that has only been tested on 4,700 kids his age and only has emergency use approval for something non-fatal and he was 1 in 5,000, I would feel pretty freaking terrible for making that decision if things went bad. Especially since we have confirmation that he has been exposed within the home, probably twice already.

If that 1 in 5,000 figure is proven false after a million kids get the vaccine, it is a whole different story. Not like he isn't up to date on all his other vaccines.

This cold/flu season is going to be a nightmare I think. Luckily, I can work from home when I have the snivels, but shit, with two young kids in school, the shit they bring home (none covid stuff)...someone in the family has a sore throat, cough, runny nose pretty often. Then you have allergy season, or just generally a runny nose when playing outside in the cold. Simply no way people are getting tested enough and doing the right things....its frustrating. We are weeks away from the mass of tourist coming to town for the holidays. I don't believe for one second a family is going to cancel their week vacation to Aspen (or even risk it by being tested) if someone in their family has cold symptoms that might be delta. Lose out on the $10K or $15K or whatever they are dropping on the trip (non-refundable portion). Not gonna happen.

Leads me to believe we are just gonna have to live with this virus and hope the vaccine can keep high risk people from getting dead.

thanks for this. I might do the same if I was in your shoes, FWIW. Like I say, I completely understand the logic of your decision.

**PNWbrit** · 11-04-2021, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by dunfree

Lol.

Exactly

Simply no way people are getting tested enough and doing the right things....its frustrating.

Like making up some arbitrary reason/metric about when their kid gets the vaccine while hoping that others vaccines protect them?

after a million kids get the vaccine, it is a whole different story

**Benny Profane** · 11-04-2021, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by gretch6364

This cold/flu season is going to be a nightmare I think. Luckily, I can work from home when I have the snivels, but shit, with two young kids in school, the shit they bring home (none covid stuff)...someone in the family has a sore throat, cough, runny nose pretty often. Then you have allergy season, or just generally a runny nose when playing outside in the cold. Simply no way people are getting tested enough and doing the right things....its frustrating. We are weeks away from the mass of tourist coming to town for the holidays. I don't believe for one second a family is going to cancel their week vacation to Aspen (or even risk it by being tested) if someone in their family has cold symptoms that might be delta. Lose out on the $10K or $15K or whatever they are dropping on the trip (non-refundable portion). Not gonna happen.

Now what we have here, ladies and gentleman, is a full blown, grade A first world problem.

**Danno** · 11-04-2021, 10:44 AM

I will say, gretch, that your post just talks about low chance of death from the virus, as many people often do. But the virus does bad things other than kill you. Chance of long term effects on a kiddo who survived is a very real thing to consider. That said, I understand your concern.

**Ted Striker** · 11-04-2021, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by altasnob

Have you been to a concert yet? It is basically just like an un-masked house party because everyone has a drink in their hand and is dancing away. Things are pretty much back to normal.

I am aware, but no I haven't. This town is still uptight enough that it wouldn't quite be normal yet. And I hate white guy jam bands.

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

Like making up some arbitrary reason/metric about when their kid gets the vaccine while hoping that others vaccines protect them?

Could I get an example of something arbitrary that you are referring to?

**PNWbrit** · 11-04-2021, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by gretch6364

Could I get an example of something arbitrary that you are referring to?

too high for me to be comfortable

and I'll quote it again...

after a million kids get the vaccine

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I will say, gretch, that your post just talks about low chance of death from the virus, as many people often do. But the virus does bad things other than kill you. Chance of long term effects on a kiddo who survived is a very real thing to consider. That said, I understand your concern.

Absolutely true. That was why I mentioned my kids have been exposed at least twice already (confirmed cases within the home, then they had symptoms). For several weeks after the initial wave (pre-vaccine) he complained of his lungs hurting when running, they both had low grade fevers for two days, wife had COVID toes, etc.

**SumJongGuy** · 11-04-2021, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by gretch6364

It is probably a bit like porn for me....I can't really define it, but I know when I see it. 1 in 5,000 experiencing myocarditis is too high for me to be comfortable at this point. Especially for a kiddo with a heart defect (no matter how common or minor it may be). He is still, and probably always will, have heart scans every couple years to make sure everything is staying the course. If I as a parent made the decision to give him a vaccine that has only been tested on 4,700 kids his age and only has emergency use approval for something non-fatal and he was 1 in 5,000, I would feel pretty freaking terrible for making that decision if things went bad. Especially since we have confirmation that he has been exposed within the home, probably twice already.

If that 1 in 5,000 figure is proven false after a million kids get the vaccine, it is a whole different story. Not like he isn't up to date on all his other vaccines.

Sounds like your kid's cardiologist would have an opinion worth discussing. Did they say don't get the vax yet? regardless, keeping the kid home another year unvaxed might be what I'd do in your shoes..

**dunfree** · 11-04-2021, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I will say, gretch, that your post just talks about low chance of death from the virus, as many people often do. But the virus does bad things other than kill you. Chance of long term effects on a kiddo who survived is a very real thing to consider. That said, I understand your concern.

the good faith you waste on mouth breathers is amazing. The only thing that’ll convince gretch is him leaving his partisan bubble, and that’ll never happen. He’s just here to suck his own dick and get attention.

fuck, “my kids were exposed to covid and it’s no big deal”, but vaccine fear mongering is, is pure tribal dumbfuckery.

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

and I'll quote it again...

And here I thought you were claiming my kids personal health history (IUGR, premature, 4lbs at birth, bicuspid aortic valve) were arbitrary.

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by dunfree

the good faith you waste on mouth breathers is amazing. The only thing that’ll convince gretch is him leaving his partisan bubble, and that’ll never happen. He’s just here to suck his own dick and get attention.

Leave your stupidity and politics where they belong...pollyass.

**SumJongGuy** · 11-04-2021, 10:54 AM

Originally Posted by dunfree

The only thing that’ll convince gretch is him leaving his partisan bubble, and that’ll never happen. He’s just here to suck his own dick and get attention.

This is why I NEVER block anyone anywhere that simply disagrees with me (is totally wrong or full of shit or whatever). I only block people who launch personal attacks and insult without other substance. Otherwise, I'm creating echo chambers on places where there's diverse opinions until I block them....

**wooley12** · 11-04-2021, 10:54 AM

11 of 100,000 is not 1 in 5000. For a start.

Tell me, what % number are you using for the kids that got it and ended up with long term effects from the illness to choose which bet to take?

**JaytaeMoney** · 11-04-2021, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by dunfree

the good faith you waste on mouth breathers is amazing. The only thing that’ll convince gretch is him leaving his partisan bubble, and that’ll never happen. He’s just here to suck his own dick and get attention.

fuck, “my kids were exposed to covid and it’s no big deal”, but vaccine fear mongering is, is pure tribal dumbfuckery.

Take a deep breath buddy.

**gretch6364** · 11-04-2021, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by wooley12

11 of 100,000 is not 1 in 5000. For a start.

Tell me, what % number are you using for the kids that got it and ended up with long term effects from the illness to choose which bet to take?

So you are saying it is 1 in 9,090? I was using the numbers I saw specific to males in the age group of 12 to 17. I did some googling and there seems to be a range of quotes related to the study. Some say 1 in 6,172, etc.

For the second point....I was not considering that portion of it for my specific kids, since I can't go back in time before they had COVID and vaccinate them.

**Not DJSapp** · 11-04-2021, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by old_newguy

I haven’t gotten one because the CDC and my physician have not recommended I get one. So I was a little confused on if the recommendations have changed.

The CDC is recommending that all frontline workers ages 18+ get one. It's not that it has a negative health impact, it's an issue of supply, but supply is outpacing demand. Keep in mind this is the CENTER FOR DISEASE CONTROL, not the anyone speaking for your personal health. The CDC is just trying to stop this thing in the most effective manner on a macro scale, and they think boosters reduce transmission.

Also for relevance, IMHO, there's a lot of just throwing science at the wall here when it comes to boosters and who needs them.

**old_newguy** · 11-04-2021, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I will say, gretch, that your post just talks about low chance of death from the virus, as many people often do. But the virus does bad things other than kill you. Chance of long term effects on a kiddo who survived is a very real thing to consider. That said, I understand your concern.

It baffles me that the CDC is not pushing this information out to the public. It’s all about death rate, hospitalization, ICU capacity.

I would think letting the public know their or their kids chances of ending up with life long complications from a case of COVID would be pretty important.

They should also be putting out lots of information comparing this disease to all the other diseases kids get vaccinated for. As a parent you get pretty bombarded with info on chance of serious illness or death from your kid getting MMR, etc as a comparison against the vaccine.