To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

[LongShortLong]

IMO, Gandhi has been given too large of a mic, likes to ride that edge, and has ended up on the wrong side too many times this year. Some of her op-Ed’s have done more damage than good.

Ding ding ding.

Also wears rose-tinted glasses and bullies her coworkers. I'm sure she knows way more than me on most covid topics, but too often confidently makes statements I know are wrong. I don't trust her.

On the topic, that John Campbell guy is off script or I missed a memo. Last week or so, he's saying he wants to get infected intentionally to build immunity.

[MultiVerse]

People are advocating for natural immunity here, too.

My whole family caught a cold two weeks ago. It was a little shocking.

With natural and vax “reinfection” rates, isn’t there something related to how recently you’ve been vaxed or infected, antibody counts, and the opportunity for your body to respond more quickly to a new infection because your antibody levels are still high?

Some of the people pushing natural immunity are doing so because they want to prolong the pandemic for political reasons.


Several studies show when reinfections do happen for natural or vax'd their symptoms are much less severe. Not all hospitalizations are the same and more often than not hospitalization vaccination breakthrough infections are mild and secondary to some other medical reason for being there.

[bodywhomper]

What I’m getting at is when I hear fauci discuss the success that is being reported from a third Pfizer booster dose, isn’t that because of the predictable uptick in antibodies as a result of the booster vax and the ability for the body to respond more quickly to an infections when there are a lot of antibodies circulating around versus the memory B cells existing with minimal antibodies in circulation?

For the studies demonstrating natural immunity being better against the delta variant over those that are vaxed, is there consideration of when that natural immunity occurred?

[LongShortLong]

Yes, booster mostly results in extra antibodies, that will again wane, because that's how normal immune response works. The immune system also develops a broader response, leaving it better prepared for variants. I'd say which of B or T cells does the differentiation, but leave that to one of the bio guys who'll get it right. After eons of co-evolution, the immune system anticipates variants when it sees a viral protein multiple times. Pretty cool.

For ending the pandemic, immunizing everyone is more important than boosters. That may take a while, so as an individual, I'll take the booster when offered.

[ghosthop]

For the studies demonstrating natural immunity being better against the delta variant over those that are vaxed, is there consideration of when that natural immunity occurred?

I don't believe any of the recent studies show that natural immunity is better than vaccination but that if you were previously infected and then are vaccinated there is a stronger immune response and greater protection against mutations than only being vaccinated.

[Skidog]

Hi SkiDog, ASSpen, Steep et al!
Have you had enough of bringing irrelevant and poorly researched articles to this Vaccine thread? Are you getting tired of bringing your uninformed, politically-biased whataboutism to a bunch of mags who have spent their lives studying this shit? I bet you have! Do you get tired of making Mofro, Tri Ungulate and others shake their head in disgust as you share yet another article from a 'reputable' news source (that also happens to have pop up ads for bitcoin and supplements). Are your tired of making Magnificent Unicorn stare in disbelief at your childish selfish statements after he has worked to help patients all day in the hospital? Is it getting tiring to spit out yet another irrelevant study comparing Sweden to Israel? Is is starting to get a little embarrassing to have mags need to explain the difference between a virus and a bacteria and why your 'scientific' statement is beyond garbage?

I invite you to start "fresh" in the 98118 thread. While you will NEVER be allowed to physically enter my zip code, I can assure you that in the 98118 call out and food review thread, we welcome "newbies"'(jongs) and there is basically one long "hazing period" where I will verbally curb stomp you for your willful obstinance and your disrespect to healthcare workers and your communities. The registration is easy and painless, and the rules will be explained in detail during the process. If you are tired of the rational and data-backed statements of this thread: "Come join the fun"! Also, no hot Jersey Babes for you. Even they would find you too fucking stupid.

Fuck off tool. I have zero political motivation and I'm vaxxed.

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[Skidog]

Around here people have no problem with plumbers and electricians with leprosy, multi-drug resistant TB, pedophilia convictions--or they DIY and pray it doesn't leak or catch fire.

I wonder what percent of NYC teachers are actually against the mandate--their union may be opposing it primarily for collective bargaining reasons but I gotta think a lot of those demonstrating are already vaccinated and would be very happy to have all their colleagues and students vaccinated.

Yeah this is why a lot of them had "my body, my choice" signs I'm sure.

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[SumJongGuy]

Some of the people pushing natural immunity are doing so because they want to prolong the pandemic for political reasons.

And some of those leaders invested heavily in Regeneron (monoclonal antibody treatment) before banning mask mandates.

[ticketchecker]

This girl is good with the numbers, her math = get the fucking shot

https://twitter.com/TitusNation/stat...51663997730821

[mtuhockey33]

This girl is good with the numbers, her math = get the fucking shot

https://twitter.com/TitusNation/stat...51663997730821

holy fuck you’re an idiot. Her numbers are shit. Are you seriously going to try and use this crazy broad as an example of why to get Vaxx’d? Her total deaths/infections include all the time even before vaccines…. Why not use the data since vaccines were rolled out? Her data and your video argument is shit.

edit: she doesn’t include ages or underlying heath conditions either. Which is a joke.

[paulster2626]

I’ll just leave this here. Attachment 385306

Don't feel like reading 4 pages of drivel but this is a counter-protester in Toronto yesterday. The other side read "I deserve the right to be ignorant and selfish"

[fastfred]

There are already threads all over NextDoor asking for plumbers and electricians who provide proof of vaccination and wear masks. The big companies are already requiring it but folks were trying to reward small businesses for doing the right thing while keeping their homes safe. The market ha spoken. Running out of "something new" options.

good luck with that
let them in if they are Hispanic, all the mexicans lined right up to get their shots without a thought meanwhile all the white trash came up with a million reasons why getting a shot is evil

had to separate two people last week and told the anti vaxer to shut the fuck up or walk home I told him he was a stupid fuck and ever excuse was garbage
I stayed out of all this bullshit up until recently
the white male is causing his own downfall in so many ways

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Can you take them up on that? My wife just brought home a story from our local hospital: dumbass was in ICU for almost a month and when he was well enough to go home and they told him they recommended he get vaccinated he told them he just couldn't do that. Not even CTE. Just his own "moral" construct that all those experimental drugs are ok but anything that's been proven to work is a problem.

Convalescent Covid patients are all offered the vaccine when they’re discharged. If they beg for the vaccine on admission they are told it’s too late at that point until they’re no longer acutely ill.


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[MagnificentUnicorn]

Some of the people pushing natural immunity are doing so because they want to prolong the pandemic for political reasons.


Several studies show when reinfections do happen for natural or vax'd their symptoms are much less severe. Not all hospitalizations are the same and more often than not hospitalization vaccination breakthrough infections are mild and secondary to some other medical reason for being there.

We’ve got several hospitalizations that are vaccinated and Covid positive that showed up for different issues but tested positive. We test all admissions for Covid. All patients testing positive for Covid go in the Covid census. The vast majority of the Covid patients in isolation, pcu and icu are unvaccinated.


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[old goat]

I was exposed to someone who a few days later tested positive on screening lab work for elective surgery. (I'm testing negative.)

[bodywhomper]

And some of those leaders invested heavily in Regeneron (monoclonal antibody treatment) before banning mask mandates.

For de Santis, regereron invested heavily in him….

[The AD]

At least they're not using it to advocate for natural infection instead of vaccination. That's a popular view here.

It's cool. Let's just go back to 1600s medicine overall. There are a lots people who could use a good trepanning.

[jono]

It's cool. Let's just go back to 1600s medicine overall. There are a lots people who could use a good trepanning.

You'd think so, right? Somehow they've managed to justify lots of medical interventions that were thought of by 1920. Except masks and distance, obviously, but those have been around for millennia, so there's probably a specific enlightened period. Did you know Pasteur admitted on his deathbed that germs don't matter at all?

The new learning is amazing. I need to get back for a course on banana gravity so I can get a job at Space-X before it's too late.

[SumJongGuy]

I was exposed to someone who a few days later tested positive on screening lab work for elective surgery. (I'm testing negative.)

Hope you stay neg.. If everyone's yelling at the dog for farting and you smell nothing, that's proof positive. That's how I knew i had it just a few days after CDC and health department cleared my wife. I took off my N95 after they told us she was good to go but obviously day too early LOL..

[KQ]

New analysis estimates $5.7 billion price tag for treating unvaccinated Covid-19 patients in the last 3 months

(CNN)A new analysis published Tuesday estimates that preventable costs for treating hospitalized, unvaccinated Covid-19 patients reached $5.7 billion over the last three months.

This most recent data takes into account the surge in hospitalizations seen in August, which study authors estimate accounted for $3.7 billion of preventable spending alone.

The data analysis from the Kaiser Family Foundation found, using data from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, as well as studies on health care costs, that each preventable Covid-19 hospitalization costs about $20,000.

According to KFF's analysis of data from the US Department of Health and Human Services and the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the US saw 287,000 preventable Covid-19 hospitalizations from June to August.

The study authors used "preventable" hospitalizations to refer to hospitalizations of unvaccinated adults for Covid-19 treatment primarily, while accounting for any post-vaccination infections that would have been expected if this population had been vaccinated.

These numbers together yield a total of $5.7 billion spent on preventable hospitalizations over three months. The study authors said this number is likely a conservative estimate of costs.

"This ballpark figure is likely an understatement of the cost burden from preventable treatment of Covid-19 among unvaccinated adults," the authors said.

The study did not account for outpatient care costs, and some data indicates inpatient health care costs for Covid-19 treatment may be higher than the $20,000 figure used.

"Additionally, although breakthrough infections and hospitalizations are rare, unvaccinated people are also more likely to spread the virus to those who have taken measures to protect themselves and others, and those costs are not included in these estimates," the authors wrote.

[SumJongGuy]

^^^ Hospitals should ask for either proof of vaccination or the keys and title to their Ford F250 urban assault prepping for the race war vehicle prior to any COVID19 treatments..

[Ted Striker]

the white male is causing his own downfall in so many ways

True, and throwing temper tantrums along the way.

[skaredshtles]

New analysis estimates $5.7 billion price tag for treating unvaccinated Covid-19 patients in the last 3 months

(CNN)A new analysis published Tuesday estimates that preventable costs for treating hospitalized, unvaccinated Covid-19 patients reached $5.7 billion over the last three months.

This most recent data takes into account the surge in hospitalizations seen in August, which study authors estimate accounted for $3.7 billion of preventable spending alone.

The data analysis from the Kaiser Family Foundation found, using data from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, as well as studies on health care costs, that each preventable Covid-19 hospitalization costs about $20,000.

According to KFF's analysis of data from the US Department of Health and Human Services and the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the US saw 287,000 preventable Covid-19 hospitalizations from June to August.

The study authors used "preventable" hospitalizations to refer to hospitalizations of unvaccinated adults for Covid-19 treatment primarily, while accounting for any post-vaccination infections that would have been expected if this population had been vaccinated.

These numbers together yield a total of $5.7 billion spent on preventable hospitalizations over three months. The study authors said this number is likely a conservative estimate of costs.

"This ballpark figure is likely an understatement of the cost burden from preventable treatment of Covid-19 among unvaccinated adults," the authors said.

The study did not account for outpatient care costs, and some data indicates inpatient health care costs for Covid-19 treatment may be higher than the $20,000 figure used.

"Additionally, although breakthrough infections and hospitalizations are rare, unvaccinated people are also more likely to spread the virus to those who have taken measures to protect themselves and others, and those costs are not included in these estimates," the authors wrote.

Well... you know... $5.7 billion ain't worth what it used to be...

[Toadman]

This girl is good with the numbers, her math = get the fucking shot

https://twitter.com/TitusNation/stat...51663997730821

She needs to calm down. Besides, antivaxxers don't respond to math.

[45hill]

Great interview by Lex Friedman with Vincent Racaniello.

https://youtu.be/G433fa01oMU