Rescue Sleds?

[davjr96]

What do you guys carry while touring in the event of a potential partner evac situation? There's the really expensive alpine threadworks tarp and the discontinued brooks range one but I am looking for more of a DIY solution. Anyone have a cool setup with just their skis, poles, shovel, and a rope? DIY tarp setup? This looks intriguing http://straightchuter.com/portable-e...ountry-skiing/

I'm envisioning situations just a few miles from the trailhead, where the victim can't ski but is otherwise workable (think knee/ankle issues, etc). Not trying to drag someone 15 miles uphill with a compound fractured femur or anything...

[tgapp]

that's an interesting sled there. I love how cheap and durable it is. My only question would be around securing the patient, especially with a possible CSPINE injury. Also carrying that in your pack would definitely suck.

I got a good deal on a Brooks Range UL sled, and for what it is, I love it. I only carry it on long tours to remote places, and I'm not under any illusions - it is a single use item. I love how bomber it is with everything tightened down on it, but that nylon will only last one trip as a sled.

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[BCMtnHound]

[nickinbc]

I'm envisioning situations just a few miles from the trailhead, where the victim can't ski but is otherwise workable (think knee/ankle issues, etc).

In that case perhaps the better option might be to have a good sled in the car and go and fetch it if needed. If it is an injury that will take being dragged out on an improvised sled then it isn't going to get much worse for waiting.

[river59]

My thinking has always been in line with what mtnhound posted. Multi purpose items that can be rigged into whatever is needed. Whatever you choose, practice it before you need to deploy it.

Instead of drilling holes in skis, U-bolts with wing nuts could be used for clamping shit together.

If you suspect spinal injury I would advise letting the pros do the packaging and moving. Make the victim as comfortable, warm, and safe as possible.

I have never had to use an improvised sled for evac, but I have used dedicated litters like a sked or stokes basket for winter evac. I have always had a strong team to assist and even then it can be real tiring real quick. If you are moving someone solo on anything relatively firm or slightly steep, watch out. You might have a runaway toboggan on your hands PDQ.

[Andyski]

IMO, the best thing you can invest in is suitable comms equipment, and understand how to use to enact a rescue/ extraction.

Totally agree with this. Try moving an average sized adult on any kind of rigged sled over anything other than a groomer and you'll quickly see the extreme limitations. In theory it sounds good, in practice you'll realize it's usually a total waste of time and energy in a situation where you have neither to spare.

[XXX-er]

the K2 Shaxe was a B class ice axe/ snow shovel which could be made into a rescue sled if you had put holes in your skis came with all the hardware, never really took off

couple years ago we had a down day where Neil Warren from alpinethread works showed us how his rescue tarp works

[hafjell]

BCA used to sell a kit with their shovels that helped transform the shovel and skis into a sled. Pretty rudimentary but looked solid. Doesn't appear to be available from their website but maybe explore online?

[Jonathan S.]

BCA used to sell a kit with their shovels that helped transform the shovel and skis into a sled. Pretty rudimentary but looked solid. Doesn't appear to be available from their website but maybe explore online?

I have that -- although it's from K2. IIRC it came out before K2 and BCA were under common ownership. Can't remember if it lived on for awhile after that. (The K2 carbon probe I have is especially burly!)
Here's an old listing:
https://www.rei.com/product/825765/k...ue-shovel-plus

Should be glimpses of it in the pics toward the end of these albums:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/mDX7dvK1Coe3WvrM7
https://photos.app.goo.gl/1BtBr8G2TP1Sh8Tm8
I split each class into three subgroups: one got the K2 shovel, another the Brooks-Range sled, the other had to improvise with a bunch o' random stuff I gave them.

[Jonathan S.]

Totally agree with this. Try moving an average sized adult on any kind of rigged sled over anything other than a groomer and you'll quickly see the extreme limitations. In theory it sounds good, in practice you'll realize it's usually a total waste of time and energy in a situation where you have neither to spare.

Although I don't want to encourage the mentality of relying exclusively on outside assistance ... my own experience with practice of such a scenario confirms the limitations.
We're always practicing assembling sleds for ski patrol backcountry courses.
In the two links I posted above, the sleds held together well -- but that something like five or ten minutes.

In my first experience using the old Brooks-Range model:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/EyW8eRfYNLHHYLM49
... I learned that the key to making it work was to tighten up everything as much as possible -- then tighten it up even more!
Sections that I thought were if anything overtensioned turned out to be far too slack.

By contrast, even a plastic sled that would seem absurdly inadequate for ski resort patrol use can work well for a backcountry rescue:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

[stealurface831]

I always carry a few of those orange ski straps; typically one or two long ones, one or two short ones. Between those, some coradelette, and an ass pad, along with the basic materials, I can build a sturdy enough sled. The straps allow you to go really tight and make for a pretty secure ski/pole frame.

[XXX-er]

I always carry a few of those orange ski straps; typically one or two long ones, one or two short ones. Between those, some coradelette, and an ass pad, along with the basic materials, I can build a sturdy enough sled. The straps allow you to go really tight and make for a pretty secure ski/pole frame.

One long strap will not strap your boot to the ski when the binding splodes, 2 long straps will barely do it, I suggest 5

[stealurface831]

One long strap will not strap your boot to the ski when the binding splodes, 2 long straps will barely do it, I suggest 5

Shit, if my bindings 'splode, my ass is glissading down. I don't keep the straps for binding improv--never even thought of it, really--but i guess that is something to consider. Do you actually keep 5 in your pack? I bet a few industrial zipties would do the trick at a fraction of the mass and volume.

[XXX-er]

yup ^^ cuz broken equipment is more likely IME, I also carry the 5 M of rope, some hose clamps, there are pictures and write up at end of thread


https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...for-skis/page4

around here it could be very fucking cold and you are broken down/can't ski out this ^^ will get you out

also had the broken bones but buddy was a doctor and suggested we just call for the hell of a copter

[nickwm21]

During my AIARE 1 class one of the other students had an awkward/slow backwards twisting fall that resulted in a fractured tib/fib. The guide/instructor had a rescue sled. The rescue sled was basically just a tarp with loops/buckles to wrap and pull with. Being AIARE 1 we weren’t that far out. We only had to pull the guy maybe down 500vert and back up 500vert in maybe 3mi to get back to the trailhead where an ambulance was waiting.

It was a huge learning experience.

That sled was about as big as you would really carry on a tour. It worked well for what it was... But it was terrible pulling this guy uphill. And trying to guide him downhill, you could tell he was in a ton of pain, every bump and dip he was screamin. You are really risking additional injury by using the sled, so if someone is really fucked up, it’d be better to try to get the professionals there ASAP.

The guide had a radio and was able to call for assistance from his office; the ranger snomo’ed out and met us as we were getting close and the ambulance was waiting.


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[XXX-er]

came with all the parts you need to make a sled, its suposed to be a reasonable class b ice axe, I wanted an axe for a trip so I thot why not kill many birds with one stone but I never used it



a close up of the bag showing you how to use the Shaxe, blue loctite on the SS screws & wingnuts, notice the use of the injured persons pack to tie things togetehr, suggesting rope/ straps/ ect

I think maybe the Shaxe was Hatrups idea ?

I think you could do this by sourcing some hardware & putting a few holes in any aviy shovel

[old goat]

During my AIARE 1 class one of the other students had an awkward/slow backwards twisting fall that resulted in a fractured tib/fib. The guide/instructor had a rescue sled. The rescue sled was basically just a tarp with loops/buckles to wrap and pull with. Being AIARE 1 we weren’t that far out. We only had to pull the guy maybe down 500vert and back up 500vert in maybe 3mi to get back to the trailhead where an ambulance was waiting.

It was a huge learning experience.

That sled was about as big as you would really carry on a tour. It worked well for what it was... But it was terrible pulling this guy uphill. And trying to guide him downhill, you could tell he was in a ton of pain, every bump and dip he was screamin. You are really risking additional injury by using the sled, so if someone is really fucked up, it’d be better to try to get the professionals there ASAP.

The guide had a radio and was able to call for assistance from his office; the ranger snomo’ed out and met us as we were getting close and the ambulance was waiting.


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Or just take off and leave the guy with the broken leg to make his own way back to the trailhead.
https://www.amazon.com/Touching-Void.../dp/0060730552

Watched a volunteer patroller try to haul a loaded sled up a very slight incline at the base of Sugar Bowl on packed snow. He was having a very hard time going twenty feet. If it is anticipated that a professional evacuation is going to take significant time, equipment, time and effort is best used stabilizing the victim and making them as warm and sheltered as possible while they wait.

[davjr96]

Thanks for all the input and experiences guys! It does sound like I overestimate what is possible to do in a rescue situation without help. I always carry my inreach and cellphone but I'd guess I would like to pretend I could be more self sufficient than I actually would be able to be...

It does look like the BCA Shovel/Axe is still available and then mention that feature on their description https://backcountryaccess.com/en-us/...alanche-shovel but I am not too keen on drilling holes in my skis.

[Jonathan S.]

^ Ah, now I see, thanks, the shovel-only sled utility has been long-since discontinued, yet the sled utility lives on in the form of the combo axe/shovel.
Looks like the straight-shaft axe is a wee bit lighter, and cheaper:
https://backcountryaccess.com/en-us/...alanche-shovel

For drilling holes, I've fitted into the shovel shaft a hex-drive drill bit and a small screwbit driver.
I've experimented on junk skis, and it's not that hard to manually drill a hole in ski tips.

[stealurface831]

I will say this, too: while it may be a hassle to haul someone out, the response time on an SOS can also be brutal. I work SAR and responded to a call just yesterday of a lost hiker. I got there three hours after she initiated the SOS on her PLB. There were crews in the woods already so I worked incident management. It took another two and a half hours or so to get to her. She was maybe a quarter mile off trail. The same goes for a helo, plus or minus a few half hours depending on if they are lining someone in or picking off or whatever. If you think you are able to get yourself or your party out and can do it within six or so hours, you will most likely beat the ground SAR teams.

[davjr96]

This is also intriguing, though expensive https://snapevac.com/collections/fro...ducts/snapevac
It does give me more ideas for DIY options without drilling my skis though.

[summit]

Moving with an emergency/improvised sled has a limited range of snow/terrain use cases that don't result in exhaustingly impossible to move or terrifyingly unsafe experiences for small group rescue. Normally I think in terms of having the ability to drag or low angle lower a few dozen or hundred feet to safer position or LZ, and that would be a lot of work for one or two people. Tarp/emergency bivy (a decent one, not emergency blanket crap), cordellete, tape, ski straps, webbing, and maybe an axe/rope are what I have to (maybe) do that. It's not something I want as Plan A or B. It's Plan Oh-Fuck-What-Choice-Do-I-Have.

I'd rather shelter and treat in place until a safe and workable means to extricate arrives along with sufficient bodies to accomplish the extrication.

A reasonable nonmotorized backcountry snow extrication team should show with a carbon/ti akja (40lbs $4300) or Sked (96x36" 17lbs $700) or Foxtrot (80x18" 4.5lbs $190) plus some other fun patient packaging depending on the situation (eg full body vaccuum splint and a specialized sleeping bag). Akja is amazing for it's purpose of going down through soft snow. Skeds and Foxtrots drag and lower well over snow and scree, although the latter trades rigidity for portability. Ironically the OP's toy sled (54"x18" $12) is the closest "emergency sled" to a Foxtrot, but it would naturally drag feet. You could DIY with this 120"x24"x0.07" HDPE roll for $27.

[old goat]

The euros are way ahead of us on mountain rescue.
https://www.redbull.com/us-en/shows/the-horn

[highangle]

Moving with an emergency/improvised sled has a limited range of snow/terrain use cases that don't result in exhaustingly impossible to move or terrifyingly unsafe experiences for small group rescue. Normally I think in terms of having the ability to drag or low angle lower a few dozen or hundred feet to safer position or LZ, and that would be a lot of work for one or two people. Tarp/emergency bivy (a decent one, not emergency blanket crap), cordellete, tape, ski straps, webbing, and maybe an axe/rope are what I have to (maybe) do that. It's not something I want as Plan A or B. It's Plan Oh-Fuck-What-Choice-Do-I-Have.

I'd rather shelter and treat in place until a safe and workable means to extricate arrives along with sufficient bodies to accomplish the extrication.

A reasonable nonmotorized backcountry snow extrication team should show with a carbon/ti akja (40lbs $4300) or Sked (96x36" 17lbs $700) or Foxtrot (80x18" 4.5lbs $190) plus some other fun patient packaging depending on the situation (eg full body vaccuum splint and a specialized sleeping bag). Akja is amazing for it's purpose of going down through soft snow. Skeds and Foxtrots drag and lower well over snow and scree, although the latter trades rigidity for portability. Ironically the OP's toy sled (54"x18" $12) is the closest "emergency sled" to a Foxtrot, but it would naturally drag feet. You could DIY with this 120"x24"x0.07" HDPE roll for $27.

[stealurface831]

The euros are way ahead of us on mountain rescue.
https://www.redbull.com/us-en/shows/the-horn

The Euros also have AAC cards that won't leave you with a 10k bill for a wee-woo bird.