WASATCH STOKE, CONDITIONS, OBSERVATIONS and ASSORTED DRIVAL 20-21

[schindlerpiste]

Can't be good for Murdoch the Moose, or his many relatives that Forage in and migrate thru Big Mac. Hey, but there are two Colony landowners think this eyesore will somehow protect their investments. Such is life in the Wasatch back

[Boissal]

^^^ I remember reading that this type of fencing is a real nightmare for animals. WTF are these knobs at the colony thinking, they're acting like they built their mansions in the gut of the Mower or another significant slide path. Are any of these pathetic monuments to the owner's vanity actually at risk of getting lanched? And I mean lanched, not dusted by a powder cloud. Either option will make for an impressive story about rugged mountain life when they're at the cuntry club I guess...

[John_B]

Meanwhile at the canyons

Attachment 379076

I think those were installed on the beaches at D-Day.

[telefreewasatch]

DigSki those fences are installed in starting zones to retain slabs.
Looks like a runout in that photo, not a starting zone, no?
Who woulda thunk those folks owned the starting zones...

Dan, gonna be at Butler Middle School the 13th to get a carrying capacity #, as well as a yay safety comment.
I want the thing installed regardless of capacity.
For a fire escape.
Larger capacity sweetens the pot.
Far as line lengths, longest lift is mouth to Tanner's at 3.5 - 4.0 miles? 1,500 vertical?
Different lift at every angle; four lifts to get to the Alta.
Sorry if I come across as a cranky FOG on this one, but its been a vision of mine for longer than many of you have been alive...

[Dantheman]

Far as line lengths, longest lift is mouth to Tanner's at 3.5 - 4.0 miles? 1,500 vertical?
Different lift at every angle; four lifts to get to the Alta.

When the gondola plan first came out last year many of the articles about it described it as the longest gondola in the world (that was also before the La Caille option with the extra angle station). I'll admit to uncritically repeating that claim when I shouldn't have. Apologies for that.

I will bet you a few pitchers that Ski Utah will advertise it as such

[powdork]

How UPD can't place an officer at the mouth of the canyon for five hours in the morning but can dispatch multiple units, tow trucks, fire trucks and ambulances when there is an accident makes no sense.

Don't even see why they would need to. CalTrans handles it here at multiple checkpoints on different roads and sometimes there is a CHP there, but they're free to leave and handle any calls they might get. It basically ends up being like staging and ambulance or fire personnel close to where they are most likely going to be needed anyway.

[powdork]

Dan, gonna be at Butler Middle School the 13th to get a carrying capacity #, as well as a yay safety comment.
I want the thing installed regardless of capacity.
For a fire escape.

Wouldn't it be the first thing down in the event of fire? Regardless it would be the last place I would want to be.

[Iowagriz]

Outsider checking in here...I don't think you want a gondola. That will only allow more coddled people to access the hills and add to the shit show. High speed quads or 6 packs. Keep people in the open, maybe add a bubble, but no heated seats. Multiple chairs would be cheaper than the gondi.

And add a WROD for getting people out. I'd ski a 15 mile snow road to get out if I was able to avoid the red ribbon home.

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[east or bust]

^You you ever been up LCC? If it’s that big of a deal to widen out the road you think they’re going to doze a swath down the entire canyon for Jerlina to ski out?…


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[telefreewasatch]

Wouldn't it be the first thing down in the event of fire? Regardless it would be the last place I would want to be.

Agreed. Last place to be in a forest fire...
"Fire escape" used as a figure of speech here.
Having a second means of ingress / egress is what makes the gondola invaluable for safety.

[One (+) Sentence]

1. Now that you mention it, there very well may be Federal safety regs that require access to the towers if a lift is running. Man, wouldn't that be some shit if road closed = gondola closed. UDOT says that the "gondola alternative can operate independently of S.R. 210" (https://littlecottonwoodeis.udot.utah.gov/) so you would think this has been considered, but it would be a hell of a question to ask at one of the public hearings.
2. This has occurred to me, too. You would think interlodge = no gondola loading (from either end), but I don't know for sure. TFW can probably answer this definitively.

Don’t get me wrong, the idea of resort specific busses leaving every 10 minutes and using a bus only lane sounds good too. We probably need both: expanded and better bus service and the gondola. The solution needs to be multi-faceted.

I just think the gondola is a no-brainer for a lot of destination skiers. To be able to fly to SLC from Dallas, take a shuttle to your hotel, then take a shuttle or Lyft to the gondola station - it will be appealing to those people. They can forego renting a car and driving an unfamiliar mountain canyon altogether (even if dad did drive in a snowstorm that one time in college at Ober Gatlinburg, TN for his annual fraternity DH race.)

Personally, I’ll still be driving my vehicle to Alta most days but I can totally see using the gondola a handful of bluebird days with my kids. I think they’ll think it’s fun and I think tourist’s kids will feel the same. If the gondola takes 1000 cars (the majority being rentals) off the road everyday - I’m down with that.

[schindlerpiste]

^^^Absolutely. At the very least, the gondola will have the potential of eliminating 2000-4000X2 or so cars/day from LCC. This figure is based upon two people/vehicle (4000 people). If the gonj has the capacity to take 4000 to Snowbird during 4 AM hrs., and 4000 down during PM hours, this can potentially eliminate 2000-3000 vehicles up in the morning and 2000-3000 vehicles down in the afternoon. That's a lot of emissions. It is just the beginning of a grand overhaul of transport into and out of the canyon. Baby steps and $$$.

I, for one, will still be driving until there is a gonj from PC to Brighton.


Ride the wasatch

[powdork]

And add a WROD for getting people out. I'd ski a 15 mile snow road to get out if I was able to avoid the red ribbon home.

among the many other issues are the number slide paths it would cross under

[powdork]

personally, i think you guys are fucked. the gondola will most likely absorb a ton of traffic, which is great. but a lot of that will be new traffic created by the gondola and some part of it will be traffic it pulls from BCC. So by the time it finally becomes a reality you will be left with 4,000 more people upcanyon, while still having the same traffic problems (or close to it) you have now.
If you build it, they will come. So there should be some other sort of regulating factor like a road toll if Utah funds the gondola or all paid parking up top if the resorts pay for the gondola.

[Xover]

DTM and TFW need to have a safety meeting on the 13th

[telefreewasatch]

DTM and TFW need to have a safety meeting on the 13th

Safety 1st I say.
Can't pass on this one.
Hope it ain't Dib's Double Black

[Pinned]

personally, i think you guys are fucked. the gondola will most likely absorb a ton of traffic, which is great. but a lot of that will be new traffic created by the gondola and some part of it will be traffic it pulls from BCC. So by the time it finally becomes a reality you will be left with 4,000 more people upcanyon, while still having the same traffic problems (or close to it) you have now.
If you build it, they will come. So there should be some other sort of regulating factor like a road toll if Utah funds the gondola or all paid parking up top if the resorts pay for the gondola.

Agreed. Roads always fill to maximum capacity in busy areas, it is the reason that the highways in LA are all crowded even though they've all been widened. I'd assume the same thing would happen with a gondola.

[googledidoo]

What was the reason the cogwheel train didn't make the cut? Cost?

Why couldn't we first try other measures like mandatory 4 people per car, toll, expanded bus service, etc before a more radical "solution" is implemented?

[skifishbum]

the pilatus bahn cog wheels cools and works pretty good a goat on the tracks shut er down though
the seniority
you git a day a month up canyon for every year youve been a resident of utardia
to radical?
oh and carl fischer aint hucked bad news
just sayin

[Dantheman]

^^^Absolutely. At the very least, the gondola will have the potential of eliminating 2000-4000X2 or so cars/day from LCC. This figure is based upon two people/vehicle (4000 people). If the gonj has the capacity to take 4000 to Snowbird during 4 AM hrs., and 4000 down during PM hours, this can potentially eliminate 2000-3000 vehicles up in the morning and 2000-3000 vehicles down in the afternoon. That's a lot of emissions. It is just the beginning of a grand overhaul of transport into and out of the canyon. Baby steps and $$$.

The bus option keeps just as many cars out of the canyon.

personally, i think you guys are fucked. the gondola will most likely absorb a ton of traffic, which is great. but a lot of that will be new traffic created by the gondola and some part of it will be traffic it pulls from BCC. So by the time it finally becomes a reality you will be left with 4,000 more people upcanyon, while still having the same traffic problems (or close to it) you have now.

Pretty much. It's going to draw crowds of its own that a dialed bus system never would. Ski Utah is also going to plaster the country and the world with ads to come ride it. In the '00s the State Office of Tourism plastered the country with ads to come visit Utah's National Parks and visitation exploded.

Safety 1st I say.
Can't pass on this one.
Hope it ain't Dib's Double Black

If we ever meet up, whatever you're imbibing, I'm buying. We may disagree on this is but I have nothing but respect for you and what you do.

[schindlerpiste]

While this may, or may not be true, bus transport is possibly hazardous during winter conditions, and unless electric, presents concerns associated with fossil fuels. Having said this, I am a personally a fan of gondola (actually one from PC to Brighton and Brighton to Alta) and bus. Also, although I would not use gondola or bus originating from SLC, I think that employing both options are beneficial and necessary

[muted reborn]

While this may, or may not be true, bus transport is possibly hazardous during winter conditions, and unless electric, presents concerns associated with fossil fuels. Having said this, I am a personally a fan of gondola (actually one from PC to Brighton and Brighton to Alta) and bus. Also, although I would not use gondola or bus originating from SLC, I think that employing both options are beneficial and necessary

Buses drive up and down the canyon all the time in snowy weather, it being 'hazardous' is hyperbole. And if they are not electric, a bus is not going to produce 'concerns' about FF if people use them and it takes a bunch of cars off the road.

There is no need for a gondola from PC to BCC or LCC because it's not a safety issue that would be needed. That access is going to crowd the resorts to a point it ruins skiing completely. F*** THAT. PC people can drive around and take the gondola IMO.

[schindlerpiste]

I'll continue to drive from PC to BCC/LCC no problem. My vet. likes the canyons. I was just stating the obvious differences between gondola v bus. (i.e. potential hazard in storm, fossil fuel v electric). Both will reduce autos. (unless # of people in canyon ^). I can try to explain the hazard differences between gondola travel in bus v. gondola, but you would still argue hyperbole. I've seen too many vehicles slide off the road in bcc/lcc to argue with you. Moreover, 50+ busses up and down the canyon/day would release more carbon than the gondola.

[Dantheman]

Buses drive up and down the canyon all the time in snowy weather, it being 'hazardous' is hyperbole. And if they are not electric, a bus is not going to produce 'concerns' about FF if people use them and it takes a bunch of cars off the road.

Technically there is more objective hazard riding the bus, but the risk is still really, really low (google "hazard vs risk" as they are not synonyms). Has anyone ever been killed or even injured riding the ski bus? I can't remember it happening.

All the buses will be electric within 10 years, so the emissions point is moot.

There is no need for a gondola from PC to BCC or LCC because it's not a safety issue that would be needed. That access is going to crowd the resorts to a point it ruins skiing completely. F*** THAT. PC people can drive around and take the gondola IMO.

Pretty much.

[mall walker]

I'll continue to drive from PC to BCC/LCC no problem. My vet. likes the canyons. I was just stating the obvious differences between gondola v bus. (i.e. potential hazard in storm, fossil fuel v electric). Both will reduce autos. (unless # of people in canyon ^). I can try to explain the hazard differences between gondola travel in bus v. gondola, but you would still argue hyperbole. I've seen too many vehicles slide off the road in bcc/lcc to argue with you. Moreover, 50+ busses up and down the canyon/day would release more carbon than the gondola.

I’m curious to see your breakdown of emissions/mile per bus and the total mileage/day vs that of the current car traffic, and vs this proposed gondola, which is powered by…? probably not wind or solar…

cuz it sure feels like you're talking out your ass