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  1. #2051
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    What exactly is your point, Scandy? Is it only that natural immunity is better than the vaccine? Even if that's true do you think people who have never had Covid should get vaccinated? With closing in on six billion shots administered are you willing to admit that the vaccines are safe?
    My point is that each individual needs to look at their own personal situation. Not just follow the mass psychosis everyone seems to be in where taking any consideration into whether you should get the shot gets you shamed.

    I do think if you havenít had covid you should talk to a good doctor who will actually have a non biased discussion about getting the shot. For certain at risk people i definitely think the benefits of the shot outweigh the risks for some people.

    I even said Iíd consider the first shot if I feel like Iím at risk. But at this point I donít think itís worth it considering I have what the most recent data is saying, very good immunity and Iíd like to see more long term and complete data. The Pfizer trial showing worse all cause death for the control group is concerning, especially when 2 people in the placebo group who got the vaccine after the trial also died of heart attacks. Itís bullshit that trial was only 6 months, Iíd like to see that for 2 years as it should have been. And that they got rid of the placebo group by allowing them to vaccinate completely eliminates the chance at finding good long term data. Any vaccine I get Iíve looked into as much data as I could and talked to doctors about it before deciding for or against. And I just donít think the data we have is sufficient yet.

    The doctor Iím talking to has concerns over what heís seen with lower natural T cells in vaccinated people, and wants to see if and how long lasting that is, heís doing his own research with patients heís having get a D-dimer test as heís concerned with what heís seeing in his vaccinated patients. This is a doctor whoís recommended that his older or unhealthy patients get the vaccine, itís the kind of open curiosity that seems to be completely lacking in just about anyone.

    My point is, youíre supposed to ďtrust the scienceĒ yet when I talk to literal experts and they donít align completely with the TV doctor and media talking points, I get a whole book of labels thrown at me by people who formed their opinion based on feedback they get from society and peers rather than truth. Itís turned into a religion.

  2. #2052
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
    “A stupid man's report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand.”
    Agreed

  3. #2053
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    My point is that each individual needs to look at their own personal situation. Not just follow the mass psychosis everyone seems to be in where taking any consideration into whether you should get the shot gets you shamed.
    This is where I believe you are wrong. All of us who have been vaccinated have taken the risks into consideration before doing so and we've concluded that the trivial risks associated with vaccine are massively overshadowed by the public health benefit of having as much of the population vaccinated against COVID-19 as possible. We don't consider it "mass psychosis." We consider it doing what's right for humanity.

  4. #2054
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    My point is that each individual needs to look at their own personal situation. Not just follow the mass psychosis everyone seems to be in where taking any consideration into whether you should get the shot gets you shamed.

    I do think if you haven’t had covid you should talk to a good doctor who will actually have a non biased discussion about getting the shot. For certain at risk people i definitely think the benefits of the shot outweigh the risks for some people.

    I even said I’d consider the first shot if I feel like I’m at risk. But at this point I don’t think it’s worth it considering I have what the most recent data is saying, very good immunity and I’d like to see more long term and complete data. The Pfizer trial showing worse all cause death for the control group is concerning, especially when 2 people in the placebo group who got the vaccine after the trial also died of heart attacks. It’s bullshit that trial was only 6 months, I’d like to see that for 2 years as it should have been. And that they got rid of the placebo group by allowing them to vaccinate completely eliminates the chance at finding good long term data. Any vaccine I get I’ve looked into as much data as I could and talked to doctors about it before deciding for or against. And I just don’t think the data we have is sufficient yet.

    The doctor I’m talking to has concerns over what he’s seen with lower natural T cells in vaccinated people, and wants to see if and how long lasting that is, he’s doing his own research with patients he’s having get a D-dimer test as he’s concerned with what he’s seeing in his vaccinated patients. This is a doctor who’s recommended that his older or unhealthy patients get the vaccine, it’s the kind of open curiosity that seems to be completely lacking in just about anyone.
    How do you know your doctor is good? Because they're telling you what you want to hear?

    My doctor sent me a notification saying to get vaccinated ASAP. He's a good doctor, you should talk to him instead.

    Edit; I will concede that I personally have never looked in to data for any vaccine I've ever taken. Ever. And I never will. Because what the fuck is dumbass Paulster telecom expert going to figure out about a medicine that hundreds (thousands?) of people who know what they're doing have not? I'm not that narcissistic.

  5. #2055
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    This is where I believe you are wrong. All of us who have been vaccinated have taken the risks into consideration before doing so and we've concluded that the trivial risks associated with vaccine are massively overshadowed by the public health benefit of having as much of the population vaccinated against COVID-19 as possible. We don't consider it "mass psychosis." We consider it doing what's right for humanity.
    Plus, any doctor who willingly puts their patients' health at risk while they hum and haw over their own 'research' in direct contrast to the world's scientific consensus, sucks ass.

    I'll put the people who developed this medicine and the peeps over in Health Canada over this super-smart doctor any day.

  6. #2056
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    This is where I believe you are wrong. All of us who have been vaccinated have taken the risks into consideration before doing so and we've concluded that the trivial risks associated with vaccine are massively overshadowed by the public health benefit of having as much of the population vaccinated against COVID-19 as possible. We don't consider it "mass psychosis." We consider it doing what's right for humanity.
    Hey if you did take the risks into consideration and look into it for yourself thatís awesome and I applaud yours and anyone elseís decision. But I feel you might be in the minority.

    I ask real basic questions to vaccinated friends and they have no clue what im talking about. Iíve brought up the ineffectiveness against delta and they still think theyíre completely immune and run around acting like it. And thatís the harm in the narratives being pushed by mainstream media and social media. It encourages ignorance. And I blame right wing news just as much for pushing the other side without encouraging people look into it.

    And in terms of doing whatís right for humanity I guess that gets into much more of a philosophical discussion of does a focus on the greater good, or a focus on the individual create the best society, the most amount of good, and the most cooperation when needed.

  7. #2057
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    And in terms of doing what’s right for humanity I guess that gets into much more of a philosophical discussion
    In this case, no, it's a question of reducing deaths and hospitalizations.

  8. #2058
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    Plus, any doctor who willingly puts their patients' health at risk while they hum and haw over their own 'research' in direct contrast to the world's scientific consensus, sucks ass.

    I'll put the people who developed this medicine and the peeps over in Health Canada over this super-smart doctor any day.
    Oh man I really donít want to get into this but the people who developed the medicine, if by that you mean the companies, are the last people Iíd trust. Like Pfizer who paid the largest criminal fine in US history at the time? Only
    to be beat by another pharma company GSK a few years later? Or Merck selling and falsely advertising vioxx while they knew it was killing 10s of thousands of people potentially into the 100kís?

    Man I used to get called a lefty for hating big pharma, how the turns have tabled.

  9. #2059
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    In this case, no, it's a question of reducing deaths and hospitalizations.
    Eh I think it still applies, whatís more effective, Hoping for top down control and force to do it? Or bottom up cooperation from the individuals. I think the reason you see so much resistance is how much itís being forced on people. A good half the population doesnít respond well to that.

  10. #2060
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    What is the option? Its either vax or infection, that is becoming apparent. I'm almost at the point that everyone without a vax passport having to be infected by force and stay at home. Fight it off old school like 1830s at home using your YouTube knowledge.
    Mrs. Dougw- "I can see how one of your relatives could have been killed by an angry mob."

    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    dougW, you motherfucking dirty son of a bitch.

  11. #2061
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    Eh I think it still applies, what’s more effective, Hoping for top down control and force to do it? Or bottom up cooperation from the individuals. I think the reason you see so much resistance is how much it’s being forced on people. A good half the population doesn’t respond well to that.
    Well, at least here in the U.S. the bottom up approach was tried for many months, and ultimately that failed to produce the desired results.

  12. #2062
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    Oh man I really don’t want to get into this but the people who developed the medicine, if by that you mean the companies, are the last people I’d trust. Like Pfizer who paid the largest criminal fine in US history at the time? Only
    to be beat by another pharma company GSK a few years later? Or Merck selling and falsely advertising vioxx while they knew it was killing 10s of thousands of people potentially into the 100k’s?

    Man I used to get called a lefty for hating big pharma, how the turns have tabled.
    "BIG PHARMA" - we got one!

    You totally have a point. Vaccines must be unsafe. Good for you for being smarter than the rest! Enjoy your natural immunity, and good luck.

  13. #2063
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    Well, at least here in the U.S. the bottom up approach was tried for many months, and ultimately that failed to produce the desired results.
    Eh I think it was the instant politicization of it. Last year the left were saying they wouldnít trust a vaccine rushed to market by Trump, then now itís obviously swapped. I think that had the same effect, one side pushing and shaming the other right off the bat. I never heard a ďhey you should talk your doctor to see if this makes sense for youĒ approach from either side

  14. #2064
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    "BIG PHARMA" - we got one!

    You totally have a point. Vaccines must be unsafe. Good for you for being smarter than the rest! Enjoy your natural immunity, and good luck.
    natural immunity is a conspiracy invented by trump

  15. #2065
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    Eh I think it was the instant politicization of it. Last year the left were saying they wouldn’t trust a vaccine rushed to market by Trump, then now it’s obviously swapped. I think that had the same effect, one side pushing and shaming the other right off the bat. I never heard a “hey you should talk your doctor to see if this makes sense for you” approach from either side
    I don't recall a single American I know saying that.

    Fauci, CNN, all that shit was always saying talk to your doctor. I heard that ad nauseum. Of course, I don't have facebook and my youtube algorithms are all about baseball and lawn maintenance.

    Please take your polyass bullshit to the polyass area.

  16. #2066
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    Eh I think it still applies, whatís the most effective method
    misuse of the word eh ^^

    its suposed to go at the back

    obviously not a Canadian eh
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  17. #2067
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    Iíve brought up the ineffectiveness against delta..... (absolutely verifiable false statement) and they still think theyíre completely immune and run around acting like it.... (if so, they're ignorant, but it fits your narrative) And thatís the harm in the narratives being pushed by mainstream media and social media. It encourages ignorance.
    Your narrative, the antivax crowd, is what is encouraging ignorance

  18. #2068
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    I don't recall a single American I know saying that.
    That bit was fair, because both Biden and Harris--while running against Trump last year--said (in effect) "Trump has been completely untrustworthy on everything related to Covid, so are you going to listen to him when he says take the vaccine? Instead, listen to the experts like Fauci." So there's nuance there, but scandy89 is correct about the politicization.

  19. #2069
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    What does any of this shit have to do with the border reopening?
    ScandyÖ I assumed youíre AmericanÖ do you even want to come to Canada?


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  20. #2070
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2skier112 View Post
    Your narrative, the antivax crowd, is what is encouraging ignorance
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ays/ar-AANeON9

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e3.htm


    But itís cool, just keep running around like youíre bulletproof. This is the issue, the people I bring this to have way too much blind faith, thinking itís sims conspiracy theory that they can still catch it.

  21. #2071
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ays/ar-AANeON9

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e3.htm


    But it’s cool, just keep running around like you’re bulletproof. This is the issue, the people I bring this to have way too much blind faith, thinking it’s sims conspiracy theory that they can still catch it.
    You ignorant fucking cunt!!!!! I never said I was bullet proof!!! Reading comprehension much, dipshit...

    Try reading, then think about if for a few minutes, then post.
    One more time for the stoopids like you; "and they still think they’re completely immune and run around acting like it".... (if so, they're ignorant, but it fits your narrative)

  22. #2072
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ays/ar-AANeON9

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e3.htm


    But itís cool, just keep running around like youíre bulletproof. This is the issue, the people I bring this to have way too much blind faith, thinking itís sims conspiracy theory that they can still catch it.

  23. #2073
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandy89 View Post
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ays/ar-AANeON9

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e3.htm


    But itís cool, just keep running around like youíre bulletproof. This is the issue, the people I bring this to have way too much blind faith, thinking itís sims conspiracy theory that they can still catch it.
    No vaccinated people I know are running around thinking they're bulletproof. If that's what you're seeing with your peers, understand you've surrounded yourself with idiots.

    Edit thanks k2 didn't see your reply.

  24. #2074
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2skier112 View Post
    You ignorant fucking cunt!!!!! I never said I was bullet proof!!! Reading comprehension much, dipshit...

    Try reading, then think about if for a few minutes, then post.
    One more time for the stoopids like you; "and they still think they’re completely immune and run around acting like it".... (if so, they're ignorant, but it fits your narrative)

    Haha calm down buddy. You said The ineffectiveness against delta was an ďabsolutely verifiable false statementĒ thatís the thinking of the ďrunning around like theyíre bulletproof crowdĒ

  25. #2075
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    Time for the resident dirtbag with 5 tv channels and living with 5+ roomies, not to mention freshly off government handouts to restart name-calling and provide us with his advanced opinions...lol sub 14K posts
    Last edited by teamdirt; 09-15-2021 at 06:36 PM.

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