School Me on All Mountain Ski Choices

[charles martel]

So, in another thread over in Gear Swap, I passed on some pretty nice older Dynastar Legend Pro Riders in order to get some newer skis. I've done a lot of research, read lot and have seen a lot of videos. All the skis I picked are last year's model and they all are $400 or less on sale right now. I would get the longest version of whatever I decide to buy.

I am leaning towards the Rossignol Black Ops 98. Probably get it in a 192. Strong ski but versatile with a playful side, so you can do short swing turns and powerful GS turns. I like the review of the ski by Ski Essentials, as they do good videos skiing down from the top of Stowe. I also like the Rossignol Experience 94. I see both of these skis have an air tip, which makes them stable, but also a little softer in tip and tail, so they have a playful side, and work pretty good in uneven conditions. And, the Rossignol Sky Seven HD looks like a lot of fun, but more for play than serious carving. Any thoughts here?

I also like the Dynastar Legend X 96, along with the Dynastar Menace 98. Any ideas here?

The Head Kore 99 looks like a traditional head innovation, very lightweight, but strikes me as being closer to a traditional ski with just some early rise. Since I'm looking for something different than I'm used to, this would probably be my least favorite choice.

Anyway, any thoughts are appreciated here. Thanks so much.

[The SnowShow]

Are they red?

[charles martel]

Are they red?

Need you ask???

[m2711c]

demo the head kore before you dismiss it... it skis sweet.

[gregL]

Every ski is an all mountain ski if you point it in the right direction and have the right skill set.

Every ski is an all mountain ski if it's your only ski.

What's your definition?

If you're looking to throw down some "powerful GS turns" and engage in some "serious carving," a traditional ski with a bit of early rise in the tip may be just what you want. Is there a reason you want a bunch of tail rocker?

[DarthMarkus]

My 2 cents:


Rossignol Black Ops 98: A well rounded ski for a variety of purposes. Stiffer in the tips and tails than the Menace 98. Not as edgy as the Experience 94. Probably more all-mountain than your other choices, but all-mountain is a pretty relative term in regards to the user.

Dynastar Menace 98: Metal plate underfoot, so underfoot you're quite stable, but a lot less so in the tips and tails. Same construction as the 6th Sense Slicer from the past. Has "springblades" graduating into the tip and tail, essentially they thin out the material the further you go into the tips and tails. This gives a little more playful feel there, as well as a fairly poppy ski. More multi-directional than most of your other choices. Good in moguls, trees, and some touring. Probably would rather the Black Ops if speed is the name of your game. This ski would rather maneuver in and out of the crud than it would blast through it. A lot of turn radii depending on how much you push those tips.

Experience 94: Lots of shape in this ski. It likes to ski on edge. Better for carving turns than your other choices, but it also means that they hook up in variable conditions more than the others would. Still conquers a variety of conditions, but achieves it through a different route - you'll probably carve through moguls more than you'd want to be in the trough. You'll also probably want to do more GS style turns through crud than you'd want to just point it.

As for the others, I would take a lot of skis over the sky 7.

Legend 96 has some similar dimension as the sky 7, just at a much more reasonable amount; pretty maneuverable ski, but still has a flat tail and is pretty stiff.

Otherwise there's a bit wanting regarding your skiing. Or if you're looking to change things up, what exactly that might mean in regards to parts of the mountain, how you ski those parts, or what conditions you're skiing in.

EDIT: It's also worth noting that there is a reason Rossignol and Dynastar are offloading their 19/20 models - both companies have revamped the majority of their ski lineup.

[charles martel]

Every ski is an all mountain ski if you point it in the right direction and have the right skill set.

Every ski is an all mountain ski if it's your only ski.

What's your definition?

If you're looking to throw down some "powerful GS turns" and engage in some "serious carving," a traditional ski with a bit of early rise in the tip may be just what you want. Is there a reason you want a bunch of tail rocker?

Fun to slide around some time.

[charles martel]

...Otherwise there's a bit wanting regarding your skiing. Or if you're looking to change things up, what exactly that might mean in regards to parts of the mountain, how you ski those parts, or what conditions you're skiing in...

I never kept up with gear over the years. Had long OG LPs, Stockli Scot Schmidts, Head Supermojos in 180 and 190, and B-Squads. But, got rid of that and went skinny with Fischer GSs >35 and some mildly rockered Scott Black Magics, 80 waist with two layers of Ti. Both work well in everything but deeper stuff. I had the Scotts in 15" of fresh and they were fine, but they are not, by choice, playful and versatile. But, they were 125 new.

If you look at good skiers on each of the skis I mentioned in the video reviews, they are pretty versatile--which is what I want in a third ski. Here are some examples:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...9278BA965C80C6

[gregL]

If you look at good skiers on each of the skis I mentioned in the video reviews, they are pretty versatile--which is what I want in a third ski.

They are all very good skis. I'd be happy to ski any of them with the exception of the Sky 7 HD (Experience 94 is a little tip heavy, but great once you get it on edge). The old Legend Pro skis were great in their day and still would be, for that matter. However, if you're looking for something with more tail rocker to get the tails to break loose easier, I'd say the Black Ops 98 is the most logical pick of what you've mentioned so far. Menace 98 would also be a solid choice.

Skis you've not mentioned but fit the description? How about the Blizzard Rustler 9, Armada ARV 96, Line Vision 98, Völkl Revolt 95 or Faction Candide 2.0? All great skis and available cheap in last year's color.

[noslow]

Lots of good all mountain skis available on deals right now because of either replacement models or just new topsheets coming out next year. Kendo 88/92, Mantra M5 only go to 184cm(but measure close to that) and all are very good edge hold skis that are still good off piste. Traditional mounts but have lines at +1cm and +2 cm to make them a bit more forgiving of stance.

Enforcer 93 and Brahma 88 are being replaced with new versions but both are great all mountain skis and E93 available in 193cm lengths at deals.

I owned the Menace 98 in 181cm and 187cm with the longer length being very stable at high speeds but not as fun trying to carve at lower speeds. Their blunt sloped tip shape(like the Black Ops 98) bulldozes crud like crazy when things are rough though and their flat rocker not as easy to pivot in variable snow. Sold them and got the Fisher 102FR and it was a huge upgrade. Not as damp(no rubber dampening) but great edge grip and carving performance when you want it. A long, smooth tip slope that easily glides over rough terrain like it’s not there and very stable at high speeds for its turn radius. Comes in a 191cm and only a top sheet change next year and deals on last years version. Can move the mount up to make it more playful.

Legend 96 skis are light, stiff with lots of taper so not great in heavy crud and not great on firm. The videos are on soft snow for a reason. Lol

Experience 94 is a good ski if it’s within the last 2 years since the tip update that doesn’t catch in crud etc like the old one did. Think I’d prefer a heavier, damper Enforcer 93 over it though.

[waxman]

The guys in the X96 video are on skis that are 2 sizes too short for them. This is why i take all internet reviews with a grain of salt. Dude give the ski a crap review when you read it and you would cross it off your list. Then you see them ski and they are average at best and in the back seat for most of the run.

[DarthMarkus]

I never kept up with gear over the years. Had long OG LPs, Stockli Scot Schmidts, Head Supermojos in 180 and 190, and B-Squads. But, got rid of that and went skinny with Fischer GSs >35 and some mildly rockered Scott Black Magics, 80 waist with two layers of Ti. Both work well in everything but deeper stuff. I had the Scotts in 15" of fresh and they were fine, but they are not, by choice, playful and versatile. But, they were 125 new.

Given your previous skis and intentions, I think you would be pretty happy on the Black Ops 98 or the Menace 98.

[charles martel]

They are all very good skis. I'd be happy to ski any of them with the exception of the Sky 7 HD (Experience 94 is a little tip heavy, but great once you get it on edge). The old Legend Pro skis were great in their day and still would be, for that matter. However, if you're looking for something with more tail rocker to get the tails to break loose easier, I'd say the Black Ops 98 is the most logical pick of what you've mentioned so far. Menace 98 would also be a solid choice.

Skis you've not mentioned but fit the description? How about the Blizzard Rustler 9, Armada ARV 96, Line Vision 98, Völkl Revolt 95 or Faction Candide 2.0? All great skis and available cheap in last year's color.

This is a big help. Those skis you suggested will deserve a look, for sure.

Lots of good all mountain skis available on deals right now because of either replacement models or just new topsheets coming out next year. Kendo 88/92, Mantra M5 only go to 184cm(but measure close to that) and all are very good edge hold skis that are still good off piste. Traditional mounts but have lines at +1cm and +2 cm to make them a bit more forgiving of stance.

Enforcer 93 and Brahma 88 are being replaced with new versions but both are great all mountain skis and E93 available in 193cm lengths at deals.

I owned the Menace 98 in 181cm and 187cm with the longer length being very stable at high speeds but not as fun trying to carve at lower speeds. Their blunt sloped tip shape(like the Black Ops 98) bulldozes crud like crazy when things are rough though and their flat rocker not as easy to pivot in variable snow. Sold them and got the Fisher 102FR and it was a huge upgrade. Not as damp(no rubber dampening) but great edge grip and carving performance when you want it. A long, smooth tip slope that easily glides over rough terrain like it’s not there and very stable at high speeds for its turn radius. Comes in a 191cm and only a top sheet change next year and deals on last years version. Can move the mount up to make it more playful.

Legend 96 skis are light, stiff with lots of taper so not great in heavy crud and not great on firm. The videos are on soft snow for a reason. Lol

Experience 94 is a good ski if it’s within the last 2 years since the tip update that doesn’t catch in crud etc like the old one did. Think I’d prefer a heavier, damper Enforcer 93 over it though.

Thanks--I owned some older non-rocjered Mantras. Discovered after they sent me flying that the previous owner subtly rockered them just in front of the bindings. It only showed up when you compressed the skis together, or when you skied them. They were unskiable.

The Black Ops or Experience may work for me. If we have a season. Just talked to one resort somewhat near me and they are planning opening only a few slopes, requiring reservations, etc. A friend of mine worked at Carinthia. The staff has dispersed from the region and gone home. Probably will only have a very limited park this year.

The guys in the X96 video are on skis that are 2 sizes too short for them. This is why i take all internet reviews with a grain of salt. Dude give the ski a crap review when you read it and you would cross it off your list. Then you see them ski and they are average at best and in the back seat for most of the run.

Could be. Same for reviews of other sports equipment, too. Btw, I'm a long ski guy, but only weigh 190. As you imply, technique helps a lot. Skiing GS a lot help keep that sharp. And, as I pointed out on TGR before, you can ski GS skis through most conditions, but crust over deep snow or simply deep and heavy snow. Thanks.

TGR is a great place.

[charles martel]

Given your previous skis and intentions, I think you would be pretty happy on the Black Ops 98 or the Menace 98.

Sorry, missed your comment. Small phone screen. You make a lot of sense. I appreciate it.

[Vt-Freeheel]

Reads like an Alpinezone thread.

[charles martel]

Reads like an Alpinezone thread.

Do we need some profanity, then?

[old goat]

Thanks--I owned some older non-rocjered Mantras. Discovered after they sent me flying that the previous owner subtly rockered them just in front of the bindings. It only showed up when you compressed the skis together, or when you skied them. They were unskiable.

I wouldn't necessarily blame the previous owner. Mine (the red ones) did that to themselves. Went from being ice proof to completely unable to hold an edge.

[gregL]

If we have a season. Just talked to one resort somewhat near me and they are planning opening only a few slopes, requiring reservations, etc. A friend of mine worked at Carinthia. The staff has dispersed from the region and gone home. Probably will only have a very limited park this year.

You are in Kärnten, Austria?

[gregL]

More likely Vermont . . .

[gregL]

Was going to ask about terrain and snow at Naβfeld, which I've always wanted to ski but so far haven't gotten around to.

[charles martel]

You are in Kärnten, Austria?

Western New York, but I get over the Lake Placid, too.

As it stands, We have a big problem in this region. A lot of Canadians come down to the private resort South of Buffalo called Holimont. And a lot of them right next door at Holiday Valley.

The border to Canada is closed. Finite. If they cannot get the border open, I think a lot of the resorts around here are going to be skiing on 1 or 2 trails all Winter. Plus they're talking about needing reservations.

[m2711c]

at least holiday valley can try for the ohio market.... holimont is limited to weekdays only for interlopers. do you know if they are thinking about selling tickets to the unwashed masses on the weekends this year?

[charles martel]

Dropped the nickel on some Rossi Black Ops 98 @ 192 from ASO Gear/Corbett's out of Oakville, Ontario.

Thanks for all the advice.

[skibrd]

Western New York, but I get over the Lake Placid, too.

As it stands, We have a big problem in this region. A lot of Canadians come down to the private resort South of Buffalo called Holimont. And a lot of them right next door at Holiday Valley.

The border to Canada is closed. Finite. If they cannot get the border open, I think a lot of the resorts around here are going to be skiing on 1 or 2 trails all Winter. Plus they're talking about needing reservations.

I’m a few hours late apparently, but here’s my $.02...

I’ve skied both Holimont and the Valley a bunch. I grew up in Amherst, my sister and I taught at the Valley, my moms a troller at Holimont.

I’ve skied a bunch of what has been suggested and personally if I moved back to Buffalo (Jackson Hole has been home for 6 winters now) I’d bring my Rustler 9s and Brahams home. You can’t go wrong with either, just depends on your ski style. The Rustler 9 is super playful, but can still hold a medium speed carve, which short of pointing it down Expo, is as fast as you’ll go back home. The Brahma is a rocket ship, and maybe the most versatile ski I’ve ever been on. The Blister reviews of both skis are spot on if you want more info about them.

Last time I checked Mud Sweat and Gears had Rustler 9s for sale, depending on the size you need Nick and Miguel should be able to set you up nice and easily.

Good luck! I was talking to my mom about Holimonts plans for the winter with the boarder closed and it sounds like they plan to open!


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[charles martel]

Just arrived!