Canada

[ex-powderbroker]

You have spun this into a nicey-nice justification for the shit show that is your knee and Canadian healthcare. And I don't doubt that most of what you are saying is true, but the fact is you received shitty service and it took forever, period. And this is bull shit. Because you (or your neighbors that actually work) pay insane amounts of taxes for this.

I grew up in Canada, was educated in excellent Canadian schools. Most of my immediate family still lives in Canada, working and some retired. I have worked in Canada. I have been living and working just over the border in the US for almost 20 years now, including business ownership. I have had several surgeries in both Canada and the US. I have been in ICU...I have had accidents happen in the US and all the follow-up done in Canada (while going to University). I can tell you that most Americans don't know how the Canadian system works, but the perception is its "free". I can also tell you that Canadians don't have a damn clue how it works in the US.

My brother waited close to a year for a knee MRI in Canada because he was young, it wasn't acute enough (meaning he wasn't in a wheel chair). In my opinion the service my dad received in Canada for colon cancer was slower than molasses (but it was "free"). In the US I have always had very good timely service. I am fortunate enough that our business puts health insurance first and we have good insurance. Yes it costs money. Is my deductible $5k? No it isn't. Am I making dentists wages? No. Do my parents living in Canada have to buy extra insurance to travel to the US? Yes. Is it cheap? No. If you are hard working mid-to low income American that doesn't have insurance through work, does that suck? yes. is it right? No.

The reality is that most of Canada has settled for mediocre/shit service and support, because they don't know any better. And it is expensive.
The American system is far from perfect, there are lots of folks that are disadvantaged and put in bad spot due to this. But in general service is top notch.
There are pros and cons to both systems. Period. If you think Canadian healthcare is free and awesome, you are wrong.

There weren't non-emergency surgeries going on in NY because of the rona, not really the health care systems fault there either if you were waiting months.

So far i'm happy not paying $650usd/mo with a 5k deductible on top of taxes that are basically the same in Quebec as NYC.

If the wait times are so bad why doesn't anyone make this a campaign issue instead of talking about Oil and Jesus?

[yeahman]

Insurance in the US is free or almost free through Obamacare if you are low or middle income. High deductible, yes, but above that it is excellent coverage. And you can pay off the deductible to the hospital on an installment plan. So it's not as bad a system as it used to be--as long as you remain under the income threshold to receive the subsidy.

[BCMtnHound]

Insurance in the US is free or almost free through Obamacare if you are low or middle income. High deductible, yes, but above that it is excellent coverage. And you can pay off the deductible to the hospital on an installment plan. So it's not as bad a system as it used to be--as long as you remain under the income threshold to receive the subsidy.

So you'e saying, either be the ski bum, or the one who owns the hill.
What was that saying, at either end of the wealth spectrum is a leisure class?

[yeahman]

So you'e saying, either be the ski bum, or the one who owns the hill.
What was that saying, at either end of the wealth spectrum is a leisure class?

Well, if you consider 92k* annual income (for a family of 4) in the ski bum realm, then yes, be bums. That is the income threshold currently. Seems high to me but I live in an affordable community. If you live in an urban area, 92k probably doesn't go as far.

*edited

[altasnob]

Where do you get the 92k from? In Washington, a family of four must make less than $36,156 to qualify for the free state health care plan. In Seattle, you couldn't afford to live in a car on the side of a street for 36k a year.

You can see how poor you have to be to qualify at links below:

https://www.healthcare.gov/lower-costs/

https://www.hca.wa.gov/health-care-s...ividual-adults

[altasnob]

US is currently 61% white and getting more non-white each day. By 2024, and definitely by 2028, Texas is predicted to vote for a democratic presidential candidate. I see Trump and the rise of MAGA in the US as an animal kicking and gasping for their last breath before they die out.

Canada is 78% white, but like the US, is getting more non-white each day. What happens when Canada is 61% white like the US is now. Are we going to see the rise of Trump and MAGA in Canada then? Currently, Canada enjoys stability and happiness because, like Norway, it is a relatively homogeneous country backed by oil money.

[LeeLau]

US is currently 61% white and getting more non-white each day. By 2024, and definitely by 2028, Texas is predicted to vote for a democratic presidential candidate. I see Trump and the rise of MAGA in the US as an animal kicking and gasping for their last breath before they die out.

Canada is 78% white, but like the US, is getting more non-white each day. What happens when Canada is 61% white like the US is now. Are we going to see the rise of Trump and MAGA in Canada then? Currently, Canada enjoys stability and happiness because, like Norway, it is a relatively homogeneous country backed by oil money.

Urban Canada is already exceedingly non-white.

Not for one instant have I ever thought that there would come a time in Canada when there are yellow people swinging from lamp posts.

The US on the other hand. Well Charlottesville was just the start

[garyfromterrace]

Currently, Canada enjoys stability and happiness because, like Norway, it is a relatively homogeneous country backed by oil money.

Uh, yeah like man that's just your opinion.

And my opinion is that it's full of shit.

[teamdirt]

True colours finally show thx to this thread.... I thought I was the only ignorant blue collared working stiff in Canada that skis and has faced an incredible amount of hardship in life. Glad some of u pussies finally have a voice for urself....

[BCMtnHound]

The fastest growing population in Canada, besides immigration, is 1st Nations. At least in BC, it would serve many well to resolve our land disputes sooner than later. And find the means to raise the standard of living in northern Canada across the board. Or I think there could be potential for social unrest Oka style at a level that might strain the populous across the country.
Not saying resolving any of those issues is simple, far from it, but the penny now will save a pound later. But the political will, corporate interest, and certainly entrenched bigotry, are preventing that from happening, even with the courts wagging their finger at us.

[yeahman]

Where do you get the 92k from? In Washington, a family of four must make less than $36,156 to qualify for the free state health care plan. In Seattle, you couldn't afford to live in a car on the side of a street for 36k a year.

You can see how poor you have to be to qualify at links below:

https://www.healthcare.gov/lower-costs/

https://www.hca.wa.gov/health-care-s...ividual-adults

Well, I mostly get it from the fact that I have been enrolled through Healthcare.gov for almost 10 years. Actually it looks like they raised it some.

For 2020 coverage, that upper income cap is $49,960 for a single person and $103,000 for a family of four.)

[altasnob]

So you are saying you get free or almost free health care through Obamacare with a family of four making 92k a year? The income level cut off varies from state to state so it is hard to compare. Maybe at that income level in your state you get a subsidized rate, but that is not "free or almost free." There are lots of arguments one can make on how US health care is superior to Canada but "free or almost free" for middle income earners is not one of them.

[altasnob]

Currently, there is essential no illegal immigration from the US to Canada (and hardly any illegal immigration into Canada through any means). This isn't because of border security but because illegal immigrants to the US rather take their chances with the US than Canada at the moment. As US becomes more of a shitty place to live, and more economic opportunity available in Canada relative to the US, you will see more people illegally immigrating to Canada. Wonder how that will change politics up there?

[danmelon]

US is currently 61% white and getting more non-white each day.

There was a time when North America was 100% non white.

[yeahman]

So you are saying you get free or almost free health care through Obamacare with a family of four making 92k a year? The income level cut off varies from state to state so it is hard to compare. Maybe at that income level in your state you get a subsidized rate, but that is not "free or almost free." There are lots of arguments one can make on how US health care is superior to Canada but "free or almost free" for middle income earners is not one of them.

I'm saying we pay about $140 a month for a high deductible plan that costs about $1700 a month. The rest is covered by the subsidy. You can make of that what you will. Seems like "almost free" insurance to me. BTW never conflate health care with health insurance. Two separate things.

[The Tortoise]

What fraction of the US has a plan like that?

[yeahman]

What fraction of the US has a plan like that?

It's a little hard to tell but enrollment appears to be about 10-20 million (pop. ~350 million). There are some restrictions, for example if you qualify for insurance through your employer you are not eligible for Obamacare (we don't). Not sure about other restrictions. I think some people just aren't aware or don't take advantage of it. Doesn't help that Trump killed the budget or educating the public and publicizing enrollment windows.

[Angle Parking]

There was a time when North America was 100% non white.

Merci!

[eldereldo]

I think the biggest difference between the US and Canadian health care systems is not how it is paid for, but the fact that the US side is for profit, so the costs billed to the payer, whether the insurance company or the user are so much higher because the companies providing the service are in it to make a profit.. In addition, it seems that the insurance that health care providers have to carry in the US contributes a significant difference to the ultimate cost. At least from what I know from doctor friends who have worked in both the US and Canada. Ultimately it’s a decision as to whether a service like health care should be left to the private sector, or be a government responsibility. There are lots of other instances you could compare like eduction, infrastructure etc where that choice can be made, and has been made to be one or the other.

[The AD]

There was a time when North America was 100% non white.

So now you're just pissing off the polar bears and arctic foxes.

[paulster2626]

The way it works is they give you some stupid-ass initial date for an MRI that is weeks/months out. If you actually call them back and ask for a quicker date, they usually comply - or get your doctor/specialist to do so.

I mean, it's what I did at least when I fucked up my knee. First appointment was like a month out, asked them for something sooner "okay Paulster we have a 4am slot open next Thursday" but I was working nights so that's no good - "okay then how about the next day at 5pm?" I even showed up 5 hours earlier for the MRI appt. cause I had hockey tickets and it was going to be tight scheduling, asked the girl at the check-in counter if she could accommodate my situation, told her I'm cool waiting the entire time until my actual appt. I go sit down, open up a book, don't even get through one page before "Paulster, please come to the back" and away we go.

Maybe that's a benefit of living in the armpit of Canada vs. 14 hours away from a major city? I dunno... In any case, thanks for reading my story.

[LeeLau]

In North Van MRI waits are now about a week and a half due to the Province hiring more technicians. Delays are to be expected up north

[XXX-er]

In North Van MRI waits are now about a week and a half due to the Province hiring more technicians. Delays are to be expected up north

yeah we are not SWO or vangroovy, there are just not too many places up narth that have enough pop to support an MRI machine or an Orthopedic surgeon, or a surgeon of any kind so that usually means Terrace or PeeG for MRI or surgery altho there is a cutter in Kitimat a SA doctor who is there cuz he wants to fish.


The cutters& specialists DO schedule surgery days as needed where ever there might be a hospitol, my buddy the anesthetist was telling me at some point patients were coming from PeeG 1 hr west to Vanderhoof of all places for surgery cuz there was an open OR room

if you get too sick to treat or they can't figure it out the system will medivac you to VGH/ st pauls/ childrens


my take on jumping the cue, once you get in the system do you want to ride it out or change horses in mid stream, travel 14hrs to spend 5000$ in a private clinic ?

[danmelon]

So now you're just pissing off the polar bears and arctic foxes.

my uncle posted this one on fb

[XXX-er]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...2020-1.5718589

this is a timely artical given the discussion on OR waits

https://www.healthmatchbc.org/?utm_s...THBssrNjgN9LSw

I get this every other day on my FB page unsolicited and I imagine every MD and nurse in Alberta is getting this as well