$600 a week

[Jax]

i've had an employee this last couple weeks bragging about how much he is collecting, refusing to work unless its cash, vaping high concentrate thc constantly, bring his own alcohol to work, etc....it's amazing sometimes to witness. he's buying used jet skis w his money. yeah.

But, that's supporting the economy, just not in the way many ppl had hoped. For him, it's easy come, easy go. He'll be broke in a month and wondering why he didn't save a damn cent.

[highangle]

Whatta douche.

God forbid you thought instead of accepting any party line cocksucking Ben Dover assfucking position, repub or dem. They both suck but not as much as you.
Enjoy the theatre

"Both sides"? Whatabout your mom? Somebody been Pootin that in her... brain too?

[highangle]

But, that's supporting the economy, just not in the way many ppl had hoped. For him, it's easy come, easy go. He'll be broke in a month and wondering why he didn't save a damn cent.

He just made that shit up. Note how impossible any of it would be to substantiate. Note how shitty-paying a line of work byates and his imaginary friend would have to be in for $600/wk to make the imaginary friend go "n-rich" with new-found wealth, and for byates himself to not only witness the results but form a negative judgement about it and then go on to imply subordinates getting all "n-rich" with their $600/wk on top of $300/wk UI bennies is a typical scenario, and good reason why Federal $$ shouldn't go to people out of work due to Covid19.


Edited: Changes all instances of ""redneck rich"" to "n-rich" so C-Shot doesn't have to put me on IGNORE for being nice to Conundrum.

[Core Shot]

Sweet. Hangle just outed himself as a racist by switching from n-word rich to redneck rich after a call out of his racist n word drivel.

You just might be the first maggot I put on ignore.

[wooley12]

I'm of the opinion that are the ones who feign shock at the n word on a ski forum of strangers are racists. And they will go on and on how they are not. Just my observation of human behavior for half a century. Keep in mind that I believe we all are somewhere on the spectrum of racist. I'd like to be proven wrong.

And happy for the snowmobile dealer who got a sale with government money. Anyone who invested it was selfish. We were supposed to spend it.

[Adolf Allerbush]

What's needed, for Goldmember's situation or maybe CS's, is some sort of certification process so un-certified roofers can't low ball and snatch work out from underneath. this is good for everyone because it means the people that do a good job are rewarded for their skills and the owners of these companies are allowed some assurances that if they pay more everyone is paying more, so the competition will remain. This of course runs counter to the political leanings of many in the construction contractor business...but that seems like what's needed to me.

[Toadman]

I thought Trump and ICE had rounded up all the illegals that were working in America? WTF? How can these shady under the table illegals and tax dodgers still be working? I really feel like I can't get an honest answer out of Trump these days. I have to come on TGR to get the real truth about what is going on in America at the poor and middle class level. Carry on.

[AdironRider]

Not that it matters. Like gun criminals, the lowballers aren't getting a license or paying taxes / following the law in the first place.

[GoldMember]

Intended for Adolph - There are certifications available and we carry them. For example, we carry one certification that's specific to one manufacturer that is very stringent and less than 1% of roofers have earned it. However, owners often don't care, provided they can get the warranties offered by the company. It's a statement of the quality of our work but so long as manufacturers will provide warranties, owners don't care.

Construction is largely driven by price, particularly public works where low bid is the only criteria to getting the work, generally speaking. It largely comes down to doing quality work, productively. Experienced crews are clearly more productive than inexperienced but they also earn more so it tends to level out.

My particular issue with quality is that I won't support low quality. If that were our value proposition; cut throat prices with questionable quality, I wouldn't be here. However, there are buyers who really don't care so much about the quality side and ONLY want the low price. We just fully replaced a roof that was only four years old that one of our competitors did because it was so poorly constructed. We provided a fully warranted system for the owner who now is regretting his original decision. But that's what happens.

Also, property managers are notorious for taking the absolute lowest price they can get, damn the quality of the system. They also largely don't care about the longer term value of the building as they don't own it. There are all sorts of different buyers with different priorities and it's hard to regulate the certification process when there are so many different priorities and a general lack of knowledge on the part of buyers.

[Toadman]

Not that it matters. Like gun criminals, the lowballers aren't getting a license or paying taxes / following the law in the first place.

Well, that actually makes sense.

[Core Shot]

GM. Have you thought about buying the company?
SBA 7A loan. 10% down beg borrow or steal from family?

It seems the biz ain’t worth shit without you running it.
Absentee owner.

SBA guarantees up to 75% of the loan so your local bank has minimal risk.

I borrowed over $900k to buy my biz. No experience in that trade. But the bank trusted my character and the Sba guarantee made them fearless.

In year ten when the loan was retired that was $100k more in free cash flow.

[GoldMember]

GM. Have you thought about buying the company?
SBA 7A loan. 10% down beg borrow or steal from family?

It seems the biz ain’t worth shit without you running it.
Absentee owner.

SBA guarantees up to 75% of the loan so your local bank has minimal risk.

I borrowed over $900k to buy my biz. No experience in that trade. But the bank trusted my character and the Sba guarantee made them fearless.

In year ten when the loan was retired that was $100k more in free cash flow.

Ha! No, not interested in buying it. Believe me, the owner would love for me to buy it but that's not my purpose in being here. This is a 'hobby job' for me. I had a company that I sold 13 years ago that's my retirement. I don't want to put that money at risk as I don't have recovery time if this were to fail. I'm 64, been here about a year and a half and was only intending to be here for 2-3 years, to build it up and help the owner navigate through a sale.

My former company was much larger (manufacturer of a custom construction product) and more interesting. The problem with this company is that there's really nothing proprietary about it so it's difficult to scale and there's no real intrinsic 'blue sky' to speak of as it's generally viewed as a commodity item (although I disagree with that thought but that's largely how the market views it).

Between my old company and this one, I worked for a larger GC in business development and government affairs then ran a non-profit business accelerator for technology startups. The latter was very interesting in that I was dealing with PhD's and other scientists along with technologists who were trying to get from concept to the market. Smart people and fun to work with. Going from that to roofers is an interesting spectrum of experience but, I like these guys and they genuinely do work hard and do a great job so, it's satisfying in that way. However, as a business investment, not where I want to be.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Intended for Adolph - There are certifications available and we carry them. For example, we carry one certification that's specific to one manufacturer that is very stringent and less than 1% of roofers have earned it. However, owners often don't care, provided they can get the warranties offered by the company. It's a statement of the quality of our work but so long as manufacturers will provide warranties, owners don't care.

Construction is largely driven by price, particularly public works where low bid is the only criteria to getting the work, generally speaking. It largely comes down to doing quality work, productively. Experienced crews are clearly more productive than inexperienced but they also earn more so it tends to level out.

My particular issue with quality is that I won't support low quality. If that were our value proposition; cut throat prices with questionable quality, I wouldn't be here. However, there are buyers who really don't care so much about the quality side and ONLY want the low price. We just fully replaced a roof that was only four years old that one of our competitors did because it was so poorly constructed. We provided a fully warranted system for the owner who now is regretting his original decision. But that's what happens.

Also, property managers are notorious for taking the absolute lowest price they can get, damn the quality of the system. They also largely don't care about the longer term value of the building as they don't own it. There are all sorts of different buyers with different priorities and it's hard to regulate the certification process when there are so many different priorities and a general lack of knowledge on the part of buyers.

I totally understand that...I guess what I should've said is that we need some sort of certification process on both sides of the equation. That way the property owner can't simply select the low ball offer without some ramification. You put up an un-certified roof that's on you and you run the risk alone. If you sell the property you have to re-roof per certification or property can't be sold. It wont' solve all problems, but it puts a big risk on the property owner to select the low ball crappy roof. If you're planning on being in your home for 30 years and you want to run that risk, go for it...but if you think you might sell within the life of that roof then you best be getting the certified one or you can't sell your pad.

Thing is, all of this costs money...you need higher taxes to ensure that there is some sort of governing mechanism to take care of these things...and no one, including yours truly, wants to pay more in taxes....but that's what would be needed IMV to implement such a program.

Anyhow, the chances of anything like I'm suggesting happening is almost zero...mental masturbation.

[GoldMember]

I totally understand that...I guess what I should've said is that we need some sort of certification process on both sides of the equation. That way the property owner can't simply select the low ball offer without some ramification. You put up an un-certified roof that's on you and you run the risk alone. If you sell the property you have to re-roof per certification or property can't be sold. It wont' solve all problems, but it puts a big risk on the property owner to select the low ball crappy roof. If you're planning on being in your home for 30 years and you want to run that risk, go for it...but if you think you might sell within the life of that roof then you best be getting the certified one or you can't sell your pad.

Thing is, all of this costs money...you need higher taxes to ensure that there is some sort of governing mechanism to take care of these things...and no one, including yours truly, wants to pay more in taxes....but that's what would be needed IMV to implement such a program.

Anyhow, the chances of anything like I'm suggesting happening is almost zero...mental masturbation.

Well, first, we don't do houses, strictly non-residential so a bit different animal. As for owners choosing price over quality, there is a time it comes back on them, like the guy whose roof we did 4 years after having a low-baller come in. That was an expensive lessen for him. Also, on commercial real estate, often times when inspections are done prior to a sale, the sale price of the property will be discounted the value of a replacement roof as the new owner will be looking to either replace the existing roof or, at least, getting a price discount due to the condition of it. There is another instance when the current owner would have been better off with a quality product to start with. Anyway, the market has a way of figuring these things out and bringing in a regulatory fix would add costs that you might not even consider. Not worth it. Thanks for the thoughts on it, though!

[Adolf Allerbush]

Well, first, we don't do houses, strictly non-residential so a bit different animal. As for owners choosing price over quality, there is a time it comes back on them, like the guy whose roof we did 4 years after having a low-baller come in. That was an expensive lessen for him. Also, on commercial real estate, often times when inspections are done prior to a sale, the sale price of the property will be discounted the value of a replacement roof as the new owner will be looking to either replace the existing roof or, at least, getting a price discount due to the condition of it. There is another instance when the current owner would have been better off with a quality product to start with. Anyway, the market has a way of figuring these things out and bringing in a regulatory fix would add costs that you might not even consider. Not worth it. Thanks for the thoughts on it, though!

Right on. Then I guess the market will figure this one out too...nothing to worry about on your end.

[GoldMember]

Right on. Then I guess the market will figure this one out too...nothing to worry about on your end.

No but it's an extra frustration that didn't exist prior to the CARES Act and the contradictory goals. Mind you, I'm not complaining about the CARES Act as we benefited from PPP greatly, We were kind of a poster child for whom it was intended to help. But like anyone, I suppose, it also gave me an opportunity to bitch about something at the same time. Something about having cake and eating it, too?

[rideit]

DAMNIT, Now I want cake.
Thanks.
Thanks a lot.

[spanghew]

from today's NYT:

A $600 weekly jobless benefit from the federal government that became a lifeline for tens of millions of unemployed Americans, while also helping prop up the coronavirus-ravaged economy, expired at midnight as officials in Washington failed to agree on a new relief bill.

Joblessness remains at record levels, with some 30 million Americans receiving unemployment benefits. More than 1.4 million newly filed for state unemployment benefits last week — the 19th straight week that the tally had exceeded one million, an unheard-of figure before the pandemic.

Nearly 11 percent of Americans have said that they live in households where there is not enough to eat, according to a recent Census Bureau survey, and more than a quarter have missed a rent or mortgage payment.

The benefit’s expiration will force Louise Francis, who worked as a banquet cook at the Sheraton Hotel in New Orleans for nearly two decades before being furloughed last spring, to get by on just state unemployment benefits, which for her come to $247 a week.

“With the $600, you could see your way a little bit,” said Ms. Francis, 59. “You could feel a little more comfortable. You could pay three or four bills and not feel so far behind.”


Assholes.

[highangle]

Assholes.

You know good and well that paying unemployed people to stay home during a pandemic will, as so many have asserted here, only serve to spoil them.

And when Republicans stand up for America and block further mollycoddling of people who had jobs before this Nothingburger Chinese Flu, make sure you blame Washington DC in general and especially Democrats, who are too old anyway.

[Ottime]

We're getting some people (3 hires over the past 3 weeks) but we need another 3 or 4 and it's hard to find them. For one thing, it's the work (commercial roofing) and it's in Spokane so the pool to choose from is a little thin. But again, I could throw more money at it but that takes us out of being competitive unless, of course, we simply wanted to take on work at a loss....

But what you're telling me is that finding trades workers is a piece of cake, no problem. That's not the case in anyone's world if you're in construction. This is a pretty good article on the subject.

https://www.giatecscientific.com/edu...tion-industry/

If you can’t be competitive perhaps you are mismanaging. Plenty of well paid roofing jobs around here and of those companies stay afloat. Might just be the guys at the top are not siphoning off all of the profit at the cost of the workers wage.

Seriously, if you can’t hire right now, you are doing something wrong. But keep on blaming the government for your inability to attract employees.

[wooley12]

The construction company that I worked for got rid of it's immigrant labor and replaced them with higher cost citizen workers. I sense that the lack of citizens willing to work is that there are more opportunities replacing immigrants. That is what government policy has been promoting. I've heard that from others in the field. Supply and demand working.

[GoldMember]

If you can’t be competitive perhaps you are mismanaging. Plenty of well paid roofing jobs around here and of those companies stay afloat. Might just be the guys at the top are not siphoning off all of the profit at the cost of the workers wage.

Seriously, if you can’t hire right now, you are doing something wrong. But keep on blaming the government for your inability to attract employees.

Ah yes, another great answer from someone who knows nothing of our situation. Thanks but you're all wet.

[wooley12]

You're new here?

[Core Shot]

You know good and well that paying unemployed people to stay home during a pandemic will, as so many have asserted here, only serve to spoil them.

And when Republicans stand up for America and block further mollycoddling of people who had jobs before this Nothingburger Chinese Flu, make sure you blame Washington DC in general and especially Democrats, who are too old anyway.

Did you forget the #sarc tag?

[dunfree]

Ah yes, another great answer from someone who knows nothing of our situation. Thanks but you're all wet.

Do what the budget outfits do. Steal a load of material from another job.

part of the reason I’m in favor of the $600 is if it’s saved it allows workers you need to relocate to spokompton where the jobs are. If it’s spent, obviously, it’s a short term benefit to something else. Spending money on hookers and blow ain’t personally good economics, but it is moving the money