Results 76 to 100 of 1054
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06-05-2020, 09:12 AM #76
Hey, I never called you names or called you a racist for defending the statues. What I said was the history of WHY they were erected matters. I did not use any of those terms or even imply them about you or anyone else here. But feel free to twist what I said any way you like as an excuse to call me out for disagreeing with you. That was a dick move.
"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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06-05-2020, 09:14 AM #77
As for the statue that MS mentions, if it was erected to celebrate Onate and his accomplishments (however fucked that might be) then I think the foot amputation is a great alternative to the "plaque" that some here have mentioned. If, however, the statue was erected intentionally to be a fuck you to the Acoma people, to tell them to shut up and keep in their place, then it should come down.
"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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06-05-2020, 09:19 AM #78
You’re reaching.
I’m not going to pretend to know why the statue was raised, but my take is that it’s pretty tone-deaf at the very least. And it reminds me of the tone-deafness of statues of Confederate historical figures. The difference being that the Spanish won that war.
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06-05-2020, 09:24 AM #79
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06-05-2020, 09:34 AM #80
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06-05-2020, 09:39 AM #81
It may be typical of TGR, but people have answered your question over and over. I offered up that if they have economic value then maybe put them in a for profit museum and people interested in seeing them can do so. I think that's not a great idea for a business as I suspect there isn't a big market for seeing these things.
Your idea of a rich southerner buying these seems flawed to me. If there's a rich southerner who is hell bent on having a statue of Robert E. Lee or Jefferson Davis, they can hire an artist to make one for them and slap it on their property. Why rescue a monument that has a history of inciting racism and causing social divide? Your turn to answer a question.Damn shame, throwing away a perfectly good white boy like that
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06-05-2020, 09:41 AM #82
Never heard that legend about NA's in the design. Link for a history buff?
We stopped at Rushmore on our see the USA trip and I felt swelled with patriotism at Rushmore. Amazing place. We ate lunch at the crowded cafeteria and a coupe of young tweenage brothers found seats across the table. Out of the blue one of the boys says " My daddy says that Obama is a nigger". Kid had a southern drawl but the words could have just as likely come from a kid from Ohio or California. How can we fix that?A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.
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06-05-2020, 09:45 AM #83
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06-05-2020, 09:45 AM #84
This is the one I read: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/histo...ore-180960446/
Also, Stone Mountain in GA is pretty weird. I too had that sensation seeing Mount Rushmore, patriotism, and then though about the destruction of the mountain to make the sculpture, but still...that thing is interesting.
Stone Mountain on the other hand made me question it...what exactly is the point? these guys lost the war and this is monument to the institution of slavery in many ways. Why does it exist?Damn shame, throwing away a perfectly good white boy like that
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06-05-2020, 09:48 AM #85
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06-05-2020, 09:49 AM #86Banned
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06-05-2020, 09:53 AM #87
Maybe it was being on a life altering road trip with no itinerary and my best friend forever riding shotgun that made it extra special. And it was sunny. Hope you got my point. See you at the march?
A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.
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06-05-2020, 09:55 AM #88
And to be clear, it's not like a monument of Robert E. Lee is inherently intended to incite racism. We can debate whether it's a good idea to have a monument erected for him, just like we can debate whether a monument should have been erected for some of the other people mentioned in here (Chivington, Onate).
It is that these monuments, sprinkled throughout the south (along with the confederate flag), were popularized/erected/flown during periods of extreme racial tension, to send a message to black folks that they were subhuman and should stay in their place. They were not erected to celebrate history at all, they were erected like you said, for the purpose of inciting racism.
It's a pretty clear distinction that seems to be lost on some people."fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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06-05-2020, 09:57 AM #89Banned
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06-05-2020, 10:01 AM #90
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06-05-2020, 10:10 AM #91
I think that you are right there. To me, these universities cited in the article that I posted are not keeping them in museums to incite racism. I don't think that every statue depicting the confederacy has no value and was cheaply made. On the other hand, people who like to chant racism want these monuments erased to make them justify their mentality. It's a cause, so let's be activists. This reminds me of the difference between racism versus hatred of an different ethnic groups. I am told that only white people can be racist, and it is impossible for blacks to be racist. OTOH, blacks can just hate whites, because of whites racism. I don't quite understand that, either.
The approach of the persecuted Jews is very different. They seem to like holocaust art, as there are many paintings, monuments and memorials of life during WWII. Many of them continually visit Dachau, Buchenwald, Auschwitz and the many border museums that occupy the German landscape
By I digress. Would I buy one? No. Do I enjoy viewing them when I visit cities in the south? No. Do they bother me, personally? Not particularly. Do I admire Civil War generals? No. Did I stir up interesting conversation in the Padded Romm? Yes.
Mission accomplishedLast edited by schindlerpiste; 06-05-2020 at 10:46 AM.
“How does it feel to be the greatest guitarist in the world? I don’t know, go ask Rory Gallagher”. — Jimi Hendrix
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06-05-2020, 10:13 AM #92
Not on point, but I always find the history of Princeton interesting...and tortured.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/06/a...l-history.htmlIt makes perfect sense...until you think about it.
I suspect there's logic behind the madness, but I'm too dumb to see it.
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06-05-2020, 10:13 AM #93
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06-05-2020, 10:33 AM #94
This. All the reciting of how racist they are won't convince any of the southerners who view their history differently. So there are and will be more generations who view the removal of "their" symbols as a symbol of the oppression of southern culture. So they get to be victims. The fact that symbols have different meanings for everyone is inconvenient but still true. Take em down, melt em, whatever, but the certainty about why anyone would oppose that is a bit overconfident.
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06-05-2020, 10:40 AM #95"When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
"I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
"THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -ski on in eternal peace
"I have posted in here but haven't read it carefully with my trusty PoliAsshat antenna on."-DipshitDanno
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06-05-2020, 10:42 AM #96
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06-05-2020, 10:45 AM #97
Ditto
Hubris
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06-05-2020, 11:14 AM #98
A couple of thoughts:
Depictions of what happened during the holocaust are not the same as statues of leaders of the confederacy IMV.
What would it matter if the statues were cheaply made or expensively made? Are you talking about melting down a bronze statue, recycling the materials for reuse? If so, sure I can get behind that.
Here's my assumption about the monetary value of these things...is there any proof that there is a market for these things? It seems to me that "they should be in museums" is only meant to satiate the folks that are bothered by these being removed...it's not that they have much monetary value, again, unless you're talking about the raw materials and recycling them.Damn shame, throwing away a perfectly good white boy like that
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06-05-2020, 11:43 AM #99Registered User
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06-05-2020, 12:15 PM #100
They should melt the statues down and use the metal in new statues that commemorate people who have been lynched or murdered by police.
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