What's with all the Marker hate?

[skimaxpower]

Former shop tech here. Marker should get credit for great documentation, and easy installation. Unlike Dynafit, they don't seem to change their hole pattern every 12 months.

But the "Biometric" toe (pre-2007 era) bindings were notorious for pre-releasing. Marker touring bindings are popular, but have had durability issues (to their credit, they continue to push the envelope with creative designs.) And entry-level Marker bindings are little better cheap plastic with a rubber band inside.

The Jester/Griffon binding is perfectly fine and continues to slowly improve, although I prefer Salomon STH(2) for weight, performance, safety, and ease of use.

Ultimately, a ski binding is a safety device. If it releases too early or too late, it's putting your safety in danger.

[old goat]

As a former shop tech, marker hate is very warranted. Probably 80% of bindings that fail the release test even though they are still on the indemnification list are low din markers. The biometric toes were horrible for skiing and testing, the heel is a pain to click into, the cheaper royal family bindings with more plastic seem to release inconsistently after a few seasons of use.

The higher din royal family bindings with more metal seem to be fine, I skied a lot of a few sets of jesters and had no problems, I just prefer pivots. So I’d say the hate is warranted on the low din cheaper models, the griffon/ squire etc are worse than comparable low din bindings from other manufacturers, high din models are pretty much a toss up to personal preference.

My favorite tech (miss you out at Donner Lake Greg) told me that in his experience Markers are less likely to test to spec than other bindings.

Worth mentioning that the heel pieces on Royals traps snow and it melts in your car. Not an issue if you use a ski rack.

[rod9301]

Because we are all old here and we all remember pre-releasing on old Markers for no reason at all. Most of us have no reason to see if they fixed their shit 20 years later.

Although I did contradict myself and try dukes when they came out as they were unique to the market for a moment. Mine broke 2nd run of the day, on a 2 foot powder day at Snowbird...

Exactly, the worst pre release i had, maybe 30 years ago, was on markers, and they were set at 11.

Never again.


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[SB]

Markers are the Ebikes of ski bindings

[nyskirat]

I just bought a pair of Kingpins. After reading all the bad press I realized it went away after the recall. Seems everyone is scared to admit they like them.

You still see a lot of Pros using them on social media

[waxloaf]

How many of you have skied the 2021 Royal Family bindings with the redesigned heel?

I skied a Griffon about 3 years ago, which is the last time I was in a marker clamp. I honestly don’t have much of a need or desire to pay to try their latest stuff; that being said, if you or Marker want to send me the latest stuff I’d give it a go...


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[skifishbum]

im not so much a hater as I don't personally use shit that other companies make better
and way to much fail in my decades of tech time

[undertow2]

im not so much a hater as I don't personally use shit that other companies make better
and way to much fail in my decades of tech time

^^^^this...! Best statement is this thread... I have one pair of Jesters as I got them free and def did not love them... I also have Looks but primarily rock Sth 16s and to me the Jester family falls way short of what Sollie and Look put out...


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[nickwm21]

You still see a lot of Pros using them on social media

If you’re paid to ski for Volkl, K2, or Line it is likely that your contract says you have to ski markers.


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[ill-advised strategy]

anecdotally:
re: release-biased twincam toes:

I left a set of Marker Comp 12s on some bump skis I bought a few years ago.

We hand built kickers on our little zipper line course. I was the only idiot there to space-monkey crash test them. Then I was determined to spin during the comp, even though I had taken a solemn vow of "no air" since like 2007. So there I was, at age 40, throwing 3s into ice bumps, kicking off toe releases left and right. Those comp 12s were perfect for reliable breakaway releases. I probably had 20 or 30 releases from those things with my lower body intact. Perfect for that one particular scenario where I really didn't want a ton of elasticity and retention for "trying to hang on and pull it out" scenarios. I could easily see many of those wrecks being injury wrecks on a very elastic rig.

On the other hand, I have a set of comp 20s that are as heavy and gnarly and retention-biased as any greenspring Salomon or Pivot 18.

[nyskirat]

If you’re paid to ski for Volkl, K2, or Line it is likely that your contract says you have to ski markers.


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Ah, I didn't know it extended to Line or K2. That explains a lot.

Wonder how much it'll change with the new Duke next year.

[smooth operator]

How many of you have skied the 2021 Royal Family bindings with the redesigned heel?

Given the fact that 2020 just started, I expect very few.

[lowsparkco]

I actually just had a friend with a sheared pin on a post-second recall set of toes and I'm pretty sure I read about another one in here somewhere recently. Someone posting about what to carry for repair kit in the bc or some such thing. I don't think the problem went away, I think they just lost a ton of market share and the problem is less evident. Fuck marker.

As always it's tough to measure anecdotal experiences as real data. It's unfortunate there isn't more quantitative data out there considering the recall.

I'm pretty careful about managing my gear for deeper backcountry, actually have a pair of boards with inserts and pack a backup heel, toe, and set of screws for hut trips or longer one day objectives. I'll ski these Kingpins with some reservation inbounds for awhile before I get real comfortable I'm sure.

[gregL]

I skied a Griffon about 3 years ago, which is the last time I was in a marker clamp. I honestly don’t have much of a need or desire to pay to try their latest stuff; that being said, if you or Marker want to send me the latest stuff I’d give it a go...

I've had zero Markers in my personal quiver for years for the reasons stated previously in this thread (exception was a gen 2 non-recall Kingpin which worked flawlessly). Then I skied a bunch of the new bindings at demo days this month and was blown away at how easy they were to step in to. Still not quite as easy as Salomon STH2/Warden or Tyrolia Attack, but on a par with Look.

[waxman]

If you’re paid to ski for Volkl, K2, or Line it is likely that your contract says you have to ski markers.
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or nordica, blizzard and possibly on or two more?

as for easy to install? i can't think of another binding you need a rubber mallet to get the heels on the tracks to engage the screw interface like the royal series

[Spyderjon]

......i can't think of another binding you need a rubber mallet to get the heels on the tracks to engage the screw interface like the royal series

I wipe some of the excessive amount of grease in the worm drive track down the rails and then heels will slide straight on with a firm push.

[gregL]

. . . as for easy to install? i can't think of another binding you need a rubber mallet to get the heels on the tracks to engage the screw interface like the royal series

I've been known to use a mallet on STH/Warden heels to get them to engage . . .

[ahuss]

I've had every generation of royal bindings without any issues. The re-design for 20/21 though... the heel looks even more phallic than any design in the past.

[rod9301]

You still see a lot of Pros using them on social media

Ok, on social media, but are they using them in the snow?

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[Nevada29er]

The fact that the brand name is a verb for pre-releasing, aka, I Markered out on that last run, says it all.

[1000-oaks]

I wipe some of the excessive amount of grease in the worm drive track down the rails and then heels will slide straight on with a firm push.

^ Same, though I only have two pair of Markers. Seems like it should be standard procedure to grease the baseplates where they touch the brake and heel piece, so the whole assembly can move smoothly as the ski flexes. If it's sticky, your forward pressure fluctuates as the ski flexes, instead of the heel moving back and forth a bit like bindings with a greased metal channel do (STH, Attack, etc). A little grease makes a big difference.

[SB]

Do they have snow in social media?

Is that Ikon or Epic?

[gregL]

Given the fact that 2020 just started, I expect very few.

Fair point, but in the ski industry people have been showing/ordering/demoing 2021 product for over a month now, starting with SIA/WWSRA shows and on-snows last month. I expect the same is true in Europe. I've stepped into quite a few pairs already.

[waxman]

I wipe some of the excessive amount of grease in the worm drive track down the rails and then heels will slide straight on with a firm push.

which brings me to, someone at the Marker factory is paid by the amount of grease they put on the bindings, Geezus H Krist if i wanted that much grease on my hands i would have become a bike mechanic

[gregorys]

The Royal family bindings ski fine, but they're hard to step into in deep snow.

This! +1000

And the heel piece [On the old worm-drive forward adjust] is simply unmatched by any other binding I've used for the ability to really smash your thumb while adjusting DINS and operating the binding closed/open.

Other than those two PITA things, they seem fine.
I wouldn't pick them as my first choice, but it certainly wouldn't detract me if they were cheap enough.
Ski fine. No worse release/retention than most anything else I've skied.
Solid option.