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Thread: Katana 108 - the resurrerection
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01-19-2023, 03:14 PM #551
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01-19-2023, 04:19 PM #552User
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01-19-2023, 04:26 PM #553
Can anyone compare K108 and MPro 105? Have been enjoying my Katana but snagged a pair of new MP105 and now have some remorse to mount them if no one buys it.
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01-19-2023, 09:16 PM #554Registered User
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You should enjoy having both. You would grab the LP105 less but when you skied it it would put a huge smile on your face. Once you nail the tune to your spec to offset the camber, you can't beat that build and shape IMO
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01-20-2023, 09:06 AM #555Registered User
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Well if I had a pair of K108's, I would definitely mount on the rec line. I just did a remount to my M102's back to the rec line after being about 12mm forward of rec. That was the way to go for me. Maybe my reason for liking the back line is that I am a bigfoot in a 28.5 boot. Pretty sure both Bandit and Shorty J have small feet which could explain why they like +1.
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01-20-2023, 09:39 AM #556
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01-22-2023, 06:23 PM #557User
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Ok, this is a dumb question and may be a tune thing that I don’t understand, but in the two days I’ve been on these, I’ve crossed the tips 3-4 times, twice resulting in a spectacular crash. Three times in steep moguls, and once today in moderate angle, moderately smooth snow. For the record, in the past two weeks I’ve also skied my OG Cochise and my V-werks Katanas and haven’t done this. As far as I know, I haven’t crossed tips in years.
Is it the ski, the tune, style, stance??
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01-22-2023, 06:31 PM #558I drink it up
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Definitely not the skill of the rider.
I think you’re mounted forward on a flat camber ski that likes to wander anyways. You lean back and widen your stance and there you go. But without watching it who knows.
I got rid of mine because at speed in variable snow I had to spend too much time minding the tips.focus.
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01-22-2023, 06:34 PM #559
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01-22-2023, 06:41 PM #560
Just spent Friday up at Blackcomb on my 184’s. OMG…I almost forgot how much I enjoy these on a Big mountain with Big terrain. Spent lots of time well north of 50-mph on soft groomers. I love how easy they are to back off the edges, slide the tails around, and shut down speed. Then, jump off trail in the 6-8” of Pow and wind-affected crud and they float and push through everything. With the 3D sidecut, they are like a fat race ski, with just enough give in that tail to feel forgiving in crappy snow.
I think I need a backup pair of 184’s.In constant pursuit of the perfect slarve...
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01-22-2023, 06:45 PM #561User
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Heh, my skill is def in question.
But seriously, cant tell if you’re being snarky and saying it’s me (it’s likely me, I just don’t know why), or you’re saying that you had some similar drama with them?
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01-22-2023, 06:47 PM #562User
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Also, I am mounted forward, but would 1.5 cm cause that problem? If I don’t click with these I likely won’t risk the value loss in a remount to find out, I think I’ll move on.
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01-22-2023, 06:52 PM #563
If you can ski the OG Cochise and Vwerks, you’re no slouch. So, I’m going with stance/style or tune. Both the OG Cochise and Vwerks have a much larger, single radius sidecut, which may also be a factor. Also, if you are a skis close together kind of skier, those fat tips and 3D sidecut can work against you.
I cannot quite put my finger on it, but after spending so much time on my 184 M102/K108 (and perhaps adjusting my technique to suit those skis), I have really fallen out of love with my 185 OG Cochise. Like in a “what did I ever like about these?” kind of way.In constant pursuit of the perfect slarve...
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01-22-2023, 06:58 PM #564I drink it up
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Katana 108 - the resurrerection
Little snark… old TGR habits die hard.
But also, I found them to be twitchy and you had to think about both skis to keep them in line at speed on any snow that wasn’t smooth. For me, this meant thinking about how much rotational force I was applying to each ski, especially when they were flat or in variable conditions.
Forward mount exacerbated this. If your skill/experience level isn’t up to it or you have bad habits, that will be magnified too. I bet they’re great at low speeds on groomers or in 6” of fresh snow. I bet longer sidecut skis you leave the outside ski behind frequently, but with the weird 3d+ tight sidecut you see the opposite with these.focus.
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01-22-2023, 07:53 PM #565User
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Ah, now were getting somewhere. Leaving the outside ski behind is something that I have had to focus on not doing with other skis in the past, but it seemed like I could overcome it/get past it.
I’m sure I have loads of bad habits engrained at this point but I’ve never really had a ski that I thought much about after a handful of runs on it.
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01-22-2023, 08:05 PM #566Registered User
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Likely not the answer you're looking for, but based on your previous ski, I bet you'd be happier on the 184. Tip dive isn't something I've personally experienced on these.
Yah, ^ this all sounds right; they're a pretty unreal Blackcomb DD for traditional folks like us. I have 50 some days on my pair and have hardly grabbed anything else this year.
Sorry you're not getting along with em. As Bandit said above though, none of this ^ is super surprising. They definitely fall into the metal lam charger camp with similar characteristics to that class, the rocker profile and sidecut just make em more accessible IME. Great DD for a place like Blackcomb (mostly open spaces), and while I like em in steeps (I just like steeps), in 2 and 3D, I also generally ski a turn or two ahead and try not to stop in sketchy places, which lines up well with the K108s attributes (min speed but no max kinda ski). And if I'm skiing moguls, I fucked up. Hope you find the unicorn you're looking for! 6'2/195#, on the 191 at plus 1.
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01-22-2023, 08:52 PM #567
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01-23-2023, 01:48 AM #568Rod9301
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Btw, on my k108, I've been crossing tips too. I'm going to check the tune, did are 3 days from new
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01-23-2023, 07:34 AM #569User
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I do not, but I could probably have a shop check? If this were the case and it was a tune problem, wouldn’t it show up on groomers as well? As far as I know, this has only happened off trail, which leads me to believe its my (lack of) technique not clicking with the ski.
Edit: looks like Rod has had this happen too?
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01-23-2023, 08:24 AM #570Registered User
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Powerful traditional skis are particularly sensitive to the tune. A good friend was just complaining about her M102s being “hooky” and demanding, but a basic hand tune (2 degree side, 1 degree base, and light gummy 12” back from the tip and tail) and she’s loving them. I wouldn’t expect Volkls to be railed, but worth checking.
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03-21-2023, 09:20 PM #571Registered User
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I got a few days on my new (to me) K108's 184's that I got off another member here. The first few runs I tried them I took them right off and went back to my M102's. The tips were everywhere when trying to get them on edge and go through bumpy stuff on the groomers and in the trees. Thought these weren't going to be my skis.
The group I was staying with in SLC had a set of these same skis and feeling the edges back to back, these were like a razor blade compared to the others that had a bunch of days on them (which the owner was getting along with). A round of de-tuning from the local shop, and they were still quite a bit sharper than the other guys skis, but MUCH improved on the slope. I could actually move these things around and get the tails to release when I needed them to. These things are rippers now.
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03-22-2023, 01:50 AM #572Rod9301
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I had to detune the tips on mine. I was crossing the tips, which i can't remember the last time this happened with all my other skis.
Fixed the problem
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03-22-2023, 06:19 AM #573User
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03-22-2023, 07:21 AM #574Registered User
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03-22-2023, 09:23 AM #575Rod9301
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I initially mounted my 177 k108s on the more forward line and the tips were diving too much in powder, so i remounted on the back line, recommended, and problem solved
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