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Thread: RIP Kobe Bryant

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    How many facts of the case do you know? Did you read any of the court filings? * * * The dude admitted that she didn't think the encounter was consensual (look at his own admissions, an innocent person with the money to fight wouldn't admit those things).
    Actually, I did briefly speak with an attorney who worked on the civil case, although my understanding of the evidence comes from the public record.

    Here is part of what we know as a matter of public record: Kobe admitted to having sex with her. He said it was consensual. She said it was not. The alleged victim eventually declined to testify, thus the prosecution dismissed the case. She submitted to a rape exam, where semen and pubic hair of a different man (caucasian) was found on her panties. Her testimony changed on numerous material factual issues. Kobe's shirt had traces of her blood, which he claimed resulted from consensual sex. There was evidence that she was being treated for schizophrenia.

    When she refused to testify, the prosecution team was very pissed off. (This I learned from the attorney who worked on the civil case.)

    Kobe's statement included the following; "Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did."

    Comparing this woman's claims against Kobe's case with the scores of claims against Harvey W is a false equivalency because, among other things, there is no evidence that Kobe engaged in a years' long pattern of sexual abuse.

    I do not know exactly what happened, nor do you. It all comes down to his mens rea, and we will never know. Maybe he's a one-time rapist or maybe he thought it was consensual. Anyone who claims one or the other is speculating about the subjective thoughts of a guy who is now dead.

  2. #77
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    RIP Kobe Bryant

    Quote Originally Posted by hutash View Post
    It's a sad say when anybody dies, but I am much sadder about the deaths of several children then I am about an uber rich athlete. Unfortunately we tend to make gods out of good athletes and pay them way too much money. Yeah, he was a great basketball player, but at the end of the day what has that given us? Lennon left a legacy of incredible music and questioned social norms that will benefit us for years to come.
    Meh. Sport is art. Kobe contributed substantially to that particular art form, and his body of work is and will continue to be appreciated for years to come. My 12 year old son has certainly spent more time watching Kobe highlight reels than he has listening to Lennon or studying the paintings of Jenny Saville.

    It rings false to apply much of a value judgment to the respective merits of one over the other. At the end of the day, a very recognizable figure died before we expected him to, and thatís jarring.
    focus.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeezerSteve View Post
    Actually, I did briefly speak with an attorney who worked on the civil case, although my understanding of the evidence comes from the public record.

    Here is part of what we know as a matter of public record: Kobe admitted to having sex with her. He said it was consensual. She said it was not. The alleged victim eventually declined to testify, thus the prosecution dismissed the case. She submitted to a rape exam, where semen and pubic hair of a different man (caucasian) was found on her panties. Her testimony changed on numerous material factual issues. Kobe's shirt had traces of her blood, which he claimed resulted from consensual sex. There was evidence that she was being treated for schizophrenia.

    When she refused to testify, the prosecution team was very pissed off. (This I learned from the attorney who worked on the civil case.)

    Kobe's statement included the following; "Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did."

    Comparing this woman's claims against Kobe's case with the scores of claims against Harvey W is a false equivalency because, among other things, there is no evidence that Kobe engaged in a years' long pattern of sexual abuse.

    I do not know exactly what happened, nor do you. It all comes down to his mens rea, and we will never know. Maybe he's a one-time rapist or maybe he thought it was consensual. Anyone who claims one or the other is speculating about the subjective thoughts of a guy who is now dead.
    Lord knows that you want to always seem the most knowledgeable person on every subject. But you're not on this one. Nice obfuscation, nice show of appearing even-handed even as you smear the victim. Continue on thinking what you think, lord knows I'll never change your mind. But the dude was a rapist. I know that.

    How often does someone innocent, with tons of wealth to pay for the best defense money can buy, admit that the person they had sex with did not believe it was consensual? If he truly believed that it was consensual, why would he admit that? And no, this is not the source of my knowledge, but it does seem pretty obvious to me.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeezerSteve View Post
    Actually, I did briefly speak with an attorney who worked on the civil case, although my understanding of the evidence comes from the public record.

    Here is part of what we know as a matter of public record: Kobe admitted to having sex with her. He said it was consensual. She said it was not. The alleged victim eventually declined to testify, thus the prosecution dismissed the case. She submitted to a rape exam, where semen and pubic hair of a different man (caucasian) was found on her panties. Her testimony changed on numerous material factual issues. Kobe's shirt had traces of her blood, which he claimed resulted from consensual sex. There was evidence that she was being treated for schizophrenia.

    When she refused to testify, the prosecution team was very pissed off. (This I learned from the attorney who worked on the civil case.)

    Kobe's statement included the following; "Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did."

    Comparing this woman's claims against Kobe's case with the scores of claims against Harvey W is a false equivalency because, among other things, there is no evidence that Kobe engaged in a years' long pattern of sexual abuse.

    I do not know exactly what happened, nor do you. It all comes down to his mens rea, and we will never know. Maybe he's a one-time rapist or maybe he thought it was consensual. Anyone who claims one or the other is speculating about the subjective thoughts of a guy who is now dead.
    damn from a sweat and grimed covered blue collar perspective
    the money and time you spent on a legal degree is way better than danno
    but i bet hes puttin on the powder wig and skirt for a rebuttal to your fine synopises of the facts of that case though
    "When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
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  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    Lord knows that you want to always seem the most knowledgeable person on every subject. But you're not on this one. Nice obfuscation, nice show of appearing even-handed even as you smear the victim. Continue on thinking what you think, lord knows I'll never change your mind. But the dude was a rapist. I know that.

    How often does someone innocent, with tons of wealth to pay for the best defense money can buy, admit that the person they had sex with did not believe it was consensual? If he truly believed that it was consensual, why would he admit that? And no, this is not the source of my knowledge, but it does seem pretty obvious to me.
    Just chiming in here to say that you, Danno, often appear to me as the one who always tries to seem the most knowledgeable. Your statement is highly ironic. Maybe time not to post all day everyday on tgr?

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yonder_River View Post
    Just chiming in here to say that you, Danno, often appear to me as the one who always tries to seem the most knowledgeable. Your statement is highly ironic. Maybe time not to post all day everyday on tgr?
    Fair criticism, I'm guilty as a sometimes know it all.

    Go on then with the rapist adulation, and I'll quit this thread.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  7. #82
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    dicksoutforscitzoallegedvictemswithothermensspunki nherjunk
    and take a lap around the office
    while you post less
    bro
    "When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
    "I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
    "THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -
    ski on in eternal peace

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceman View Post
    Yesterday my kid tried to tell me that Kobe's death was a bigger deal than Lennon's.
    For people under 50, heís probably correct.

  9. #84
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    Its certainly tragic when anyone gets killed, it looks like some holes in the case againt Kobe Bryant back in the day ?

    but didn't the president rape women, pay them off, not go to jail and almost half the country supports him ?
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  10. #85
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    I was waiting to look at this thread to see if his baggage showed up. We will never know what happened for reelz in that hotel room. They may have been drinking/doing drugs and shit went sideways from there. In those situations, one man's consensual is a woman's feelings of being raped.

    Regardless of how I may feel about what may of happened, the fact is a dad died that I believe loved his family very much and was likely loved back. My sincerest best wishes to his family.
    Quote Originally Posted by leroy jenkins View Post
    I think you'd have an easier time understanding people if you remembered that 80% of them are fucking morons.
    That is why I like dogs, more than most people.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post

    How often does someone innocent, with tons of wealth to pay for the best defense money can buy, admit that the person they had sex with did not believe it was consensual? If he truly believed that it was consensual, why would he admit that? And no, this is not the source of my knowledge, but it does seem pretty obvious to me.
    He didn't admit to non consensual sex. He admitted to having sex he thought was consensual and acknowledged that she didn't. There's a difference. Maybe he settled and apologized because he was actually regretful. Or maybe he just wanted it over with, or his wife did. Lots of celebrities settle when they could fight in court. If you've ever been party to a lawsuit you know it can consume your life for years. If you have the money to hire expensive lawyers and fight, you also have the money to settle and move on. Which it appears you have wisely done.

    I feel no grief over Kobe's death and I feel that the public reaction is way overblown. Also- I felt a lot worse over John Lennon's death, because of his politics.

  12. #87
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    Since the #metoo folks showed up, I'm surprised the #globalwarming folks haven't chimed in yet on the carbon footprint of traveling by helicopter.
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by jm2e View Post
    The best thing about TGR is that we can have these conversations. The rest of "social media" wouldn't let you dare question the sanctity of celebrity.
    TGR gut check, whether you like it or not. Now everyone go eat a bag of dicks and move along.
    This ^^^

    largely responding to the subsequent discussion about 2003 --

    never a big Kobe fan, myself
    ( had the Lakers not acquired SHAQ, would Kobe have ever gotten near a title... (?)


    ( San Antonio. Dallas. Portland )


    but let this thread morn his death, please...

    ( If you have to - Please start another thread

    ( isn't there an adage about speaking ill of the dead. . . )



    one bag of dicks, please - To Go. (tj)

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    Since the #metoo folks showed up, I'm surprised the #globalwarming folks haven't chimed in yet on the carbon footprint of traveling by helicopter.
    Usually the vegans beat them to the punch

    hero worship/ how & why rich men rape women and can get away with it is pretty big subject

    Maybe just a RIP is enough for now ?
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    Usually the vegans beat them to the punch
    I dunno. In the Caroline Gleich thread they got on the helicopter thing pretty quickly.
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by hutash View Post
    Unfortunately we tend to make gods out of good athletes and pay them way too much money.
    The NBA had gross revenues of $8 billion in the 2017/2018 season (most recent I could find, probably will be north of $10 billion this season). Relative to that player salaries don't seem unreasonable.

    Anyway, carry on. I never followed Kobe's rape case, but I feel fairly confident that he's less of a rapist than Mike Tyson who's still a pop-culture icon. Regardless of how you felt about him, his other three kids probably loved him very much and growing up without their father will affect them forever. It's certainly a tragedy for them.

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    I dunno. In the Caroline Gleich thread they got on the helicopter thing pretty quickly.
    If you can’t use someone else’s misfortune to loudly shout your virtues at the internet, then what good was their misfortune to you in the first place?

    No one even remembers Harambe any more, much less Balloon Boy. Uncaring assholes, the lot of us.
    I still call it The Jake.

  18. #93
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    List of celebrities who have died in plane crashes. (Celebrities pretty loosely defined.)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...tion_accidents
    Having the resources to fly privately can be hazardous to your health. I think I'll stick to United, miserable as that can be.

  19. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    If you canít use someone elseís misfortune to loudly shout your virtues at the internet, then what good was their misfortune to you in the first place?

    No one even remembers Harambe any more, much less Balloon Boy. Uncaring assholes, the lot of us.
    Did Kony win his election in 2012?

  20. #95
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    non of my icons have face ink
    let alone allah
    just so you know
    and once upon a time chris davinport showed up here and called em machines of whirly blades of death
    or something moronic then never posted again
    I was hopin danno was gonna keep weilding the leroy jenkin retard shovel and keep diggin the hole
    but the blade got too hot
    "When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
    "I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
    "THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -
    ski on in eternal peace

  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by alias_rice View Post
    Did Kony win his election in 2012?
    I thought they were still looking for him?
    I still call it The Jake.

  22. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    I thought they were still looking for him?
    Was he in Bountiful, Utah? Because there sure used to be a shitload of signs around here.

  23. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    It's not really that he was a rapist, although that is quickly forgotten. It's America getting all upset about the death of an incredibly rich celebrity whose claim to fame and only real contribution, if you call it that, was playing basketball really well. So rich, in fact, that he owned a helicopter to fly above the L.A. traffic. Until it didn't.
    Meanwhile, most Americans couldn't find Ukraine on a map.
    bunnygotnogame
    but if you point to any spot on the globe
    hes a local
    "When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
    "I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
    "THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -
    ski on in eternal peace

  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    I think I'll stick to United
    I thought you and Wooley were more steamship type guys?
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  25. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    I thought you and Wooley were more steamship type guys?
    Talk about destroying the environment. Ships run on coal and whale oil? May as well name it the Valdez while you’re at it.
    I still call it The Jake.

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