Fear and Loathing, a Rat Flu Odyssey

[Boissal]

My SIL and her husband are flying back from Mexico today after a 10 day stint, they'll be in town for a few days then fly to San Diego for Thxgiving with his family. Once they fly back to UT they want to do a delayed turkey-day dinner since, and I quote, Ms Boissal and I have ruined it by saying we won't be going to her parents to avoid putting them at risk and it's so sad. My in-laws are actually on the fence (they have a tiny bit of an anti western medicine streak).
Ms Boissal just sent everyone a group text with a pic of one of the new mobile COVID units that is being setup at the local hospital (looks like a greenhouse but with hospital beds inside instead of lettuces). Caption reads "wouldn't it be an awesome place to spend the holiday while critically ill?".
I'm not even sure it will be enough to deter anyone.

[AK47bp]

I think it’s perfectly okay to pause relationships for a period and then turn them back on when this is done.

I’ve got a couple Trump buddies from my hometown that I stopped talking to recently. I’ll gradually reconnect next year and it will be just fine.

Same with Covid idiots and anti maskers, got a few in my circle I just stopped talking to. I’ll reconnect at a later date.




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[gretch6364]

Don Jr. tests positive so it looks like cocaine is not an inoculant.

Joe better stay away from his boy then. Probably thought for sure all the drugs would keep the COVID away from Hunter

[bodywhomper]

our HS district just called. one HS (I think there are 7 in total in the HS district) is having an outbreak. County Public health has advised that the one with an outbreak close on-camps stuff immediately until Jan and that the others do the same starting 11/30. And the HS District is complying with the recommendation.

[I Skied Bandini Mountain]

Joe better stay away from his boy then. Probably thought for sure all the drugs would keep the COVID away from Hunter

Need a tissue?

[pureantigravity]

There is a big movement on "Using antibiotics wisely"
Is there a similar movement for vaccines that isn't anti-vax?

[bennymac]

There is a big movement on "Using antibiotics wisely"
Is there a similar movement for vaccines that isn't anti-vax?

Go back to school man. You don’t know what you don’t know. I mean this in a nice way.

[old goat]

Here's the CDC recommendation for people who have been exposed to--
"Person with COVID-19 who has symptoms (in the period from 2 days before symptom onset until they meet criteria for discontinuing home isolation; can be laboratory-confirmed or a clinically compatible illness)
Person who has tested positive for COVID-19 (laboratory confirmed) but has not had any symptoms (in the 2 days before the date of specimen collection until they meet criteria for discontinuing home isolation).
Note: This is irrespective of whether the person with COVID-19 or the contact was wearing a mask or whether the contact was wearing respiratory personal protective equipment (PPE)

Recommended Precautions for the Public

Stay home until 14 days after last exposure and maintain social distance (at least 6 feet) from others at all times
Self-monitor for symptoms
Check temperature twice a day
Watch for fever [1] , cough, or shortness of breath, or other symptoms of COVID-19
Avoid contact with people at higher risk for severe illness from COVID-19
Follow CDC guidance if symptoms develop"

Maybe it's elsewhere in the website--but every HCW caring for covid patients is being exposed every day and they are coming to work. If these recommendations were truly followed we would have no food, electricity, clean water, police, fire fighters etc--because there are undoubtedly millions of workers in these fields being exposed and still working. There are certainly people who can follow that recommendation--retired people like me for example--but there are more who can't.

Certainly someone who has been exposed shouldn't be going to any gatherings, but neither should anyone else.

[I Skied Bandini Mountain]

.

[wooley12]

Hey Pure. Go cunt up you're own thread.

[Name Redacted]

Here's the CDC recommendation for people who have been exposed to--
"Person with COVID-19 who has symptoms (in the period from 2 days before symptom onset until they meet criteria for discontinuing home isolation; can be laboratory-confirmed or a clinically compatible illness)
Person who has tested positive for COVID-19 (laboratory confirmed) but has not had any symptoms (in the 2 days before the date of specimen collection until they meet criteria for discontinuing home isolation).
Note: This is irrespective of whether the person with COVID-19 or the contact was wearing a mask or whether the contact was wearing respiratory personal protective equipment (PPE)

Recommended Precautions for the Public

Stay home until 14 days after last exposure and maintain social distance (at least 6 feet) from others at all times
Self-monitor for symptoms
Check temperature twice a day
Watch for fever [1] , cough, or shortness of breath, or other symptoms of COVID-19
Avoid contact with people at higher risk for severe illness from COVID-19
Follow CDC guidance if symptoms develop"

Maybe it's elsewhere in the website--but every HCW caring for covid patients is being exposed every day and they are coming to work. If these recommendations were truly followed we would have no food, electricity, clean water, police, fire fighters etc--because there are undoubtedly millions of workers in these fields being exposed and still working. There are certainly people who can follow that recommendation--retired people like me for example--but there are more who can't.

Certainly someone who has been exposed shouldn't be going to any gatherings, but neither should anyone else.

Here in CO once they have tagged you as symptomatic or exposed, you are required to stay home and can face fines and even jail time for breaking quarantine/isolation. I'm not sure about HCWs, but they've (public health) been contact tracing and tracking people down and telling home that they must isolate. They've been pretty aggressive about it lately.

[Kinnikinnick]

So when the vaccines come around, are we going to have one available locally or all three?

Should I get just one brand or get two or three to go nuclear?


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[Mr. Mike]

Thus totally removing half the fun of painting

No shit. Vibes climberevan.

[old goat]

Here in CO once they have tagged you as symptomatic or exposed, you are required to stay home and can face fines and even jail time for breaking quarantine/isolation. I'm not sure about HCWs, but they've (public health) been contact tracing and tracking people down and telling home that they must isolate. They've been pretty aggressive about it lately.

Does that apply to essential workers who have not tested positive going to work? Seems unsustainable.

[truckeelocal]

Joe better stay away from his boy then. Probably thought for sure all the drugs would keep the COVID away from Hunter

Giuliani should have stayed away from his son. But now the crack legal team has to isolate. Strange times.

[neufox47]

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronav...he-coronavirus
Carson was "desperately ill" with the virus.
In his post, Carson said he hoped "we can stop playing politics with medicine."

How convenient.

“President Trump was following my condition and cleared me for the monoclonal antibody therapy that he had previously received, which I am convinced saved my life," Carson wrote.

WTF? So Trumps lackeys can get cleared by the President to get this shit? And some poor bastard just died because Ben Carson got his drugs?

[mfcf13]

I've mentioned this before. Companies are responsible for their employees safety and well being when they are on the job. Osha even fined the meatpacking companies for not developing timely and effective measures to mitigate exposure. So try not to victim blame too much. They are generally very poor and often immigrants but they need the support of their employees just the same as any of us. The meatpacking industry knew their employees were high risk and they did basically nothing at the start until the media picked up on it and the public shaming happened.

OSHA is run by Scalia's kid. Very few companies faced any fines during this pandemic, even though many industries (such as meatpacking) did not follow protocols and were often the source of outbreaks. I'd say public shaming is about the only thing that would get some of these places to comply, OSHA under Trump has no teeth (in fact OSHA had public shaming protocols in the past because they knew that bad PR can be more effective deterrent than fines. Trump ended those protocols). https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...med-at-workers

[jono]

“In workplaces that present some inevitable background hazard, it will be incumbent, in part, on employees to address that.”

Ultimately true and the recourse is quitting. American industry will realize the problem with this approach when the cost of labor rises commensurate with risk.

My wife recently walked away, probably through the pandemic. The clincher, surprisingly, wasn't so much the lack of virus safety but being subjected to a little extra radiation thanks to a boss who couldn't wait for her to leave the room before pushing an x-ray button. He spent the precious seconds he had saved making excuses about how it wasn't really such a big deal--and showing her where things were heading with regard to basic safety. Experiencing the single most expensive failure of risk management in the history of mankind has taught many of us nothing about being pennywise and pound foolish.

[pureantigravity]

So when the vaccines come around, are we going to have one available locally or all three?

Should I get just one brand or get two or three to go nuclear?


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There will be more than three. Get all of them.
There is no such thing as immune system fatigue.

[Benny Profane]

“President Trump was following my condition and cleared me for the monoclonal antibody therapy that he had previously received, which I am convinced saved my life," Carson wrote.

WTF? So Trumps lackeys can get cleared by the President to get this shit? And some poor bastard just died because Ben Carson got his drugs?

And I suppose you think only "essential" workers will be the first in line for vaccines.

[rideit]

Just waiting for Trump Jr. to have access to all of these therapies ‘pro-actively’.

[pureantigravity]

Daily new cases are at 2.5 times the number of cases for the same daily deaths when the pandemic first started.

As this ages, the lethality of infection is greatly reduced.

[MTT]

Some city sheriffs, Melugin noted, would enforce the curfew:


As Breitbart News reported Thursday, Orange County Sheriff Don Barnes issued a statement saying that his officers would emphasize an “education-first approach” but would not respond to calls only related to coronavirus enforcement:

Earlier today, the Orange County Sheriff’s Department became aware of a limited Stay at Home Order that Governor Newsom’s office ordered to go into effect on Saturday, November 21 at 10 PM.

Throughout the pandemic, the Orange County Sheriff’s Department has taken an education-first approach with regard to the public health orders.

We are currently assessing the action by the Governor.

At this time, due to the need to have deputies available or emergency calls for service, deputies will not be responding to requests for face-coverings or social gatherings-only enforcement.
Newsom announced the curfew Thursday, after hinting earlier in the week that he was studying curfews in other states and countries, including Saudi Arabia.

The curfew will begin Saturday, November 21, at 10:00 p.m., and will run from 10:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. for a month. It will apply to “purple” tier counties, which include nearly the entire state of California.

California, like other states, is suffering a coronavirus surge.

[Benny Profane]

Ahem. About those patients taking covid denial to the grave.

https://www.wired.com/story/are-covi...l-as-they-die/

[jono]

Daily new cases are at 2.5 times the number of cases for the same daily deaths when the pandemic first started.

As this ages, the lethality of infection is greatly reduced.

This is a good point to remember, particularly as we approach vaccine approval. At the beginning of this situation we faced a huge number of unknowns. Both upside and downside risks. The upside risks include improved testing, treatments, preventive measures etc. and the downside risks include poor immunity (possibly worsened by mutation), overrunning hospital capacity, long term health effects and deaths.

The upsides are realized with time while the downsides become more likely with viral production/spread. So the intelligent thing to do is to separate time and spread. Slow down spread until better options arrive. Your stat shows that's happened to some extent: as time has gone on we've learned more. It's a pretty predictable outcome (and in fact it was predicted months ago) but it's worth talking about, particularly since we're not out of the woods yet.

Of course, the 2.5x factor is probably a little high due to the time delay for deaths--how will that hold up when the case surge is 3-4 weeks old? And what happens to the death rate if hospitals are overrun? And while the risk of poor immunity appears to be unlikely at the moment, the shear number of viruses that have been produced means the risk of a mutation that reduces immunity is still real. If that happens and the vaccines are rendered ineffective as a result we could be right back where we were 10 months ago medically. Luckily, we should all be able to don a giant face mask with a pair of one-way valves soon. So we've got that going for us.

Oh, yeah, about that mutation risk, see N439K. Here's a preprint for your reading pleasure:

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1...11.04.355842v1