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  1. #37926
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    In 2020 when the issue was protecting teachers and parents from covid being spread by children there was no vaccine. By now those parents and teachers should be triple vaccinated. The 2020 policies re quarantining and isolating and remote learning after a kid is exposed or tests positive are not relevant today. What is relevant today is mandatory vaccination for covid for all students currently eligible, like for all the other communicable diseases, and for teachers.

    My personal, uninformed opinion is that masking all day in a crowded classroom or workplace probably doesn't do much, depending in part on the quality of ventilation and filtration. I think 6-8 hours of protection is a lot to ask from a mask. Even N95's were only intended for relatively brief encounters. (And this is one more way the poor are fucked--what are the chances of excellent ventilation, filtration, UVC, etc in an inner city school? In a rural school in ND or AL?)
    Surgeries sometimes take multiple hours to complete correct? And if what you say is true, that masks do fuckall if worn for long periods of time, then why do people in the medical profession wear them other than to keep blood splatter off their face.

    Also, my friends who are doctors in the COVID wards here wear their PPE all day, presumably because the masks still provide some utility after more than a short period of time. I guess what I'm wondering is where you come up with the idea that what the medical community is doing is pointless in such a case?
    Damn shame, throwing away a perfectly good white boy like that

  2. #37927
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    rotfl;
    Yeah, but look how you turned out.

    Since Benny has been a child, now he’s an expert on childhood development. Which is related to his having visited ski towns and is an expert on ski towns’ social and economic aspects.
    Guy was a child like 60 years ago and thinks he knows what's happening today. Thinks kids are still meeting up at the malt shop to share a coke and some pinball.

  3. #37928
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    Quote Originally Posted by bennymac View Post
    I’m not an expert in child development.

    But masking kids under 4 seems like a fools errand.
    Agreed. I was talking about my kids who are in primary school. They don't mind wearing a mask and I've seen zero ill effects of doing so. I do think distance learning was not great for many kids...these are crazy times. I don't have the answers. What i'm getting tired of are the disingenuous arguements from people like AR who cherry pick a piece from the Atlantic or an MIT paper stating that masks make it harder to communicate/learn for kids, without any other context, and use that to then argue that masks are pointless. It comes accross as self serving, meaning AR probably doesn't like wearing masks so he's looking for studies/reasons why masking is bad. Then using "the children" as his wedge to try to get out of wearing masks...it's completely self serving.
    Damn shame, throwing away a perfectly good white boy like that

  4. #37929
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    The problem is largely adults can go to a restaurant, a concert or basically anywhere else in America and can say fuck it to wearing masks (we've all seen it) but kids can't because they are powerless and that is fucked.

    My gripe isn't with fully developed adults having to suck it up, it is with kids, who are by far and away the least likely to have health issues as a result of the virus yet are getting adult level restrictions placed upon them which then have an outsized effect on their development. It doesn't matter nearly as much for you or me to wear a mask vs our kids.
    Live Free or Die

  5. #37930
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    I often have to tell my 4 and 7 year old to take their masks off after school - they wear them without thinking. I wish it would stunt their communication a bit, they talk for hours and hours non-stop every day, it's making me insane as a 'muted' person IRL.

    I'm sure masks are bad for some kids but for most - I don't think there is a looming big mask reckoning in 10-20 years.

  6. #37931
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    the leaps that are made in these threads are remarkable -
    We go from masking in schools, to claims babies are being damaged Because they can't play 'whole-face' peek-a-boo.

    If. you are opposed to masking in schools, I highly doubt you are masking at home with your baby ( /babies).

    I have seen three surges in covid ; the last two - well, actually all three -
    ... the surges in "severe covid ( necessitating hospitalization) " occurred in people who are Unvaccinated.

    Masking has been shown to be an effective tool in reducing the spread of the disease.
    where I come from it is known and it is understood and it is accepted that schools and school activities play a significant role in the spread of covid.
    The School is central to the community.

    With omicron being 70% more transmissible, booster rates being below 30% ( and vaccination rates being below 75% ),
    I am going to do what I can to Not contribute to the spread of the disease.


    from my perspective, those howling loudest here about 'The kids! ' are actually most interested in his life going back to the routines of 2019.

    The kids I see reflect the behaviors of the older people in their lives -
    it's a lot harder for a kid who is told they are being penalized, than it is for a kid who is shown that we will get through this and we can work together.

    I am much more concerned about more challenges to medical care than I am by the idea that /// than I am by masking in schools.

    thanks for listening. tj

  7. #37932
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush View Post
    Agreed. I was talking about my kids who are in primary school. They don't mind wearing a mask and I've seen zero ill effects of doing so. I do think distance learning was not great for many kids...these are crazy times. I don't have the answers. What i'm getting tired of are the disingenuous arguements from people like AR who cherry pick a piece from the Atlantic or an MIT paper stating that masks make it harder to communicate/learn for kids, without any other context, and use that to then argue that masks are pointless. It comes accross as self serving, meaning AR probably doesn't like wearing masks so he's looking for studies/reasons why masking is bad. Then using "the children" as his wedge to try to get out of wearing masks...it's completely self serving.
    +1. Thank you. tj

  8. #37933
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    Let’s be clear amongst all this “what about the kids?!”

    There is a massive difference between a 2 year old and a 12 year old. Yeah they are kids. No they are not the same. No their needs are not the same.

    A 1 year old needs at lot more focus on “development” than a 12 year old. Masks could impede vital development at a young age - kids that are 12 years old that is not likely in the vast vast majority.

  9. #37934
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    I'm in that "WFH bourgeoisie" and I want this to end NOW. Like, if I could wave a wand and just make covid disappear from the earth, I'd do it in a second. Everyone I work with feels the same way, too. Where are you getting this information that anyone actually WANTS this to continue?

    Wanting to continue working from home is not the same as wanting a pandemic to continue raging on in perpetuity.
    From the constant whining about child masking and distancing I see here and in many other media outlets. There is a whole class if people in this country who have weathered this pandemic much better than others, myself included, because I'm a relatively comfortable non working white male.

  10. #37935
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdironRider View Post
    The problem is largely adults can go to a restaurant, a concert or basically anywhere else in America and can say fuck it to wearing masks (we've all seen it) but kids can't because they are powerless and that is fucked.

    My gripe isn't with fully developed adults having to suck it up, it is with kids, who are by far and away the least likely to have health issues as a result of the virus yet are getting adult level restrictions placed upon them which then have an outsized effect on their development. It doesn't matter nearly as much for you or me to wear a mask vs our kids.
    yeah ok, eat shit on the suicides and then just make up some other stuff.
    have you not seen the anti-maskers fighting people at restaurants and the big boxes?
    i've yet to see any kids complain, let alone fight anyone over it.

    you would think that parents and family members are talking to their kids behind a mask in their houses for all of the crying here.
    j'ai des grands instants de lucididididididididi

  11. #37936
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdironRider View Post
    My gripe isn't with fully developed adults having to suck it up, it is with kids, who are by far and away the least likely to have health issues as a result of the virus yet are getting adult level restrictions placed upon them which then have an outsized effect on their development. It doesn't matter nearly as much for you or me to wear a mask vs our kids.
    Kids are very unlikely to have health issues, but the problem is they are vectors for infectious disease. That's pretty much the rule for all viral diseases. Do we really still need to point this out?

  12. #37937
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    Apparently.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

  13. #37938
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    Quote Originally Posted by ml242 View Post
    yeah ok, eat shit on the suicides and then just make up some other stuff.
    have you not seen the anti-maskers fighting people at restaurants and the big boxes?
    i've yet to see any kids complain, let alone fight anyone over it.

    you would think that parents and family members are talking to their kids behind a mask in their houses for all of the crying here.
    You posted a link that explicitly states in the title of the fucking article that suicides have increased in youths (as well as minorities) you fucking moron, and that is backed up plenty of times already in data I've posted.
    Live Free or Die

  14. #37939
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdironRider View Post
    You posted a link that explicitly states in the title of the fucking article that suicides have increased in youths (as well as minorities) you fucking moron, and that is backed up plenty of times already in data I've posted.
    The links I posted all show otherwise so maybe get serious about gun control since you care so much.

    ETA: is (as well as minorities) virtue-signalling? Asking for a someone who likes to point it out in everyone else.
    j'ai des grands instants de lucididididididididi

  15. #37940
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    I'm in that "WFH bourgeoisie" and I want this to end NOW. .
    Of course, his premise is absurd, glib and juvenile. There's no significant "perpetual pandemic" faction; the delineation is between people who believe mitigation policy and measures are the best path to 'normalcy' and those who believe those measures are ineffective and/or overbearing and a personal return to 'normalcy' is worth the resulting societal cost (illness/death).

  16. #37941
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    I guess everyone who is opposed to masking in schools must be adamantly opposed to home schooling because clearly those kids are losing out on all that necessary social interaction that takes place in schools. That would seem to be much more damaging then simply not being able to see other kids' faces during the school day.

  17. #37942
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    I guess everyone who is opposed to masking in schools must be adamantly opposed to home schooling because clearly those kids are losing out on all that necessary social interaction that takes place in schools. That would seem to be much more damaging then simply not being able to see other kids' faces during the school day.
    This is one of the reasons we know the whole "social interaction" mask argument is an obvious straw man - the venn diagram of armchair child psychologists who trot that out and also keep their kids home from school is a perfect, ironic circle. My brother is one of them.

  18. #37943
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    Quote Originally Posted by bennymac View Post
    Let’s be clear amongst all this “what about the kids?!”

    There is a massive difference between a 2 year old and a 12 year old. Yeah they are kids. No they are not the same. No their needs are not the same.

    A 1 year old needs at lot more focus on “development” than a 12 year old. Masks could impede vital development at a young age - kids that are 12 years old that is not likely in the vast vast majority.
    Yes. Seems most of are in agreement here. Big difference between a small child and a pre-teen/teen. And FTR, I'm not talking about it being damaging for the kid to wear the mask, but rather them not seeing faces on OTHER people. So imagine a daycare/pre-K/Kinder where teachers are masked, peers are masked, they have kids forcibly separated, sometimes plexiglass dividers, etc., yeah, it's GOING to have an effect. Most of all on babies, though. That's where it matters most.

    I'm sorry, but this kind of stuff is pure idiocy. Peak COVID theatre:

  19. #37944
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush View Post
    Surgeries sometimes take multiple hours to complete correct? And if what you say is true, that masks do fuckall if worn for long periods of time, then why do people in the medical profession wear them other than to keep blood splatter off their face.

    Also, my friends who are doctors in the COVID wards here wear their PPE all day, presumably because the masks still provide some utility after more than a short period of time. I guess what I'm wondering is where you come up with the idea that what the medical community is doing is pointless in such a case?
    To your first point--surgical masks are not designed or intended to protect against the transmission of respiratory viruses. They are designed to prevent larger droplets from being shed from the nose and mouth into patients' wounds and unless they get wet they are effective for hours. If they get wet through they should be changed.

    To your second point--it's not that the mask itself loses effectiveness after hours. You're doctor friends are going in and out of rooms containing individual patients, not spending that much time in each room, so if their fit tested mask leaks a little their exposure to a viral load is still low, and it's as low at the end of the day as at the beginning. Contrast to a poorly ventilated room full of people at desks, with ill fitting masks of varying quality, with several shedding some virus into the air, so that the virus accumulates in the air, all the while you, even with a good, well fitting mask, continually breathes in a little virus, which isn't so little after 8 hours. (note that patient rooms are very well ventilated and filtered, so virus is not accumulating in the air over time.)

    Anyway, I can't support my hypothesis about the relative ineffectiveness of masks in moderately crowded indoor settings over long periods of time with data. As I said.

    Do you remember that at the beginning of the pandemic someone found that the highest levels of covid in the air were in the places where people were removing their PPE?

  20. #37945
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    I guess everyone who is opposed to masking in schools must be adamantly opposed to home schooling because clearly those kids are losing out on all that necessary social interaction that takes place in schools. That would seem to be much more damaging then simply not being able to see other kids' faces during the school day.
    Here's the irony. That traditional stereotype has been flipped completely over these last couple of years. Big homeschool community in my neighborhood that my kids play with, so I've enjoyed witnessing it. While everybody else was busy shutting themselves indoors and interacting via Zoom, THESE kids were still running around, playing, riding their bikes in big packs, zero masks or fuks given, and basically just being normal kids like back in the Long Long Ago. In the Before Times. Contrast that with many of the "normal" kids I see out and about these days that are masked up to their eyeballs and look at everyone else with sheer looks of terror if you get within their 6 foot bubble. The "typical" public school teen was already getting bad enough pre-Covid thanks to living their lives through their cell phones and social media, and now Covid's forcibly pushed ALL of them in that direction. Social awkwardness is at all time highs for sure if you pay attention. Lots of kids acting pretty damn spectrum-y these days, ya know? No small coincidence that Mark Fuckerberg is cranking up the effort to push his whole Metaverse bullshit. Can't let THIS experience go to waste, ya know? Got stocks to pump, bro!

  21. #37946
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    Quote Originally Posted by MontuckyFried View Post
    Contrast that with many of the "normal" kids I see out and about these days that are masked up to their eyeballs and look at everyone else with sheer looks of terror if you get within their 6 foot bubble.
    I think you're seeing what you want to see. I see kids behaving like they always have only wearing masks more often.

    In any event, claiming that kids are going to be warped for life because they don't get to see their teacher's and classmates' faces at school, yet being okay with homeschooling is pure hypocrisy.

  22. #37947
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    I think you're seeing what you want to see. I see kids behaving like they always have only wearing masks more often.
    Fair enough. I won't deny that. Just casual observation. No data to back it up. Only time will tell on that one as years long studies are taking place I'm sure. I pray I'm wrong and that whole generation is going to be fine long-term, but it is a very real concern for those of us with kids. We all want the best for them, no matter what side of the debate you're on. Best of luck, everyone. Hope your kids are all doing great through all this nonsense. Truly.

  23. #37948
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    I think you're seeing what you want to see. I see kids behaving like they always have only wearing masks more often.

    In any event, claiming that kids are going to be warped for life because they don't get to see their teacher's and classmates' faces at school, yet being okay with homeschooling is pure hypocrisy.
    I think he just likes being dramatic on the internet. He’s hysterical.

  24. #37949
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    My kids 6 and 9 are perfectly happy with masks on at school. They could care less. They understand that wearingasks prevent spread of disease. They think that is good. Do they want it to go back to normal, yes, do I? Yes.
    The kids who suffer from masks is purely due to idiotic parents.
    Kids are vectors for disease. Yes the kid may be fine if they get COVID, but they may expose someone who will not, so we wear masks when we go indoors (not at home of course). They understand this. They are ok with it. They still play sports, play with friends and go to school. All of those good things are more likely to continue by wearing masks.
    When my neighbor broke her leg in Idaho, she wanted to go to the u of u hospital, and was told to go somewhere else. Why? Anti vax anti masks jackasses clogging up the works.
    Just wear your fucking mask at school. It's not that hard.
    I think the people who think the WFH elite want this to continue don't grasp what is going on (fox news brain etc...) Are just worried about everybody else taking advantage of them, victim mentality, general boneheaded was from consuming too much bullshit.
    Want to come over to my house? Cool, come on over. not vaccinated? Wear a mask. Won't wear a mask and not vaccinated? Beat it and stay away from me.

    Sent from my SM-G960U using TGR Forums mobile app
    sigless.

  25. #37950
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    My kids are 5 and 7, have been wearing masks for 2 years now and are totally fine with it. In fact, they're better at wearing masks than most adults I see. I do pickup or dropoff every day, and have seen none of that "terror" you describe Montucky, so if you see that on a regular basis you may want to review your personal care habits. None of them give a shit about the masking, other than taking longer to catch their breath during sports and other stuff.
    AdironRider - I think the concern is good, but most kids are getting plenty of non-mask time with friends or trusted groups or are in spaces where everyone is masked and equal, so I don't think it hits as hard as you think. At least from my observations, the few kids that are more on the worrying side keep them on and all the others still play merrily with them as who cares, let's play!
    Also, @Montucky - go fuck yourself. Some of us are socially awkward all the time, so you can go stuff comments up your ass. Some people don't have a choice but to have it all be harder, not like you who make yourself socially distasteful with your dumb commentary. All you've done is parrot conservablogs and raise false alarms over bullshit. Just leave, you're such a fucking clown on this shit I can't see how anyone could trust a single word you say.

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