Fear and Loathing, a Rat Flu Odyssey

[twat]

What is the deathrate compared to the newborn rate in 9month?

Sent from ullr with love!

[BigDaddy]

Wasn't he the one that proposed England "take it on the chin" for dealing with covid outbreak?

It'd be amaaaaazing if the same thing happened to Trump but we all know that irony is dead in America.

Sent from my SM-N960U using TGR Forums mobile app

But we can still dream...


My biggest concern, is that Bernie stays in the race, as back up for Biden. I don't think odds are too great for both to come out of this unscathed. Not a great time to be a politician. Hope I'm wrong, but Pats proved you should keep a good back up.

[Timberridge]

Hope I'm wrong, but Pats proved you should keep a good back up.

I thought they traded him to SF?

[BigDaddy]

I thought they traded him to SF?

That's what I'm saying.... they should have kept him. They'd be in way better shape.

[skifishbum]

The fuckin bernbros kept texting me asking to the rah rah 4 team feel the burners for shit got real yo
Sent em a text last week asking which of his houses he's sheltered safe in
And if he has allowed a non millionaire or a 1st responder trying to keep his fam safeto use the other
Ain't heard back yet I'll let yas know if I do

[Benny Profane]

Things are getting weird on the PPE and ventilator front.

Days after the Trump admin asserted that federal medical supplies are "our stockpile" and "not supposed to be states’ stockpiles that they then use", both states and companies (Kaiser, in particular) are claiming that the feds are intercepting their shipments.

This could be a good thing, depending on how much we trust the Trump crew to manage supplies effectively. Or, you know, maybe it's just the next chapter in an epic clusterfuck.

Jared is in charge. So, I say clusterfuck.

[Name Redacted]

It is surprising how unsurprising this is:

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/donal...112913777.html

[Danno]

Africa hasn’t done any stay at home that I know of.
]

Not true.

[::: :::]

Not true.

He’s lying and does know?

[Danno]

He’s lying and does know?

Heh.

One of my brothers lives in Africa, and has been at home for the last few weeks.

[swissiphic]

A reminder to the "just-let-it-run-its-course-and-get-it-over-with" crowd--in that scenario in addition to truck drivers that were mentioned--think cops, emts, health care workers, grocery workers, the people who keep the lights on and the water running, the people who process the unemployment claims and small business loans, the people who bury and cremate the dead, the people who keep the internet running (imagine the panic if there if people aren't getting any information) I could go on and on. Even if only a small fraction of those folks die at least half of the rest will be off work sick for weeks at a time over a very short period of time. And at least half the nonessential workers who've gone back to work will be off sick as well. People will be dying at home and lying in the streets.

The reason to drag this thing out is to prevent a total collapse of civilized society (and American society as well) because once it falls apart it will be very hard to put back together. You want the economy to be hibernating, not dead. Life is marginally tolerable now --yeah a shitload of people can't pay their bills but with a moratorium on evictions and foreclosures and if the unemployment checks and small business loans can get processed the vast majority of people will have a roof over their head, heat, electric, water and food. Eventually all the money that's being borrowed to keep this going is going to have to be paid back and that will be a bitch--no way to do it without going back to tax rates like the 50;s (a very prosperous era), but it's doable. But if the lights go out and people aren't eating things will be very very nasty.

I'm sure people have modeled various pandemic scenarios--the "flattened curver" scenario vs the "taking it on the chin" scenario and a bunch of others as well. They may not be telling the public the outcomes of the various scenarios but they're telling the pols--and at least some are listening which is why most of us are staying home.

Saw a thing on PBS about the middle east--a lot of those countries have much stricter and better enforced stay at home policies than we do. They know they have no choice given their rudimentary health care system. Even the Israelis seem to be enforcing a stricter policy than us, and if there's anyone who likes to be told what to do less than us it's the Israelis. A "stiff-necked" people as it says in the bible.

Thanks for that, O.G. Agreed. Hope you don't mind me cut and pasting this summary of the context we're in to other folks in my life. It expresses my sentiments exactly, with much better elucidation of thoughts than my brain could deliver it with.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Thanks for that, O.G. Agreed. Hope you don't mind me cut and pasting this summary of the context we're in to other folks in my life. It expresses my sentiments exactly, with much better elucidation of thoughts than my brain could deliver it with.

One thing we're going to have to get comfortable with is that if social distancing works we're going to have a bunch of idiots come out of the woodwork claiming that Trump was right that this was all a hoax and that there was nothing for concern. It's already happening here in Oregon. There have been reports that social distancing has reduced the number of infections by 70%, which is great if true. That's got the Trumpeters in my orbit saying how stupid this whole social distancing thing is, and what a waste it is...but I keep telling them that this only means that all of these efforts MIGHT be working. Fucking idiots.

[Buster Highmen]

A reminder to the "just-let-it-run-its-course-and-get-it-over-with" crowd--in that scenario in addition to truck drivers that were mentioned--think cops, emts, health care workers, grocery workers, the people who keep the lights on and the water running, the people who process the unemployment claims and small business loans, the people who bury and cremate the dead, the people who keep the internet running (imagine the panic if there if people aren't getting any information) I could go on and on. Even if only a small fraction of those folks die at least half of the rest will be off work sick for weeks at a time over a very short period of time. And at least half the nonessential workers who've gone back to work will be off sick as well. People will be dying at home and lying in the streets.

The reason to drag this thing out is to prevent a total collapse of civilized society (and American society as well) because once it falls apart it will be very hard to put back together. .

Obviously, you misunderstand the laissez-fair motivation.

[MontuckyFried]

Has anybody evaluated the mosquito transmission potential yet?

Oh balls. I hadn't even thought of that. Florida, Louisiana, Minnesota and a bunch of others are screwed if that can happen.


Sent from my Pixel 3 using TGR Forums mobile app

[Bunion 2020]

It is surprising how unsurprising this is:

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/donal...112913777.html

History is a bitch.

Why Is Trump Obsessed with Hydroxychloroquine?
It's in his bones.
by Tim Miller
April 7, 2020 5:13 am

You know the old saying: When you’re a con artist who once ran a multi-level-marketing scheme that sold “vitamins,” everything looks like a miracle drug.

Speaking of which, the president of the United States has some things to tell you about the medicine hydroxychloroquine, which is used to treat malaria and lupus:

“We bought a tremendous amount of hydroxychloroquine, which I think is, you know, it’s a great malaria drug. It’s worked unbelievably.”

“I’m not a doctor. But I have common sense.”

There are many questions surrounding the White House’s obsession with hydroxychloroquine. Whether someone has a financial incentive for pushing it. (It’s certainly possible, since he has at least some stake.) The extent to which it actually works (Fingers crossed!) Which TV doctor got the president so spun up on it? (Dr. Oz?)

Some of these are unanswerable. The Trump family’s finances are still impossibly opaque. I have no relevant expertise in immunosuppressive pharmaceuticals. And performing forensic accounting on Trump’s television habits would require access to the meta-data inside his super-DVR remote.

But I do, regrettably, know far too much about the career of Donald Trump. And his weeks long hydroxychloroquine song and dance is simply a redux of the pitch job that has served him so well for four decades: Sell the newest Trump-branded miracle scheme as hard as possible until it becomes completely untenable, the feds show up, or the next one bubbles up from the recesses of his frontal lobe.

You may or may not know about “Ideal Health.”

Ideal Health was a multi-level-marketing company—that’s the polite term for “pyramid scheme”—founded in the 1990s that sold personalized vitamin supplements based on the results of a urine test.

This pee test supposedly provided “a scientific window into your personal biochemistry.”

The company hired a network of low- to middle-income salespeople who earned a commission both from vitamin sales and from recruiting other salespeople. Ideal Health would charge these salespeople thousands of dollars up front to get access to marketing materials and other “network benefits.”

You will not be surprised to learn that many of these people lost all their money and didn’t sell any vitamins. Dozens of them filed complaints with the Federal Trade Commission. The company had to settle a lawsuit with the FTC over false claims that “Supreme Greens”—one of their signature products—“cured cancer.”

In short, Ideal Health was a shady vitamin pyramid scheme with a reputation for lying about cancer cures.

Naturally, Donald J. Trump had to get a piece of the action.

In March 2009, Trump purchased Ideal Health and then took Worldcom and Stringer Bell’s advice on fixing a troubled asset by giving it a shiny new gold lamé moniker. He called it “The Trump Network.”

Under Trump, The Network offered a miracle “custom essential” multivitamin based on the “privatest.” They also offered pills for “silhouette solutions” (a diet program), skin care, low-energy, and of course some “Snazzle Snaxxs” for the kids. (I’m sure the health benefits of the Snazzle Twissters Sour Cream and Onion were legion).

But Trump’s real value add was as a pitch man. The Trump Network launch came on the heels of the financial meltdown, so he updated the Ideal Health proposition to would-be salespeople, convincing them that if they listened to Trump they would discover the cheat code to breaking out of financial hardship.

You should watch for yourself.

“Americans need a new plan. They need a new dream. The Trump Network wants to give millions of people renewed hope, with an exciting plan to opt-out of the recession . . . with cutting edge health and wellness formulas.”

To anyone watching Trump’s pandemic press briefings, his Trump Network spiel sounds familiar. What do you have to lose?!

Or as Trump apologist Ari Fleischer delicately puts it, the president always “reaches for hope.”

(I suppose the big guy just can’t help himself. He’s a lot like Reagan and Lincoln in that way, right Ari?)

Of course, for people in The Trump Network, the false promises, or misleading snakeoil, or incorrigible, happy-warrior hope—call it what you will—wound up costing them a lot.

Those who joined didn’t get to opt-out of the recession the way Trump had promised. Instead they had their hardship extended. More bills they couldn’t afford.

FTC complaints came down the pike, again. The Washington Post later reported that Trump Network sales representatives said “they paid thousands of dollars for leadership programs, infomercials, starter kits, and other materials that they never recovered in sales.” As one FTC complaint put it, “They try to use [people’s] hopes and dreams to empty their wallets.”

Offering hope with one hand while grabbing cash with the other was not a one off move for Trump with Ideal Health. It was basically his business model.

In 2018 the Trump family was hit with a RICO lawsuit that laid out a pattern of scams where Donald Trump “deliberately defrauded” vulnerable people who were convinced to put thousands of dollars they didn’t have into marketing schemes that made Trump millions but returned little to nothing to them.

Each scam—from the Trump Network to ACN to Trump University—followed the same playbook. Trump used his image and fame to sell false hope to the marks.

The hope that they could get rich. That they could get the perfect body. That they could find the custom essential vitamin that works only for them. That they could be an orange billionaire in a penthouse with a hot wife and a hotter side piece. All they had to do was give Donald Trump their last paycheck, swallow another vitamin, take this one more class.

And by the time the marks figured out that the scheme didn’t work, Trump had taken the monorail to the next town over. Selling new suckers (and the same media) on a similar bill of goods.

As David Frum wrote a few weeks ago

This is how Donald Trump is wired. He doesn’t know any other way. And he has no incentive to change his behavior because the neverending scam wheel eventually landed him in the most important job in the world.

God-willing maybe the rest of us will get lucky and hydroxychloroquine will turn out to be the one scheme that actually works.

You could bet your venture capital on it, if you have some. I just wouldn’t bet your life.

[Deebased]

You can move the goal posts if you like, but that doesn't change the facts of the matter, so my point stands. Sweden first COVID-19 case, Feb 4. USA first COVID-19 case, Jan 20. They're 2-3 weeks behind us in this whole shindig. They have a higher death rate than us, yet they arguably have a healthier population and universal HC, so one would think they could attack this a little better than us. Maybe you're right, maybe they'll end up having a lower death rate after all said and done. I don't trust the numbers being told to us by this current administration...I don't think anyone knows the whole picture to be even able to make a valid comparison at this moment between the US and Sweden, or anywhere for that matter because we've done fuckall for testing..same with the Swedes.

To make a claim that Sweden is nailing the response to this thing at this point is uniformed at best.

That's fair, next week we could see Sweden and Belarus take off. We may also see them slow faster than someplace with a complete state lockdown and pretty extensive testing like NY.

[Buster Highmen]

Oh balls. I hadn't even thought of that. Florida, Louisiana, Minnesota and a bunch of others are screwed if that can happen.


Sent from my Pixel 3 using TGR Forums mobile app

I read that mosquitos can't transmit COVID-19.

[swissiphic]

One thing we're going to have to get comfortable with is that if social distancing works we're going to have a bunch of idiots come out of the woodwork claiming that Trump was right that this was all a hoax and that there was nothing for concern. It's already happening here in Oregon. There have been reports that social distancing has reduced the number of infections by 70%, which is great if true. That's got the Trumpeters in my orbit saying how stupid this whole social distancing thing is, and what a waste it is...but I keep telling them that this only means that all of these efforts MIGHT be working. Fucking idiots.

That would be the same cidiots that Climbed Everest in big, puffy down suits and supplemental oxygen and thought in hindsight that the down suits and oxygen were just extra weight and pointless cause they shoulda/coulda just climbed the little hill naked with their own lungs....or something like that. Edit...excluding Wim Hof from that analogy/metaphor thingy.

[Adolf Allerbush]

That's fair, next week we could see Sweden and Belarus take off. We may also see them slow faster than someplace with a complete state lockdown and pretty extensive testing like NY.

Yeah, and I hope it's the latter and they've got it figured out. It sounds like it's slowing down in other parts of Europe, so hopefully they're on that trend and not ours.

[iceman]

I read that mosquitos can't transmit COVID-19.

Yeah it's in this thread not too far back, I think from Mofro but not sure about that. Basically the virus pretty much doesn't get into the blood so non-transmissible by mosquitos was my reading. iirc imo etc.

[Core Shot]

Drove by the backside of our local hospital and saw a big ass refrigerator tractor trailer.

Jeebus.

[iceman]

I hope deebased is right and after a quick sharp surge Sweden comes out the other side quickly and in good shape. Then they can get back to work and start producing more of the best thing they ever made, the SAAB 900. Old-school, unkillable, technologically simple vehicles for the post-pandemic world.

[KQ]

Donald Trump Has Stake In Hydroxychloroquine Drugmaker: Report

http://huffp.st/DJf5ryj

[The AD]

For weeks, the Trump administration pushed states to procure their own ventilators and protective gear, like masks, gloves and face shields. But a new effort by the administration to create a hybrid system of distribution — divided between the federal government, local officials and private health care companies — has led to new confusion, bordering on disarray, and charges of confiscation.

Yeah, remember the million bottles of water sitting on the tarmac in Puerto Rico after Hurricane Maria? What could possibly go wrong?

[huckbucket]

I hope deebased is right and after a quick sharp surge Sweden comes out the other side quickly and in good shape. Then they can get back to work and start producing more of the best thing they ever made, the SAAB 900. Old-school, unkillable, technologically simple vehicles for the post-pandemic world.

Are they like dropping the engine from the "last of the V8 interceptors" into each one? Maybe beefing up the capacity of the fuel tanks?