"Progressive" hardtails - yay or nay?

[toast2266]

I will be doing the same soon as well, getting a medium which also feels weird. What color did you go with?

Nice. I did polar blue, although there's a bunch of nice looking color options. I probably should've done purple to match my old yelli.

[grabtindy]

Those BTRs are sick, that Ranger looks about perfect. Lead time, however, is brutal. I am not a patient man.

[D(C)]

I haven't had one of the truly progressive hardtails, but I did have a current gen alloy Chameleon, and hated it. I got it with 27.5+ initially, and really, really, really disliked the undamped rebound of the big tires. Switched it to 29x2.5 and it got better. On that particular bike, it's got like a 74 STA, and while I know that the effective STA on hardtails is steeper because the front sags, it felt like I was way over the rear end and stretched out. On climbs, I had a hard time keeping traction with the front wheel, another indicator to me that the seated position is too far back. Some of that may have come from locking out the fork climbing, but it just never felt like it was as comfortable climbing as my Sentinel. The steep HTA (like 67) felt even steeper because of the hardtail sag effect, especially since I "only" had a 140mm fork on it. Finally, when descending fast, even on smooth trails, my feet fucking HURT. That said, the guy who bought it off me loves it. And after he got that, another guy he rides with got a Chromag, and loves it too.

I did consider getting a progressive steel frame to replace it (Chromag & Pipedream Moxie were leading candidates), but ended up buying a used alloy Smuggler frame. I don't ride that as much as I thought I would (complicated reasons mostly boiling down to "it's not as nice as my Sentinel"), but it didn't cost *that* much more than a hardtail frame would have. But since you already have a Ripley, it sounds like you don't really want/need a different short travel bike.

Anyways, TLDR: make sure it's got really progressive geo, has a long fork, and be prepared to have your feet hurt.

Some days, the hardtail is awesome. Other days, it's just hard. That's a reality of hardtails.

As the owner of a 2019 Rootdown, I love it at times but other times, I want to sell the damn thing. It beats you up when you're not on your game. I find the hardtail does best on slow, technical trails, and on faster, twisty trails. On the fast, open stuff, even on trails you think are smooth after riding on a FS, the hardtail does poorly. It chatters and skips around and doesn't hold corners the same way as a full suspension.

I think a hardtail makes a great second bike, but be realistic with your expectations for it. You will probably hate it some days. But when it's good, it's good.

Note: this is coming from the perspective of someone who lives in Coastal BC. If I lived somewhere else, my impressions might be different.

Chromags are out of Whistler, where the majority of the riding is steep jank. This is good hardtail terrain.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Long not-so-smooth climbs are the hardest part for me. It's not even a butt thing, it's a (lack of) core strength and sometimes traction thing.
It really depends on what trails you're riding. The trails around here are pretty smooth. The ones that aren't I'm mostly going downhill.
One problem is traveling even an hour with it could put me into some shit that would just be exhausting or impossible with a hardtail. If I wasn't looking at a new car, I'd be looking at a FS.

[bagtagley]

Already posted in the tight shorts thread, but this seems like an appropriate repost.


https://www.marinobike.com/producto/...ail-mtb-frame/

Somebody buy one and tell me how heavy/straight/janky it is.

[Canada1]

Last year I bought one of my kids a diamond back hardtail for racing. I had planned to drive out to Denver to pick up one of Smoakin's fleet he was selling when this came up online for sale at a comparable price and I figured I would have the warranty. I thought it would be a novelty bike. I pull that thing off the wall all the time. It is fun to climb on and rocket fast compared to other bikes we own. If I'm following one of my younger kids on a more flowy trail, or just looking to go hit up a climb it get's used. He uses it on race days and probably about half the time on practice rides. It is a 2017 and not as progressive as these. I would buy it again in an instant. it's kind of like days I throw on the short slalom skis. Sometimes different makes a trail fun again.

[plugboots]

Sometimes different makes a trail fun again.

So very true. I must have 200+ strava runs on the trail that starts at my house. Imma bout ready to take the road bike on it.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Already posted in the tight shorts thread, but this seems like an appropriate repost.


https://www.marinobike.com/producto/...ail-mtb-frame/

Somebody buy one and tell me how heavy/straight/janky it is.

In order to get a tapered head tube it has to be at least 5"? That seems long.

[fastfred]

So very true. I must have 200+ strava runs on the trail that starts at my house. Imma bout ready to take the road bike on it.

Maybe it's time to move

Hard tails are a blast specially at 22 lbs I can only last 2 hrs on one sometimes i go bigger and my lower back hursts

Rocky mtn vertex

Was I really high the other day looking at bike porn yesterday cause I swear I saw a bike listed as 26 plus.......

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[stuckathuntermtn]

Yes, my back!
26+ might be a thing now.

[frorider]

Already posted in the tight shorts thread, but this seems like an appropriate repost.


https://www.marinobike.com/producto/...ail-mtb-frame/

Somebody buy one and tell me how heavy/straight/janky it is.

Looked into them a bit but tales of crooked frames and suggestions to fix with a hammer kinda steered me away. I’d rather get a custom Ti frame from the Waltly guys in China. Or just ride the shit out of the Ragley I posted above. $375 and pretty dialed geo.

[Touring_Sedan]

Some days, the hardtail is awesome. Other days, it's just hard. That's a reality of hardtails.

As the owner of a 2019 Rootdown, I love it at times but other times, I want to sell the damn thing. It beats you up when you're not on your game. I find the hardtail does best on slow, technical trails, and on faster, twisty trails. On the fast, open stuff, even on trails you think are smooth after riding on a FS, the hardtail does poorly. It chatters and skips around and doesn't hold corners the same way as a full suspension.

I think a hardtail makes a great second bike, but be realistic with your expectations for it. You will probably hate it some days. But when it's good, it's good.

Note: this is coming from the perspective of someone who lives in Coastal BC. If I lived somewhere else, my impressions might be different.

Chromags are out of Whistler, where the majority of the riding is steep jank. This is good hardtail terrain.

I'll second these opinions and +1 for the Rootdown. And as some others have said, there are days it makes the same ole' trail feel new again.

[nickwm21]

These hardtails with 160mm+ forks just look wrong to me. If I had the means for another bike I’d have a 130mm 29 hardtail with modern geo.


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[bagtagley]

Looked into them a bit but tales of crooked frames and suggestions to fix with a hammer kinda steered me away. I’d rather get a custom Ti frame from the Waltly guys in China. Or just ride the shit out of the Ragley I posted above. $375 and pretty dialed geo.

I've seen a bit of both. Seems plenty of folks have gotten straight frames, albeit heavy and a bit ugly in the weld department. Nobody else is gonna build me a Chamois Hagar clone (aka, Chamois Sosa) for under $400.

[gravitylover]

#hardtailsforever I've had a couple of squishy bikes over the years and was never able to feel the same connection as I do on hardtails. I have 2 right now, a steel Hayduke with 150 up front and it's a buncha fun. The other is a Norco Fluid VLT (e-mtb) also with a 150 fork up front that's pretty much a rolling gigglefest. Both can be pointed into almost any situation with a high level of confidence.

[Fred Pabst]

Because you need more than one bike. Check out RSD bikes out of Ontario, Canada. They make some hardtails that can be bought for cheap with decent build kits. This model is the Sergeant. They come as geared bikes but horizontal rear dropouts makes for an easy single-speed conversion. Swapped out the 27.5x3.0 schwalbe's for 2.85 rekons and greatly improved the ride. May even go down 2.6 though I'm not sure how that would be on a 50 mil rim?

[grabtindy]

I am 99% of the way to pulling a trigger on an RSD. The Ti Middlechild is super appealing.

[frorider]

As I recall that middlechild has a pretty high BB....only 40 mm drop compared to the 50-65 mm drop this market has trended toward.

[slowroastin]

These hardtails with 160mm+ forks just look wrong to me. If I had the means for another bike I’d have a 130mm 29 hardtail with modern geo.


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Ibis DV9 is appealing. I wish it was steel though.


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[Touring_Sedan]

These hardtails with 160mm+ forks just look wrong to me. If I had the means for another bike I’d have a 130mm 29 hardtail with modern geo.


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If you'd asked me 3 years ago, I would have agreed. I had the previous version Rootdown on a 140 fork and while that one was fun too, 160 is a fucking blast on the new one. This is coming from a guy whose quiver includes 3 rigid bikes that get ridden regularly.

[SchralphMacchio]

I am 99% of the way to pulling a trigger on an RSD. The Ti Middlechild is super appealing.

You love your Megatrail, live in Denver ... and didn’t list Pedalhead or see if the factory can hook you up with a demo?

Go freaking try one out on whatever is dry! Even if it’s pavement!

I love my Pedalhead. 29 x 2.6F / 2.4R. But I live in western Oregon with mostly smooth trails ... for more chunk I would go with the 2.6R. I’ve been pretty happy with the Spesh Butcher Grid 2.6 for my needs (mud shedding, wet traction, and not being a total pig with weight).

The PH is not light. It feels like a heavy solid rig, but that weight disappears into the trail due to the dialed geometry. I think I can jump my PH more cleanly than I can my Bronson. I like having the 29” HT vs 27” carbon FS bike, good contrast. I also set up my PH with a 120/150 dual position Pike, so I can change its riding character with the flip of a switch. If I were heavier, I probably would have gone with a 130/160 dual position Lyrik, as the frame can handle as much rowdiness as you can throw at it, just need to learn to finesse your ankles and use the fork to its full abilities.

I don’t have enough experience with other hardtails to say whether the square tubing on the PH is doing it, but my intuition tells me the square tubing on the rear triangle makes the thing pretty awesomely damp to vertical chatter but torsionally rigid.

Also, I love how this thread has finally brought all the hardtail fanatics in here out of the woodwork, lol.

[GeorgiaSnow]

Just pulled the trigger on a medium Pole Taival. Excited to join the party.

[beaterdit]

Ordered a new Nimble Nine from Canfield on their back friday sale. Numbers look good, hell of a deal at $600. Unfortunately won’t ship till spring but can’t wait to build it up.

Steel, 66* HA with a 150mm fork, 415-430mm. adjustable dropouts, 450mm reach on a med, only 5mm shorter than my Firebird.

https://canfieldbikes.com/products/n...31407582380107

[Touring_Sedan]

Ordered a new Nimble Nine from Canfield on their back friday sale. Numbers look good, hell of a deal at $600. Unfortunately won’t ship till spring but can’t wait to build it up.

Steel, 66* HA with a 150mm fork, 415-430mm. adjustable dropouts, 450mm reach on a med, only 5mm shorter than my Firebird.

https://canfieldbikes.com/products/n...31407582380107

That's a colorway I can get behind.

[grabtindy]

New bike day! Ended up passing on the RSD because I found a Chromag locally for less than half the cost.
Dekerf welded frame, I9 hubs laced to NOBL rims, Renthal stem and bars, Pike 150 fork, reverb stealth and sram drivetrain.

Here she is:





Planning to ride it as is for a bit, but thinking an Angleset and Ribbon Air 160 might be in the works.