Silver Mt, ID 1/7/2020 Two Fatalities

[powdork]

All of you that are aiding and abetting negligence here are despicable. An avalanche of this size, occurring on open terrain of that nature isn't "the raw power of mother nature" it's inexcusable. Full Stop. The snow safety director and patrol director there need to lose their jobs, and should never be able to work in those fields again, anywhere. They fucked up by opening that terrain to the public.

If you disagree, you're wrong, AND you're welcome to go fuck yourself.

But sure, go ahead and be corporate apologists, I would expect nothing less from the legions of herpetic sphincters around here.

It might look like I'm giving you the finger but that's me fucking myself, because I disagree. Not just now but with pretty much everything you've ever written here. You're a cretin.
That doesn't ski

[sfotex]

I think most people consider Recco a body retrieval tool due to it's bulkiness over transceivers . But I think I heard of someone in Europe being found alive with one, probably because the first on the scene is often a heli that can do Recco recon in the Alps.

In the US there's a helicopter Recco unit in Salt Lake and one out of Whitefish (2 Bear Air - they used their unit in this rescue). If there's a reported burial in the Wasatch without companion rescue the first thing is try to get a dog and handler in the air as fast as possible.

RECCO is continuing its development of rescue reflectors and have released a line of reflectors that can be purchased separately and attached to backpacks, stuck onto helmets, etc. This is to support their RECCO helicopter operated device to allow rescuers in quickly searching large areas for reflectors in a variety of terrain. With the increased incorporation of reflectors by many equipment and clothing manufacturers and the increased RECCO SAR coverage, RECCO has promise for being an efficient search tool not only in avalanche situations anymore. Austria announced that they have 4 RECCO SAR detectors and are able to cover the whole country with this search tool.

[fastfroggy]

In the US there's a helicopter Recco unit in Salt Lake and one out of Whitefish (2 Bear Air - they used their unit in this rescue). If there's a reported burial in the Wasatch without companion rescue the first thing is try to get a dog and handler in the air as fast as possible.

RECCO is continuing its development of rescue reflectors and have released a line of reflectors that can be purchased separately and attached to backpacks, stuck onto helmets, etc. This is to support their RECCO helicopter operated device to allow rescuers in quickly searching large areas for reflectors in a variety of terrain. With the increased incorporation of reflectors by many equipment and clothing manufacturers and the increased RECCO SAR coverage, RECCO has promise for being an efficient search tool not only in avalanche situations anymore. Austria announced that they have 4 RECCO SAR detectors and are able to cover the whole country with this search tool.

thanks for the intel. def see a lot more reflectors around. now even on scarpa bc boots....

[NWFlow]

There are definitely more around...would be nice if companies made them easily removable, however. Makes it difficult to purchase gear as a potential rscuer if the recco is not removable.

[idahospud]

Wow, just put two and two together with the fairer member of the Spud household and it turns out she knew the last victim and I met her all of once. They hadn't talked since probably 2012, but still pretty damn jarring just the same.

[summit]

There are definitely more around...would be nice if companies made them easily removable, however. Makes it difficult to purchase gear as a potential rscuer if the recco is not removable.

Wrap yourself in foil!

Or you can use those armbands that come with the recco unit as shields. They help. Some.

Or scalpel it

[splat]

In the US there's a helicopter Recco unit in Salt Lake and one out of Whitefish (2 Bear Air - they used their unit in this rescue). If there's a reported burial in the Wasatch without companion rescue the first thing is try to get a dog and handler in the air as fast as possible.

Old school tip was to always pack a couple dog bones in your gear.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

Glademaster you should live in a bubble

Oh, he does.

[tgapp]

Just read this whole thread - super heavy stuff. Thoughts & good vibes to the victims' families, the first responders, and all others affected by this. Sobering to read - I'll be carrying my beacon on deep days inbounds now. What an awful tragedy.

Glademaster - go fuck yourself, please? Even if there is an opportunity for professional growth, reflection, and learning from this incident, this isn't the correct forum for pointing fingers, and none of us are privy to the details which would actually inform a meaningful conversation around avalanche mitigation and snow safety that day at Silver.

Hold your loved ones close.

[old goat]

There are definitely more around...would be nice if companies made them easily removable, however. Makes it difficult to purchase gear as a potential rscuer if the recco is not removable.

My jacket and pants both have reflectors, I have no idea where they are and I've looked.
I wonder how many people have reflectors in their gear and don't know it, especially in bounds skiers. Probably makes it difficult to clear out all the Recco wearing volunteers when the detector shows up.
How deep can the dogs find a victim--20 feet obviously too deep?

[jono]

Because there is an opportunity for professional growth, reflection, and learning from this incident, this isn't the correct forum for pointing fingers

FIFY. Glademaster was wrong, full stop. The exact thing he (and everyone else) hopes will come from this in the future (learning/prevention) has been proven to be best achieved when blame is kept out of the conversation. The fact that he couldn't check his emotions well enough to avoid that counterproductive post may be indicative of his own psychological state; someone should probably do a welfare check in North Bend.

And we should probably have a sticky in here about finger pointing, it comes up so often.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Gapeasser seems to have taken the hint.

[skifishbum]

My jacket and pants both have reflectors, I have no idea where they are and I've looked.
I wonder how many people have reflectors in their gear and don't know it, especially in bounds skiers. Probably makes it difficult to clear out all the Recco wearing volunteers when the detector shows up.
How deep can the dogs find a victim--20 feet obviously too deep?

dogs work on the scent cone committed from targets
So densities interference wind time of burial and other factors are great variables in the ability for them to be able to aquire the scent
I pass no judgement offer only vibes for those involved
And attempt to ski with a protect yourself and crew at all times mentality
Which often isn't easy

[sfotex]

'Game changer:' New technology assists avalanche search and rescue efforts

“If we start getting more and more people with these RECCO chips, it cuts down significantly on our search times,” said Hutchings.

That’s how a woman’s body was found buried in an avalanche in Idaho last week.

A helicopter using RECCO technology picked up on the RECCO chip she was wearing.

https://www.ksl.com/article/46704664...rescue-efforts


There's 3 Heli Recco's in the US: Salt Lake, Whitefish, and Washington

[summit]

How long before insurers require mountains with avalanche mitigation programs to have a RECCO device so they don't have to call in a helo on day 2? My guess is not until there are multiple live finds.

[splat]

Dogs and Recco don't come anywhere near what the beep will do. Strapping on is what savers you.

[GoldMember]

Story in this morning's Spokesman Review. Initial investigation states that the avalanche was started by a skier (not a surprise) and that it was size 3, not 4 as reported earlier. Also, patrol had done mitigation work in line with their normal protocol and, perhaps, beyond but didn't initiate the slide.

My heart goes out to the entire Silver community, many of whom I know, and especially to the patrol who were there and the self-guilt I'm sure they feel. As for the grenade tossers (Glademeister...), snow science is incredibly complicated and we all learn more as these events occur. For these three lost, there have been innumerable lives saved by the work of patrol and the ongoing collection of data and science that will make us all safer as we continue to push limits in our pursuits. I have skied this very area many times myself since my first trip to Jackass Ski Bowl in 1969. I've never seen it go like it did at any time we skied there. It's a freak event.

Here is the S-R article: https://www.spokesman.com/stories/20...skiers-trigge/

[Bunion 2020]

I will agree with everything you wrote other than "Freak Event".

Ski area avalanche mitigation is pretty fucking good in the US but everyone who skis terrain that is capable of producing an avalanche should understand that there will always be some risk and they by skiing such terrain they are accepting some level of that risk.

Vibes to all affected.

[GoldMember]

^^ Maybe freak event isn't the right term but it was definitely an unusual event. My point is that in the 50+ years that I've frequented Silver, albeit not that frequently over the past several years, I've never seen that slope go unless it had been slid by patrol. With that, you're right in that anyone who skis slopes of that magnitude needs to understand that there's always that one time....

[MagnificentUnicorn]

I will agree with everything you wrote other than "Freak Event".

Ski area avalanche mitigation is pretty fucking good in the US but everyone who skis terrain that is capable of producing an avalanche should understand that there will always be some risk and they by skiing such terrain they are accepting some level of that risk.

Vibes to all affected.

Like my friend the patrol director says”it’s a mountain environment, we can’t eliminate all risk”.

[Bunion 2020]

^^^ Exactly.

Have a safe winter.

[wstdeep]

All of you that are aiding and abetting negligence here are despicable. An avalanche of this size, occurring on open terrain of that nature isn't "the raw power of mother nature" it's inexcusable. Full Stop. The snow safety director and patrol director there need to lose their jobs, and should never be able to work in those fields again, anywhere. They fucked up by opening that terrain to the public.

If you disagree, you're wrong, AND you're welcome to go fuck yourself.

But sure, go ahead and be corporate apologists, I would expect nothing less from the legions of herpetic sphincters around here.

Come to Jackson and I'll pour you a whole glass of "go fuck yourself" Douche.

[old goat]

Dogs and Recco don't come anywhere near what the beep will do. Strapping on is what savers you.

I know that you know that nothing is going to save someone buried that deep.

[garyfromterrace]

Yeah, i know the head troller and it’s gonna be rough for him.

Thoughts going out to him, the families and friends of those lost and to you 2FUNKY. Really, really shitty. Some miraculousnous too however with recoveries of non-beeping folks... man. Good reminder to beep inbounds and think about avi safety even if inbounds. Take care buddy.

[snoqpass]

How deep can the dogs find a victim--20 feet obviously too deep?

Not really, it would depend on the type of avalanche and how the debris sets up to allow scent to percolate to the surface but it still would be challenging to pin point them with a dog at that depth