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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,293
    FWIW I've got a rollover permit from last year that we bumped back due to Covid. USFS wanted me to confirm by Mar 15 so I'm not sure if drawings will be later this year?

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    under the van
    Posts
    222
    Quote Originally Posted by John_B View Post
    FWIW I've got a rollover permit from last year that we bumped back due to Covid. USFS wanted me to confirm by Mar 15 so I'm not sure if drawings will be later this year?
    Not sure why they would be delayed. Mid March is usual confirmation deadline. They held out all rollovers from covid for this years lottery. Chances even smaller than normal!

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    FEMA RGN X
    Posts
    936
    Quote Originally Posted by skivan View Post
    Chances even smaller than normal!
    No delay for the Smith just less permits available.

    "Float permit quotas will be limited between April 1st and May 4th to honor permittees affected by the COVID-19 river closure during this time period in 2020 (Drawing Quotas for Honored Days PDF). Additionally, applicants who drew a peak season permit in 2020 will be allowed to apply for a peak season permit in 2021."

    PSA - Smith lottery application remains open through Monday, February 15, 2021.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Quote Originally Posted by John_B View Post
    FWIW I've got a rollover permit from last year that we bumped back due to Covid. USFS wanted me to confirm by Mar 15 so I'm not sure if drawings will be later this year?
    When’s your launch? Pretty sure I’m available.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    134
    Quote Originally Posted by Conundrum View Post
    When’s your launch? Pretty sure I’m available.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Check yer mail. Unsuccessful across the board here. Have groover, will carry your poop.

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    15,855
    Hi Loser,

    Thank you for applying for the Middle Fork of the Salmon River Lottery 2021. The lottery drawing recently took place, and, unfortunately, your application wasn’t selected for a permit at Middle Fork Of The Salmon (4 Rivers)

    Although you weren’t initially successful, keep an eye out for other opportunities to secure a permit for this popular location.
    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Wasatch Back: 7000'
    Posts
    10,755
    I’m 0-2, hoping for a better result tomorrow
    ďA society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.Ē
    ― Milton Friedman

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    FEMA RGN X
    Posts
    936
    Skunked...again

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Welp, that didnít take long. Good buddy asked me if I want to go slay cuts 7/24.

  11. #61
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Wasatch Back: 7000'
    Posts
    10,755
    RANT!!!
    Click image for larger version. 

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    ďA society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.Ē
    ― Milton Friedman

  12. #62
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Alta Wydaho
    Posts
    252
    Shut out as well this year......our entire group Struck Out across the board. Nada.... Who the hell's getting them?

  13. #63
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW
    Posts
    6,002
    friend pulled a Middle Fork, June 28

    life ain't guaranteed, love your people while you can

  14. #64
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Ogden
    Posts
    723
    Hell yeah, BIL got a Hells so I'm in for something.
    now a complete tool

  15. #65
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Funland
    Posts
    1,424
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    friend pulled a Middle Fork, June 28
    DAMN that's a lucky draw. That is one of the busiest days for applications and only 2 slots available.

    Between our whole crew we had roughly 100 lottery application in. Rogue, Selway, Middle, Main, Yampa, Lodore, Deso, San Juan.
    Landed with 5/29 MF Salmon. Curious to see what the water levels will be. 4/20 San Juan, Sand Island to Clay Hills. I can't go. 8/14 Lodore was the big winner, IMO. 9/13 Rogue was a rolled permit from last year. Hopefully the fires will be more tame this year.

  16. #66
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    friend pulled a Middle Fork, June 28

    Thatís my favorite launch date cause that puts me day two for my b-day. I think Iíve had four Dolly Lake birthday parties.

    The water is usually a perfect level for fun without being scary and a decent amount of camp time for relaxing.

  17. #67
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Park City
    Posts
    3,852
    Fuck! 3 years in a row with no permits. Our rafting family put in roughly 70 tries. This is bullshit. Our public lands but outfitters get 90% of permits.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I rip the groomed on tele gear

  18. #68
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Funland
    Posts
    1,424

  19. #69
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Quote Originally Posted by detrusor View Post
    Fuck! 3 years in a row with no permits. Our rafting family put in roughly 70 tries. This is bullshit. Our public lands but outfitters get 90% of permits.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    This was my 20th year of applying for permits with other groups. I’ve drawn one. Wouldn’t be too upset at only three years.

  20. #70
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Movin' On
    Posts
    2,696
    Tried for Selway, Salmon and Hells Canyon with 10 others who put in for the lottery. No wins

  21. #71
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    OOTAH
    Posts
    2,853
    Shut out here too!
    I found this interesting, not sure how true it is, but it has the ring of truth
    (Cross-posted)
    So, I have been hearing a lot from boaters about their frustrations with the river permit lottery. There are discussions about weighted lotteries, cancellation penalties, post-success years ban, etc.
    But we are talking about these changes as though we are dealing with a land-management agency whose interest is in balancing user groups and impact, etc.
    THE LOTTERIES ARE NOT HANDLED BY LAND-MANAGEMENT AGENCIES.
    All western-river permit lotteries (besides GC) are run on algorithms written by the Rec.gov platform which is owned by the FOR-PROFIT CORPORATION BOOZ ALLEN HAMILTON.
    The only thing this national, multi-industry giant is interested in is that $6 or $15 application fee which they collect from every person who enters the lotteries (for rivers, climbs, campsites and hikes across the country), and which goes directly into their pockets whether we win or lose the lottery. From a capitalist perspective, all they want is MORE APPLICANTS. They will not make any changes which might inhibit more people from applying every year. It would be like a fast-food restaurant encouraging more people to eat healthy.
    The change needs to be in the group tasked by the federal government to manage permits, lotteries and reservations. As long as the system is privatized, for-profit, it will never be a group actually interested in the stewardship of rivers or the education of river-runners.
    Unfortunately, their current contract (which netted BAH $182 million to build the platform in 2018), does not expire until 2028. So for the next seven years, we are stuck with lottery fees which are set by the corporation itself (there is no regulation clause on that amount in the federal contract), and their marketing push to bring more and more people into the contest.
    If we want to make changes in the future, we need to direct our energies now to electing public officials who value river management policies which center on more than the net profit they can scrape out of it.
    Samuel L. Jackson as Jules Winnfield: Oh, I'm sorry. Did I break your concentration?

  22. #72
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sydney/Avon
    Posts
    550
    Also got shut out this coming year for the first time. Interesting if true teleee

  23. #73
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    6,646
    I agree with Telee that the system is certainly something other than, "lets try to figure out a system where all the allocated user days are assigned in a fair manor".

    I live in a community of boaters. Most of my friends have been applying for permits for 25+ years. It used to be that we'd be picking from our winning permits for Dino, Middle Fork, Yampa, Main, Westwater etc. Now we are lucky if we win anything (we got an October Ladore yeah!)

    But you can go on the Grand every year! The weighted lottery works. The other problem is just the number of application. Every office jockey with a raft sends out a chain email telling people to apply for a certain set of dates under the "I'll take you" promise. Old school permit parties are history.

    So how the permitted river are just like all other "available for sale" activity. The boat ramps are full of fresh out of the catalog chachis with 2 Watershed Mississippis, a super tight flat brim game, White Claws, a few Forerunners and Tundras and "they guy that knows what he's doing" who started last year but gets off on being the "expert" giving out Margarita lessons. You can spot him easy, he has the widest brim hat.

    So life goes on, you just take it back to basics. Just run the super cool day sections during the week. Try to keep your skills fresh so you pick up that highwater cancellation. Get a motor for Cat trips.

    Chet and Buffy think they are winning but they are really losing because they are still Chet and Buffy. Dirtbag boaters will always be dirtbag boaters whether they get to boat on permitted rivers or not.

  24. #74
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    9,192
    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post
    The boat ramps are full of fresh out of the catalog chachis with 2 Watershed Mississippis, a super tight flat brim game, White Claws, a few Forerunners and Tundras and "they guy that knows what he's doing" who started last year but gets off on being the "expert" giving out Margarita lessons. You can spot him easy, he has the widest brim hat.
    Easy there. I think most of the new people are going Ortlieb or Yeti bags. Pretty much anything with a "waterproof" zipper. The very functional and durable zip lock seal is too hard to figure out and the Watersheds are not neato enough colors for the gram.

  25. #75
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW
    Posts
    6,002
    Don't forget the big solar charging kit, rolled out on the cooler lid at every opportunity.
    life ain't guaranteed, love your people while you can

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