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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
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    Top o pahto
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    244
    Quote Originally Posted by apex dave View Post
    Doesn't it bother you that people who get themselves in trouble are so often people who are from somewhere else? They put our local SAR people at risk due to their own poor judgment. Is ignorance an excuse? Should Darwin prevail?
    This is beyond silly. Are you proposing that SAR respond only to call-outs for locals? Only for the well-prepared?

    No need to feel sorry for searchers. They volunteer to help those in need, no matter where the subject is from or how ill-prepared they are.

    It is frustrating when a subject makes their situation worse by making increasingly poor decisions. Dehydration, panic, and exhaustion tend to seriously impair judgment, even for folks who are mountain savvy.

    Searchers would always rather help than sit by and watch someone potentially suffer. The subject has probably already learned an important lesson by the time SAR is activated.

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Wasatch
    Posts
    5,815
    I am eternally grateful to BC SAR and learned a ton from my mistake. I have learned to be more prepared and have better gear with a plan. If I don’t know I don’t go.

    I plan to volunteer with my local SAR and hope I can help. I talked with my friend who is 12 yr SAR volunteer and he said he does it to help people whether they were stupid or not. I made a stupid choice and share my story in hopes others won’t make the same mistake.

    SAR rocks!!!!!!!


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I need to go to Utah.
    Utah?
    Yeah, Utah. It's wedged in between Wyoming and Nevada. You've seen pictures of it, right?

    So after 15 years we finally made it to Utah.....


    Thanks BCSAR and POWMOW Ski Patrol for rescues

    8, 17, 13, 18, 16, 18, 20, 19, 16

    2018/2019 (24/32)

  3. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    31
    Quote Originally Posted by whyturn View Post
    I put hands in trail mix bag to create vapor barrier. Put arms inside jacket under arm pits and also kept blood flowing in my legs with movement. Was really sore. Main challenge was staying awake but knew I couldn’t sleep or I would not wake up. Played mind games and blew my safety whistle a lot. It was a long night and still get cold was sometimes.
    Pretty smart given the circumstances...especially the trail mix bag. Gotta improvise sometimes. Glad to hear you made it out okay!

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10,704
    First rescue of the season, in your face BC!

    https://www.escaladequebec.com/deux-...-mt-lafayette/
    They got a name for the winners in the world

    http://procatinator.com/?cat=80

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by waxman View Post
    Stop making stupid people famous:
    Idiot. Plain and simple. Every single year there's at least one death from yahoos coming to the Rockies from Quebec (and sometimes Ontario) to get rad and the die because they can't or won't follow simple directions or signage.
    "heh, heh i move to the montagnes to get the sponcership and film ze movies''
    As mentioned in the article it's a great way to get rid of your wife if that's your thing.
    but people can learn from their mistakes...

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    5,549
    Quote Originally Posted by COformtn View Post
    ... people can learn ...
    ^^^ the flaw in your argument.

    see: the ever increasing number of selfie deaths

    Which leads us back to...


    Quote Originally Posted by waxman View Post
    Stop making stupid people famous:
    Idiot. Plain and simple.
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Grammy Jay
    Posts
    25
    Here's another: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...-sar-1.5413276

    Gets lost on the last run of the day Monday, doesn't attempt to turn around and follow his tracks back until 1AM on Tuesday

    Why not just turn around in the first 30 minutes you think you are lost

  8. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    2
    I got 2 friends who have spend a night each in Revelstoke woods

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,893
    Been testing this ghetto emergency shelter system. Been mulling over the basic concept for a while now and this thread was part of the inspiration to get ideas out of the head and onto the snow. Could save a life or at least provide a bit more comfort in a worst case scenario. The goal was/is to design a super lightweight, air/waterproof, compressible, packable overnight winter survival shelter and figure out a reliable, long lasting heating source so that no extra clothing layers are required for a (relatively) comfortably warm overnight experience.

    I speculate that something around 3lbs is a reasonable weight for a package that will always live in the backpack in case of an outlier event that may require an unplanned overnighter. I'm not there yet weight wise but somewhat in a reasonable starting point ballpark.....



    320 cm long, medium weight polyethylene. Rectangle section folded in half and taped at the seam.
    Total weight including tape = 320 grams on the kitchen scale.

    I employed stuff you'd usually have on hand for a day of ski touring to maintain the shelter's form factor and for closing off of either end with adjustable vents allowing for horizontal air flow.

    Tea light candles for heating...just used them for testing proof of concept...minus 18C outside with moderate to strong, gusty, northerly outflow winds buffeting the shelter...inside temp got to plus 12.4 degrees C with 15 candles burning. Need a better heat source though...they were somewhat unreliable....quite few flamed out randomly.

    This is all just super rough prototyping...have lots of level changes in materials, form, design, gram shaving, etc... yet to come...but...as is, it's good enough to always carry in my pack just in case.

    Testing was performed in the back yard with no solar effect. I didn't stay in the tube for longer than an hour at a time. Ran out of time for further refinements and overnight testing.


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    upper body/back lays on backpack, butt and lower legs get insulated by ski skins and short foam pad
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    door closure system with a small vent

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    temp of plus 1C outside, temp of plus 18.5C inside within a few minutes of ignition of 13 tea light candles. Used a small, light rechargeable fan to move the air around so heat was homogenous with no cold layers in the airspace.

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    after a few more minutes, temp got up to a steady 21 degrees....with two vent holes open and multiple tears in the walls.

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    Master of mediocrity.

  10. #35
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    9,300ft
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    18,400
    10 candles in a plastic bag and I'm worried about CO even with vent holes.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    YetiMan
    Posts
    11,563
    Quote Originally Posted by snowaddict91 View Post
    Many of those people are missing work to be out there
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  12. #37
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,893
    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    10 candles in a plastic bag and I'm worried about CO even with vent holes.
    future version of existing setup for testing: full mitigation of any emmissions issues via breathing tube through the 'door' hole to outside air/face mask combo. Win/win/dual purpose 'cause i also wanna eliminate the introduction of humidity into the airspace from breathing.
    Master of mediocrity.

  13. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    base of the Bush
    Posts
    12,453
    "Falls asleep among the candles and set himself on fire"

    How about one or two Candle Lanterns

    Or



    Thanks for thinking about safety
    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  14. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    YetiMan
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    11,563
    Quote Originally Posted by waxman View Post
    Stop making stupid people famous:
    Idiot. Plain and simple. Every single year there's at least one death from yahoos coming to the Rockies from Quebec (and sometimes Ontario) to get rad and the die because they can't or won't follow simple directions or signage.
    "heh, heh i move to the montagnes to get the sponcership and film ze movies''
    As mentioned in the article it's a great way to get rid of your wife if that's your thing.
    Our stoopid midwest ski area calls any ungroomed area “backcountry”, cut runs inbounds at a ski area they call “backcountry”, so there’s a whole lot of people here who are learning that word has no association with danger or being prepared in any way. There are alarming cliff and danger type signs all over mild terrain. Someday one of these people from here will get himself killed out west because these idiots at our local hill taught them the “backcountry” and “cliff area”s are not anything to worry about.
    I’ve been harping on this for awhile, nobody cares...they think I’m a crazy person.

  15. #40
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,893
    Quote Originally Posted by Vt-Freeheel View Post
    "Falls asleep among the candles and set himself on fire"

    How about one or two Candle Lanterns

    Or



    Thanks for thinking about safety
    not really interested in open flame heat source for final/future versions. candles and camp stove were just for concept testing....i'm working on alternatives.
    Master of mediocrity.

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    59715
    Posts
    2,111
    Pack a couple of road flares. If you need to get warm, build a fire. If you need to build a fire, you don't want to fuck around.

  17. #42
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    base of the Bush
    Posts
    12,453
    Quote Originally Posted by swissiphic View Post
    not really interested in open flame heat source for final/future versions. candles and camp stove were just for concept testing....i'm working on alternatives.
    Gonna be interested in what you find that doesn't weigh 5+lbs. Could use this and eat toast and or cat in the morning.


    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  18. #43
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,893
    A more in depth description of the project and the testing on a new thread over at Tech Talk:

    https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...helter-concept

    I'll maintain running updates as progress is made.
    Master of mediocrity.

  19. #44
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    9,300ft
    Posts
    18,400
    Quote Originally Posted by swissiphic View Post
    future version of existing setup for testing: full mitigation of any emmissions issues via breathing tube through the 'door' hole to outside air/face mask combo. Win/win/dual purpose 'cause i also wanna eliminate the introduction of humidity into the airspace from breathing.
    Rebreathing warm humid air is good if you are trying to stay warm... minus the CO
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  20. #45
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10,704
    Quote Originally Posted by Vt-Freeheel View Post
    Gonna be interested in what you find that doesn't weigh 5+lbs. Could use this and eat toast and or cat in the morning.


    Remember in that WFA class the one garbage bag and candle trick? warmed right up!
    They got a name for the winners in the world

    http://procatinator.com/?cat=80

  21. #46
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    CO/UT
    Posts
    2,186
    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    Our stoopid midwest ski area calls any ungroomed area “backcountry”, cut runs inbounds at a ski area they call “backcountry”, so there’s a whole lot of people here who are learning that word has no association with danger or being prepared in any way. There are alarming cliff and danger type signs all over mild terrain. Someday one of these people from here will get himself killed out west because these idiots at our local hill taught them the “backcountry” and “cliff area”s are not anything to worry about.
    I’ve been harping on this for awhile, nobody cares...they think I’m a crazy person.
    Are you telling me a triple black at Bohemia and a triple black at Big Sky aren't the same thing?

    The new trend I've spotted this year is people giving up and taking their skis off to walk down the hill. I may or may not have started telling people "this isn't fucking disneyland."

  22. #47
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,893
    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    Rebreathing warm humid air is good if you are trying to stay warm... minus the CO
    Might depend on if yer a Wim Hof'er or not. For those who aren't, nothing stopping safe routing of the breathing tube in a spiral over the heating source to warm the air being exchanged. Who knows, lots to figure out here what 'best practices' are.
    Master of mediocrity.

  23. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    21,038
    I did a bunch of runs at the local hill with the RCMP who did the recovery of the Quebec woman that perished in the KH BC, he told me all the whys/the wherefores, the what went wrong. He sez none of the press got it right but Outside mag got it less wrong then all the rest of them. I asked a whole bunch of questions and he had a whole bunch of answers on how it went sideways BUT it sounds like if that couple had stayed put instead of continaly moving every day they would have been found

    Buddy law was skiing in civilian clothes so its a good thing I didnt pull out a reefer on the chair ride before I found out he was a cop


    Quote Originally Posted by Vt-Freeheel View Post
    Gonna be interested in what you find that doesn't weigh 5+lbs.
    Bivy sack only weighs 750 grams

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    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  24. #49
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    Sep 2014
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    1,893
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    Bivy sack only weighs 750 grams
    Bivi sacks certainly have their place...but i'm thinkin' for 750 grams a guy could prolly use the poly to fabricate a full double wall, baffled construction, inflatable airspace between the two walls so structure is fully, rigidly self erected and supported and would shed any rain, snow or sleet...and...have a built in inflated, comfy sleeping pad zone for 750 grams... With that kind of R value, prolly only have to bring 6 tea candles to get interior temps up to the comfy zone and keep it idling there with less heat loss than single wall construction. Dunno, just...me thinx.
    Master of mediocrity.

  25. #50
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    truckee
    Posts
    14,088
    The problem for most people whether they're from the flatlands or the mountains is knowing what you don't know. I'd be surprised if there's anyone posting in this thread who has not done something stupid in the mountains. And if you think you haven't you just did and didn't realize it.

    Lots of ignorant people have gotten themselves killed in the mountains. So have some of the greatest skiers and mountaineers in the world. I'm sure more of the latter than the former if only because of amount of exposure, both time wise and risk wise. (You can't fall 100 feet if you can't climb 100 feet.) If they're from the valley we say they were stupid; if they're sports heroes we say they died doing what they loved. But dead is dead.

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