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  1. #2701
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    Dec 2007
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    base of the Bush
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    Thank You
    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  2. #2702
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    Jul 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by brutah View Post
    Here is a screenshot of a presentation on the gondola that was shared with me about parking capacity. Wish I was able to share the full pdf with you all, though there's not much extra in there....

    Attachment 333877
    Do not believe that the number of skiers in the canyon will be limited by simply not loading at the base. Currently there is a de facto limit when no more parking is available. On days when they stop cars imo Alta has reached its capacity, lift lines are atrocious and blue groomers are downright dangerous. I seriously doubt Alta or SB is going to pick up the phone and tell them to stop sending up any more paying customers. I believe the ski resorts see this as a way to increase the number of skiers and increase their revenue at no cost. As my Uncle used to say, "son, its about money, its always about money".

  3. #2703
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    Aug 2019
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    136
    I think bigdude makes a very good point. There is a natural limit of skiers at which point the experience completely degrades and becomes unsafe.

    Figuring out that limit ought to be happening in conjunction with ideas of easing the canyon traffic.

    As bigdude alludes to, it can already be a shitshow on really busy days. Imagine if double the people are now up there without the natural limit of parking somewhat controlling things.

  4. #2704
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    Mar 2006
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    yea there is no way the resorts would tell the gondola people to stop loading people.

    any further group consensus on whether this gondola plus option would require a revision of the EIS, or is the part that is "different" than the udot approved gondola out of the canyon, and thus not necessary to do a review on? I kind of get the feeling that the entire thought about a different gondola alignment is completely moot as the comment period ends in 2 days and it was just made public like a week ago.

  5. #2705
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtran10 View Post
    yea there is no way the resorts would tell the gondola people to stop loading people.
    I also love the "If a slide closes the road we can still get people out of the canyon" argument. I mean, it's technically correct and sounds nice, but by UDOT's own estimation 2/3's of people will continue to access the resorts via private vehicles. Those people are all stuck up there until the road opens. It's not realistic to expect all those people to abandon their cars, leave them parked overnight (illegally) and retrieve them the following day.

    Quote Originally Posted by jtran10 View Post
    any further group consensus on whether this gondola plus option would require a revision of the EIS, or is the part that is "different" than the udot approved gondola out of the canyon, and thus not necessary to do a review on? I kind of get the feeling that the entire thought about a different gondola alignment is completely moot as the comment period ends in 2 days and it was just made public like a week ago.
    I deal with NEPA professionally some. It's not my main gig, I know enough to be dangerous. That said, I'm pretty sure that at a minimum they'd have to run this option through their screening criteria, revise the full EIS and all the fact sheets accordingly, and then have another full public comment period. That could easily take six months, and assumes this option passes the screening criteria. The La Caille base station is likely to fail their screening criteria for the same reasons that the Tree Farm and 3662 North Little Cottonwood Canyon Rd locations failed (https://littlecottonwoodeis.udot.uta...hub_fin_web-4/)
    Last edited by Dantheman; 07-08-2020 at 02:42 PM.

  6. #2706
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    I also love the "If a slide closes the road we can still get people out of the canyon" argument. I mean, it's technically correct and sounds nice, but by UDOT's own estimation 2/3's of people will continue to access the resorts via private vehicles. Those people are all stuck up there until the road opens. It's not realistic to expect all those people to abandon their cars, leave them parked overnight (illegally) and retrieve them the following day.



    I deal with NEPA professionally some. It's not my main gig, I know enough to be dangerous. That said, I'm pretty sure that at a minimum they'd have to run this option through their screening criteria, revise the full EIS and all the fact sheets accordingly, and then have another full public comment period. That could easily take six months, and assumes this option passes the screening criteria. The La Caille base station is likely to fail their screening criteria for the same reasons that the Tree Farm and 3662 North Little Cottonwood Canyon Rd locations failed (https://littlecottonwoodeis.udot.uta...hub_fin_web-4/)
    thanks. kind of figured that they can't just throw out a hail mary randomly and get it passed but wasn't positive.

    EDIT: what also rubs me the wrong way is that snowbird posted their support for the la caille plan on their social media. I get that the solutions we're talking about are 90% about getting resort skiers to 2 ski ares to spend $$$, but it still seems so snowbird-y of them to comment in such a way.

  7. #2707
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    Has there been a conceptual design released which shows how many lift towers there are and where they are located? In the event of an issue how long could / would it take to get maintenance to resolve an issue? Ski resorts typically have pretty easy access to towers but in LCC depending on where they are located that could be a problem?

  8. #2708
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    Aug 2014
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    the LCC
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    Well, today I e-mailed UDOT with my support for Gondolawworks... providing they can move the #s they profess. And with the new Doppelmayr system, maybe.
    It is not one lift; like the Collins chair it's a new lift at the angle stations.
    And with its twin track cables, wind is not much of an issue.
    Other plus is parking at the base terminal.
    Recommended that a snow shed under White Pine Chutes 1&2 follow asap with more to follow.
    Also supported a future gondola from the wasatch back.
    Even if a new EIS etc. is needed and this idea is delayed it is still the best way forward.
    Funny thing, as a freshman at the U (1976), I wrote a paper about a gondola up LCC.
    Well before there was any development in the golden triangle.
    Might happen in my lifetime?
    Time spent skiing cannot be deducted from one's life.

  9. #2709
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    Dec 2007
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    In the shadow of the wasatch
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    Didnt daddy Trump do away with the need for EIS while we were distracted with teh covids?

    E2A-Kinda. If this could be called critical infrastructure

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...ear-the-brunt/
    Bunny Don't Surf

    Have you seen a one armed man around here?

  10. #2710
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    Quote Originally Posted by telefreewasatch View Post
    Recommended that a snow shed under White Pine Chutes 1&2 follow asap with more to follow.
    Gondolaworks and UDOT gondola proposals both omit snowsheds. For the foreseeable future it's either/or, pick your poison.

    Quote Originally Posted by happytimefunbox View Post
    Didnt daddy Trump do away with the need for EIS while we were distracted with teh covids?

    E2A-Kinda. If this could be called critical infrastructure

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...ear-the-brunt/
    That shouldn't effect UDOT's transit hub screening criteria, which is the crux for the La Caille base station.

  11. #2711
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    Gondolaworks and UDOT gondola proposals both omit snowsheds. For the foreseeable future it's either/or, pick your poison.
    Understood.
    For me, ganjala first.
    Just want them to shorten a foreseeable future with snowsheds.
    Both are needed for the long term...
    Time spent skiing cannot be deducted from one's life.

  12. #2712
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    Sep 2005
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    Wasatch Back: 7000'
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtran10 View Post
    thanks. kind of figured that they can't just throw out a hail mary randomly and get it passed but wasn't positive.

    EDIT: what also rubs me the wrong way is that snowbird posted their support for the la caille plan on their social media. I get that the solutions we're talking about are 90% about getting resort skiers to 2 ski ares to spend $$$, but it still seems so snowbird-y of them to comment in such a way.
    Snowbird-y in a Cumming sort of way. POWDR is proving to be much worse than DICK B.
    “How does it feel to be the greatest guitarist in the world? I don’t know, go ask Rory Gallagher”. — Jimi Hendrix

  13. #2713
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtran10 View Post
    thanks. kind of figured that they can't just throw out a hail mary randomly and get it passed but wasn't positive.

    EDIT: what also rubs me the wrong way is that snowbird posted their support for the la caille plan on their social media. I get that the solutions we're talking about are 90% about getting resort skiers to 2 ski ares to spend $$$, but it still seems so snowbird-y of them to comment in such a way.
    Considering how things went down with the PCMR Talisker lease fiasco, this seems perfectly on-brand for POWDR.

  14. #2714
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    Alta
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    WASATCH STOKE, CONDITIONS, OBSERVATIONS and ASSORTED DRIVAL 19-20

    I’ve said this here many times. The gondola is about two means of egress to and from the canyon and snowbird hosting men’s and women’s slalom if Utah gets the Olympics. With the politicians being involved and Covid probably decreasing other cities bids for future Olympics. I’d say the gondola stands a pretty good chance. Just a couple handshakes in the ward parking lot and done deal. I can bike to the base from my house so win for me. Summer time shuttles on the bike. Less wear and tear car getting to work. I also voted for the la Caille station

  15. #2715
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    May 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by altacoup View Post
    I’ve said this here many times. The gondola is about two means of egress to and from the canyon and snowbird hosting men’s and women’s slalom if Utah gets the Olympics. With the politicians being involved and Covid probably decreasing other cities bids for future Olympics. I’d say the gondola stands a pretty good chance. Just a couple handshakes in the ward parking lot and done deal. I can bike to the base from my house so win for me. Summer time shuttles on the bike. Less wear and tear car getting to work. I also voted for the la Caille station
    Olympics plays a huge part I believe as well. The Covid thing is an interesting observation I hadn't considered, and I again agree likely pushes the gondola closer to the "short term" solution.

    If I was still in the Wasatch I'd vote gondola.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using TGR Forums mobile app

  16. #2716
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    Nov 2010
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    Montrose, CO
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    Quote Originally Posted by altacoup View Post
    Summer time shuttles on the bike.
    I've thought about that too.

    I'm a big fan of the la caille base if the numbers are true, even though it is a little out of the way for me coming up from Sandy.

    All this being said, I need to do a better job taking the bus as the first stop is half a mile from my house. I just hate taking the bus down from Snowbird at the end of the day and standing holding my skis the whole fucking way.

  17. #2717
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    Jan 2009
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    I had never even thought of the Olympics angle... Between that as a driving force and the excitement of the legislature at the thought of saving $$ (and making some themselves though various backroom deals) through a public/private partnership it's sounding less and less unrealistic. These fuckers couldn't be convinced to increase educational budgets by $10/child or do anything to address the abysmal air quality of the area but if you dangle a jacket with the Olympic rings in front of their face it's practically a done deal.

  18. #2718
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    Aug 2014
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    the LCC
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    Side note on the two developers in Gondolaworks, McCandless and Neiderhauser:
    They may be a couple of republican LDS politicians, but I ski toured with them a few times and they were able, savvy, and fun to be with; they enjoy these mountains as much as any of us...
    Time spent skiing cannot be deducted from one's life.

  19. #2719
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    Quote Originally Posted by telefreewasatch View Post
    Side note on the two developers in Gondolaworks, McCandless and Neiderhauser:
    They may be a couple of republican LDS politicians, but I ski toured with them a few times and they were able, savvy, and fun to be with; they enjoy these mountains as much as any of us...
    Maybe they'll consider a stop at White Pine then...
    An altruistic republican LDS developer is such an amusing concept. Shit, an altruistic developer with no other qualifier is an amusing concept. I'm sure these 2 are in it for the environment and the betterment of everyone's experience in LCC, not because they get a chance to make absolute bank from a solution that doesn't appear to be superior in any shape of form to any of the proposed alternatives.
    Yes, I'm cynical. But that doesn't make the above any less true.

  20. #2720
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    Sep 2005
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    Wasatch Back: 7000'
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    If they don't take their he is up to The Bird, they will continue to valet park at the base of the tram
    “How does it feel to be the greatest guitarist in the world? I don’t know, go ask Rory Gallagher”. — Jimi Hendrix

  21. #2721
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    Dec 2008
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    Driggs
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    I patrolled with McCandless at PC, Great guy, but I wouldn't trust him with a square inch of LCC.
    Last edited by new yabyum; 07-08-2020 at 06:45 PM. Reason: spelling

  22. #2722
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Maybe they'll consider a stop at White Pine then...
    Glide path down canyon to White Pine from Snowbird? Then bribe the operators at Tanners or Wasatch Station to get back on.

    How about access via those angle stations, wtf?

  23. #2723
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Maybe they'll consider a stop at White Pine then...
    An altruistic republican LDS developer is such an amusing concept. Shit, an altruistic developer with no other qualifier is an amusing concept. I'm sure these 2 are in it for the environment and the betterment of everyone's experience in LCC, not because they get a chance to make absolute bank from a solution that doesn't appear to be superior in any shape of form to any of the proposed alternatives.
    Yes, I'm cynical. But that doesn't make the above any less true.
    My cynicism is tempered by the knowledge that the Olympics are renowned for their impeccable integrity and total intolerance for corruption and graft.

    Quote Originally Posted by JKnight View Post
    How about access via those angle stations, wtf?
    This is being done for the benefit of Alta and Snowbird, not freeloading BC bums.

  24. #2724
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    Nov 2011
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    SLC
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    Well, what about canyon employees that live in the Wasatch Resort? Seems there would be exceptions.

  25. #2725
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    the LCC
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKnight View Post
    Well, what about canyon employees that live in the Wasatch Resort? Seems there would be exceptions.
    Owned a place there 10 years now, kids been occupying.
    Planned on it for retirement.
    Didn't figure on the exponential popularity of the LCC the last decade.
    Promoting the gondolaworks venture to sell it for tower 2!
    Gonna retire in NYC; its a ghost town compared to here...
    Time spent skiing cannot be deducted from one's life.

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