Page 8 of 8 FirstFirst ... 3 4 5 6 7 8
Results 176 to 200 of 200
  1. #176
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    4,329
    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    Smart people:
    Who needs who more: China or the US? In other words, if the entire trade relationship is severed who sufferers more? Or is it even?
    Quote Originally Posted by Viva View Post
    The U.S. needs / wants stuff. How much of that is critical, I do not know. China needs capital via the sales of it products. This is critical for their global ambitions.
    Who's better equipped and able to deal with isolation?
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  2. #177
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768
    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    Who's better equipped and able to deal with isolation?
    I think this is a bit like asking if Russia and the US got into a nuclear conflict during the Cold War, who would win. There would be no “winners” and the world economy would tank too.

    One question to ask is how much would it hurt the NBA if they stopped doing business in China until China respected our free speech laws.

  3. #178
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    4,329
    Quote Originally Posted by hercule33 View Post
    I think this is a bit like asking if Russia and the US got into a nuclear conflict during the Cold War, who would win. There would be no “winners” and the world economy would tank too.

    One question to ask is how much would it hurt the NBA if they stopped doing business in China until China respected our free speech laws.
    Depends.. How much Chinese capital from Nike and other sponsors supports the NBA here that could be at risk in this kind of stand off?
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  4. #179
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    写道
    Posts
    11,134
    Quote Originally Posted by hercule33 View Post
    I think this is a bit like asking if Russia and the US got into a nuclear conflict during the Cold War, who would win.
    I don't think that that's a good analogy- you're proposing a situation in which both antagonists possess similar weapons and have somewhat similar ambitions. The Cold War, to me at least, was a bit of a stand-off. Politically, this event was kinda like a form of mutualism, in that both sides benefited for over thirty (30) years, until the Soviets eventually became bankrupt and irrelevant (This could be us).

    But here, one side seems to want to buy, buy. buy, while the other requires $$$ from "buy, buy, buy" to help support its increasing economic power. I see this as a far more complex relationship than what went on during Cold War, at least up to this point. Biologically speaking, I would consider what's happening now as a form of parasitism, in that China is taking far more value than what we receive.
    ¡Órale, vato!

  5. #180
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    General Sherman's Favorite City
    Posts
    18,373
    Quote Originally Posted by Viva View Post
    China is taking far more value than what we receive.
    See: currency manipulation
    I still call it The Jake.

  6. #181
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    11,668
    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    See: currency manipulation
    That is actually not true.

    China, in my opinion, is grasping for straws. Trying to flex while it still thinks it has muscles, not whether it actually does.

    This is a perfect time to back HK. I've done years of research following PRC, and I've never seen them so desperate, or so successful. I smell rotten fish.

  7. #182
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768

    China Bans South Park

    Quote Originally Posted by Viva View Post
    I don't think that that's a good analogy- you're proposing a situation in which both antagonists possess similar weapons and have somewhat similar ambitions. The Cold War, to me at least, was a bit of a stand-off. Politically, this event was kinda like a form of mutualism, in that both sides benefited for over thirty (30) years, until the Soviets eventually became bankrupt and irrelevant (This could be us).

    But here, one side seems to want to buy, buy. buy, while the other requires $$$ from "buy, buy, buy" to help support its increasing economic power. I see this as a far more complex relationship than what went on during Cold War, at least up to this point. Biologically speaking, I would consider what's happening now as a form of parasitism, in that China is taking far more value than what we receive.
    Sometimes it helps to look at things from a macro point of view. The US is the biggest economy in the world and China is the second biggest. Together they make up almost 40% of the global economy. Stopping trade between the two countries would not only tank the US and Chinese economies, it would tank the world economy. From a high level those are pretty similar consequences as a nuclear war between Russia and the US. Both countries would lose as well as the rest of the world.

    If you want to simplify the China analogy, then you can think of China as being focused more on the long term (strategic) while the US is more focused on the near term (tactical). China is not as much leeching off us as they are willing to play the long game. Part of that comes from them not being a democracy and their leaders not worrying about re-election.

  8. #183
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768
    Quote Originally Posted by MakersTeleMark View Post
    That is actually not true.

    China, in my opinion, is grasping for straws. Trying to flex while it still thinks it has muscles, not whether it actually does.

    This is a perfect time to back HK. I've done years of research following PRC, and I've never seen them so desperate, or so successful. I smell rotten fish.
    I don’t see your point with the NBA. China does have muscle. They have an audience of 1.4 billion and basketball is popular in their country. If you are the NBA, that’s huge. Much bigger than the 330 million living in the US. If you are en executive for the NBA you are going to have a tough time explaining to shareholders why one tweet supporting HK is worth blowing access to a potential audience of 1.4 billion. Sorry, but that is the messed up world that we are living in.

  9. #184
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    11,668
    Quote Originally Posted by hercule33 View Post
    I don’t see your point with the NBA. China does have muscle. They have an audience of 1.4 billion and basketball is popular in their country. If you are the NBA, that’s huge. Much bigger than the 330 million living in the US. If you are en executive for the NBA you are going to have a tough time explaining to shareholders why one tweet supporting HK is worth blowing access to a potential audience of 1.4 billion. Sorry, but that is the messed up world that we are living in.
    I don't know or care about the NBA. I do know that the market share for that company is over a billion in China. Other than that, those three letters mean nothing to me, just like china's reported gdp.

  10. #185
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    YetiMan
    Posts
    10,775
    Quote Originally Posted by hercule33 View Post
    If you want to simplify the China analogy, then you can think of China as being focused more on the long term (strategic) while the US is more focused on the near term (tactical).
    Hmm, strategies and tactics eh?

  11. #186
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768
    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    Hmm, strategies and tactics eh?
    Take Google for instance. When they pulled out of China, it was largely viewed as a tactical move. China was “supposed” to become more democratic and when it did Google could come back and claim that it stood for human rights. Well it turns out that China had a different strategy and did not become more democratic over the years. This made it very awkward for Google to justify its efforts to try to come back to China. I can’t imagine the NBA execs did not look at Google when thinking about leaving or upsetting China. The financial consequences could last decades.

  12. #187
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    General Sherman's Favorite City
    Posts
    18,373
    Lol,

    South Park takes aim at LeeeBron in latest episode:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nts-China.html
    I still call it The Jake.

  13. #188
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    4,329
    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    Lol,

    South Park takes aim at LeeeBron in latest episode:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nts-China.html
    It's really cool how quickly they can crank out an episode based on stuff so recent. Hilarious!
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  14. #189
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768

    China Bans South Park

    When I think of the LeBron comments, I think of this South Park video.

    https://youtu.be/FqJwD35wWhY

    I say this with no disrespect to NBA players but their primary job is to play basketball not to defend the NBAs business decisions that resulted in a multinational crisis that raised serious questions about free speech. That’s Adam Silver’s job. After it took him multiple days to produce an acceptable response, he retreated and wanted the players to talk to the press.

    They initially said no because they can recognize “operation human shield” when they see it. Then James Hardy apologized for Morey’s tweet. Why is a player apologizing, not the head of the NBA? Where is Silver, oh still in hiding. Then LeBron made his stupid comment. I am not defending his comment but again why is a player talking about this. Oh yeah, Silver is in hiding.

    And now after the black players get all the flack, Silver comes out of hiding and says he is for American values. Here is a hint, if it takes you a week to say that you are for American values then you are not for American values. Your cowardly ass encouraged your employees to appease China and say shit like “We love China” and apologize for Morey’s tweet so that you could come out as some “hero” a week later and say the NBA stands for American values. No, you just stand for operation human shield.

  15. #190
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SF & the Ho
    Posts
    5,632
    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    It's really cool how quickly they can crank out an episode based on stuff so recent. Hilarious!
    Really Amazing considering how long it took them to generate new episodes when they were first starting out

  16. #191
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    base of the Bush
    Posts
    10,967
    Daniel Plainview pushing the Goo was fucking funny.
    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  17. #192
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    General Sherman's Favorite City
    Posts
    18,373
    Hey! Adam Silver came out of his coffin and said stuff hoping no one remembered what he said before!

    And he managed to throw another log on the fire while doing it: “Obviously, we made clear that we were being asked to fire him by the Chinese government, by the parties we dealt with, government and business,” Silver said. “We said, ‘There’s no chance that’s happening. There’s no chance we’ll even discipline him.”

    And true to form, the communists said, "nuh-uh, we didn't make that demand".

    Sure China, we believe you.

    Things are not looking good for Space Jam 2's 2020 release in China right now.

    https://apnews.com/f721ead046f742dba80b7b5a9cff0876
    I still call it The Jake.

  18. #193
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    PRB
    Posts
    21,330
    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    Hey! Adam Silver came out of his coffin and said stuff hoping no one remembered what he said before!

    And he managed to throw another log on the fire while doing it: “Obviously, we made clear that we were being asked to fire him by the Chinese government, by the parties we dealt with, government and business,” Silver said. “We said, ‘There’s no chance that’s happening. There’s no chance we’ll even discipline him.”

    And true to form, the communists said, "nuh-uh, we didn't make that demand".

    Sure China, we believe you.

    Things are not looking good for Space Jam 2's 2020 release in China right now.

    https://apnews.com/f721ead046f742dba80b7b5a9cff0876
    has this been posted yet?

    Name:  v9ngkcwzi5t31.jpg
Views: 75
Size:  50.4 KB
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  19. #194
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    General Sherman's Favorite City
    Posts
    18,373
    Lol, no I don't think so. But given the past few pages I think you may get called a racist for posting that.

    Not sure why, just want you to be prepared.
    I still call it The Jake.

  20. #195
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768

    China Bans South Park

    Quote Originally Posted by BmillsSkier View Post
    Lol, no I don't think so. But given the past few pages I think you may get called a racist for posting that.

    Not sure why, just want you to be prepared.
    First let me commend you BmilssSkier for your post on Adam Silver. We need more like posts like that.

    Let me just clarify, I am not calling people racist. I am pointing out a form of racism. Posting a picture of LeBron in a communist uniform is not racist if you don’t like what he said. What is a form of racism is that on this thread and in general US culture the public is putting the majority of the blame for this China mess on a black employee of the NBA hired for his basketball skills more than the head of the NBA who was hired to address issues like this.

    Let me give you some examples.

    1. In this thread there are now two pictures of LeBron in a communist uniform. For some reason, there are none of Adam Silver, the leader responsible for the NBA’s response to China’s, including that of his employees like LeBron and Morey. To this day, I have seen Silver say tougher things about Morey’s tweet than LeBron’s statements. That’s “regrettable.”

    2. LeBron over the last few days has been lambasted in detail over how much money he makes from China. I have yet to find detailed articles how much the NBA lost from China and possibly will lose from China. And no one is talking about how much money Adam Silver will personally lose because China decided to retaliate.

    3. I am not saying that Silver was never criticized but there is a disproportionate amount of empathy extended to Silver versus LeBron. One of many examples is this article.

    https://www.si.com/nba/2019/10/09/ad...ong-kong-tweet

    The first line is literally “Adam Silver is in a tough spot” and describes the leagues initial report as “awkward at best.” WTF. Show me one article about LeBron that starts with “LeBron is in a tough spot” and describes his comments as “awkward at best.” Show me an article that goes on to say the obvious that LeBron was hired to play basketball but now has the impossible job to make comments to the press that won’t offend China or the US because his white boss whose job is to talk to the press about this is in hiding. But wait, I forgot that poor Adam Silver is in a tough spot.
    Last edited by hercule33; Today at 02:42 PM.

  21. #196
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    YetiMan
    Posts
    10,775
    People feel like they’re roasting Lebron because they sense hypocrisy and self righteousness, which is true—that’s there—they’re accurately sensing that, but they’re extra sensitive to the self righteous hypocrisy of a guy they feel should be intellectually below them (black nba player) and thus not allowed a public soapbox to speak on sociopolitical issues ever in the first place...that festering .latent resentment of the soapbox he’s been given makes seeing him fuck it up by putting his foot in his mouth exciting validation for that instinctive latent resentment many people feel. It’s not all about race, but there’s a racial and social component embedded in that point of view.

  22. #197
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    PRB
    Posts
    21,330
    Quote Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy View Post
    People feel like they’re roasting Lebron because they sense hypocrisy and self righteousness, which is true—that’s there—they’re accurately sensing that, but they’re extra sensitive to the self righteous hypocrisy of a guy they feel should be intellectually below them (black nba player) and thus not allowed a public soapbox to speak on sociopolitical issues ever in the first place...that festering .latent resentment of the soapbox he’s been given makes seeing him fuck it up by putting his foot in his mouth exciting validation for that instinctive latent resentment many people feel. It’s not all about race, but there’s a racial and social component embedded in that point of view.
    maybe for some people, but that's a mighty broad brush. I for one LOVE when he (or other athletes) of any color speak out on issues of racial or economic injustice or politics. We can judge whether they're informed or not, and how much value to place on their opinions, but there's no resentment here, or feeling that he is intellectually below me, just a sense of "YES!" I don't think I'm unique on this.

    So yeah, when someone who is speaking out on those issues, and is trying to get us to see the systemic human rights issues in our country, plays a much different tune when his economic interests are threatened, and the human rights problems are not in this country, that's problematic for me. And I don't think I am racist for saying that. Dude is rightfully getting roasted, IMO, even if what you say IS accurate for many people.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  23. #198
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768

    China Bans South Park

    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    maybe for some people, but that's a mighty broad brush. I for one LOVE when he (or other athletes) of any color speak out on issues of racial or economic injustice or politics. We can judge whether they're informed or not, and how much value to place on their opinions, but there's no resentment here, or feeling that he is intellectually below me, just a sense of "YES!" I don't think I'm unique on this.

    So yeah, when someone who is speaking out on those issues, and is trying to get us to see the systemic human rights issues in our country, plays a much different tune when his economic interests are threatened, and the human rights problems are not in this country, that's problematic for me. And I don't think I am racist for saying that. Dude is rightfully getting roasted, IMO, even if what you say IS accurate for many people.
    Dude is rightfully being roasted for being self-righteous. That's not the problem. The roasting is not 100% racial, that's not the problem. The problem is that the self-righteous NBA and it's leader Adam Silver are not being roasted. Unlike the NFL, the NBA said that they would allow free speech for its players. What they didn't say is that they had free speech, unless it hurt their bottom line. When the NFL kneeling protests were happening and they hurt the NFL's profits (or some people believe they did), the NBA and Silver said it was on the side of free speech. They defended LeBron attacking the president because it didn't hurt their bottom line as the current president is neither popular with their US or Chinese audience. The NBA is different. That was their self-righteous line.

    Then this whole China thing happens that really hurts their bottom line. The pro-democracy tweet that caused the uproar gets promptly deleted. The person who tweeted it goes into hiding and does not speak to the press or clarify his position on HK. The head of the NBA initially kowtows to China so badly that he is forced to come out of hiding and clarify his statements. Then he goes back into hiding leaving the NBA players to talk to press. No standing up for free speech and democracy. Not one NBA employee has publicly showed support for HK, most are silent or saying stuff like "We love China." That's a direct result of Silver's leadership and his "support" for free speech.

    Don't tell me that if LeBron came out in support of HK in that press conference in China, the NBA and Silver would be like "We support his free speech." Give me a break. Yeah he said something stupid, but the Silver didn't condemn his quote as "regrettable." Being pro-democracy was "regrettable."

    Pick on LeBron. He's a big boy and deserves criticism for his tone-deaf comments that echo the NBA company line and make him look self-righteous and hypocritical. But don't forget to pick on the white guy whose job isn't to play basketball but to deal with shit like this. He's been far more pro-China and hypocritical than LeBron but somehow received much less criticism. Now if only one other NBA employee would echo Silver's statements about American values like freedom of speech and taking them when they travel. Somehow they are all silent. I wonder if it's the NBA telling them not to say stuff to the press because it may upset China or it's that secretly they are communists who don't believe in American freedoms.
    Last edited by hercule33; Today at 06:57 PM.

  24. #199
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    4,329
    Quote Originally Posted by hercule33 View Post
    Dude is rightfully being roasted for being self-righteous. That's not the problem. The roasting is not 100% racial, that's not the problem. The problem is that the self-righteous NBA and it's leader Adam Silver are not being roasted. Unlike the NFL, the NBA said that they would allow free speech for its players. What they didn't say is that they had free speech, unless it hurt their bottom line. When the NFL kneeling protests were happening and they hurt the NFL's profits (or some people believe they did), the NBA and Silver said it was on the side of free speech. They defended LeBron attacking the president because it didn't hurt their bottom line as the current president is neither popular with their US or Chinese audience. The NBA is different. That was their self-righteous line.
    So, ya maybe the whataboutism bringing Silver in to the conversation might be warranted.. maybe..

    Do we have a similar yabutwhattabout for not being critical of this guy?
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  25. #200
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    768
    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    So, ya maybe the whataboutism bringing Silver in to the conversation might be warranted.. maybe..

    Do we have a similar yabutwhattabout for not being critical of this guy?
    I don’t understand your point. Plenty of black people and white people condemned his quote. Just the existence of the meme you published shows the backlash.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •