Ask the experts

[Toddball]

This is why I wish more frames came in raw finishes.

Anyone have experience with steel single-pivot full squish bikes a la Starling, etc? Any good, or are you just paying boutique prices for a heavy bike with less than great suspension?

I'm coming from a 2016 Canfield Riot that I like a lot, except it's a bit small for steep and chunky trails. Currently riding in western Washington, good chance of moving to Roxtar's area soon though.

[Boissal]

I'm about 175lbs kitted up on the bike. I run compression all the way open all the time. How do I check for tight bushings?

Air down the fork entirely, leave the pump connected (to depress the valve), compress it manually, see if the lowers slide back down under their own weight. If not, move them up and down along the stanchions and see if you feel any spot with more resistance.
I had a set of Mezzer Pro lowers with tight bushings and it was bad enough that I couldn't pull them off the stanchions without serious force. The fork felt like shit with noticeable resistance to get into its travel. I swapped another set of lowers just to confirm the bushing issue and the damn things would fall off the stanchions under their own weight when I let go of them.

Note: the above if for Manitou, with RS you could remove the airspring assembly entirely. The goal is not to have anything working against the lowers moving along the stanchions other than a potentially tight bushing.

[toast2266]

This is why I wish more frames came in raw finishes.

Anyone have experience with steel single-pivot full squish bikes a la Starling, etc? Any good, or are you just paying boutique prices for a heavy bike with less than great suspension?

I'm coming from a 2016 Canfield Riot that I like a lot, except it's a bit small for steep and chunky trails. Currently riding in western Washington, good chance of moving to Roxtar's area soon though.

Buddy bought a Starling Murmur this spring. He seems alright with it. It's heavy, but most of his comments are about getting used to the geometry. Sounds like the suspension works fine, although I'm not sure he's that picky. As with a lot of the single pivots, the leverage ratio is super linear, which can be a good thing or a bad thing depending on what you're looking for.

The frame wasn't super expensive - $2k without a shock.

[Dromond]

I'm about 175lbs kitted up on the bike. I run compression all the way open all the time. How do I check for tight bushings?

175 is pretty average, so with no tokens, no compression and low pressure you should absolutely be able to bottom it on a very hard hit. If not, something is messed up. Go back a page to post #10381 by me yesterday, I wrote a post on how to check. Good luck!

[Fred Pabst]

How long would you expect pivot bearings to go before a need to replace for a Norco Optic frame? Schematic drawing shows 12 total 12x24x6mm at $8.50 a pop from JensonUSA. I ride in the northeast where it is not insanely dusty like other regions. This will be the third season of use.

[Eluder]

How long would you expect pivot bearings to go before a need to replace for a Norco Optic frame? Schematic drawing shows 12 total 12x24x6mm at $8.50 a pop from JensonUSA. I ride in the northeast where it is not insanely dusty like other regions. This will be the third season of use.

So many variables... I would have years I needed to replace bearing more than once when I lived in the PNW... lots of hosing off the bike...

I would personally just check them and replace as needed. Sometimes bearings are just shitty from the start, while others are magical and last when they shouldn't.

[jackstraw]

Frame wrap? Just bond a few teeth, couple crowns, and buy new.

[Toddball]

Buddy bought a Starling Murmur this spring. He seems alright with it. It's heavy, but most of his comments are about getting used to the geometry. Sounds like the suspension works fine, although I'm not sure he's that picky. As with a lot of the single pivots, the leverage ratio is super linear, which can be a good thing or a bad thing depending on what you're looking for.

The frame wasn't super expensive - $2k without a shock.

Good to hear. I ride a coil shock on a frame with only 14% progressivity, so maybe the linear leverage ratio would be fine. I found a deal on a frame and shock for $2k CAD, but would be looking at purchasing pretty much everything for the build, so it would not be a super cheap experiment.

[Dromond]

How long would you expect pivot bearings to go before a need to replace for a Norco Optic frame? Schematic drawing shows 12 total 12x24x6mm at $8.50 a pop from JensonUSA. I ride in the northeast where it is not insanely dusty like other regions. This will be the third season of use.

Just take the shock off and cycle the linkage to see if the bearings are smooth, quiet and without play. If so, you are good to go. Bearing life has a lot to do with conditions, but also the frame/bearings specced. I had to replace bearings on a Santa Cruz after a season or two, while bearings in a Devinci frame were still fine after four seasons.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

You need to test for undersized bushings! I had symptoms like this on a brand new Fox 36 2 years ago. It was a grip 2 but the problem was irrelevant to the damper. I tried every combination of pressure and tokens but no matter what, even with very low pressure and no tokens I couldn’t get close to full travel and I weigh 180lb. The fork felt harsh and my front end traction was poor. It was driving me nuts!

It was difficult to figure out what was wrong. One test I did was to disconnect the air spring and damper so I could just slide the lowers up and down on the stanchions without any resistance. The bushings and seals should have only the slightest friction, allowing them to easily glide up and down, but instead it was tight and almost notchy with noticeable static friction.

Another test is to see if the fork sags slightly under the weight of the bike when you gently rest down the front wheel. It should, but the static friction of stiction from bushings that are too tight will prevent it. I also jumped on a friends bike with the same fork and could immediately tell it could compress under very small bumps in a way my could not.

The fix was to send it back to Fox for warranty. It can back the most supple, tuneable, best riding fork I have had! Chalk it up to terrible quality control at the factory.

A friend of mine was struggling with a similar fork problem recently, it was also on a 36 but could happen to any fork. He couldn’t figure it out, but the second I did the sag-under-own-weight test and tried compressing it manually I new it was a stiction/bushing problem. He sent it in to warranty and it came back performing super well.

Hmmmm ok. There may be something to this. 100% the fork does not budge or sag under it's own weight at all. When I pulled the lowers and changed the seals a couple days ago they didn't seem overly tight, but also didn't seem to slide on the stanchions that well and putting new seals/oil didn't change the way it felt at all. Not even a bit.

I did a ride this AM with a nice 5 mile downhill. Mix of chunk/big rocks and some flow. I pulled the token out and went up to 65psi from 50psi which gave me about 15-18% sag........again it's hard to get accurate sag because the lowers seem to move on the stanchions a bit "notchy" like you said.

I will say this dramatically improved the ride. Bars stayed nice and high, etc. Didn't realize how much front end dive I was riding with before. That said, I even tried a couple times to intentionally stuff the front end and I am not using the last 1.25" of travel now.

It's ridable at least, but still not where I want it at all. No sensitivity whatsoever. Maybe it's bushings. Maybe it's just a ghetto walmart fork. It will get me by for now I guess. I have NAEC in less than a month. Need to just put a fork on plastic and deal with the "wife" later.

[Dromond]

Hmmmm ok. There may be something to this. 100% the fork does not budge or sag under it's own weight at all. When I pulled the lowers and changed the seals a couple days ago they didn't seem overly tight, but also didn't seem to slide on the stanchions that well and putting new seals/oil didn't change the way it felt at all. Not even a bit.

I did a ride this AM with a nice 5 mile downhill. Mix of chunk/big rocks and some flow. I pulled the token out and went up to 65psi from 50psi which gave me about 15-18% sag........again it's hard to get accurate sag because the lowers seem to move on the stanchions a bit "notchy" like you said.

I will say this dramatically improved the ride. Bars stayed nice and high, etc. Didn't realize how much front end dive I was riding with before. That said, I even tried a couple times to intentionally stuff the front end and I am not using the last 1.25" of travel now.

It's ridable at least, but still not where I want it at all. No sensitivity whatsoever. Maybe it's bushings. Maybe it's just a ghetto walmart fork. It will get me by for now I guess. I have NAEC in less than a month. Need to just put a fork on plastic and deal with the "wife" later.

Is the fork within warranty? What model is it?

After I had this bushing problem I told my local suspension tech about it, and he says he has been seeing it more frequently from all the big manufacturers in the last few years. Brand new forks/shocks that don’t work correctly from the factory due to bad QC.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Is the fork within warranty? What model is it?

After I had this bushing problem I told my local suspension tech about it, and he says he has been seeing it more frequently from all the big manufacturers in the last few years. Brand new forks/shocks that don’t work correctly from the factory due to bad QC.

It's a 2022 Zeb Select 170mm. Purchased late 2021 so it should be under warranty. I bought it with a complete bike direct from GG. So according to SRAM website I need to take it/send it to them in Denver? Either way I will just need to get another fork and warranty this one if possible to not be without a fork.

EDIT: I guess I can go to any SRAM dealer since my POS is far away. Still I'm not just gonna not ride bikes for like 2 months so I'm gonna just run this until I can get another fork.

[Dromond]

It's a 2022 Zeb Select 170mm. Purchased late 2021 so it should be under warranty. I bought it with a complete bike direct from GG. So according to SRAM website I need to take it/send it to them in Denver? Either way I will just need to get another fork and warranty this one if possible to not be without a fork.

EDIT: I guess I can go to any SRAM dealer since my POS is far away. Still I'm not just gonna not ride bikes for like 2 months so I'm gonna just run this until I can get another fork.

I sent my Fox fork direct to Fox warranty and got it back it two weeks. You seem to really want to buy a new fork, but I'd stop wasting your time and just contact warranty and send the thing in as soon as you can.

[Andeh]

When my EXT Era v1 had tight bushings, if I dropped all the air out of the fork, the lowers would slide down until about 2/3 of travel then stop. I would then have to put all my weight on the fork, with no air in it, in order to get it to advance to bottom out. After I complained about it, they inspected it and found the left lower bushing was tight.

[El Chupacabra]

Just take the shock off and cycle the linkage to see if the bearings are smooth, quiet and without play. If so, you are good to go. Bearing life has a lot to do with conditions, but also the frame/bearings specced. I had to replace bearings on a Santa Cruz after a season or two, while bearings in a Devinci frame were still fine after four seasons.

X2 on this, and if the outside seal of the bearing is easily accessible, you can (after cleaning the area well) pop the seal with a pick and pack in new grease. Wipe out the old grease with a rag, but for frame bearings I'm not too concerned about mixing greases. Those bearings don't move very far or very fast. This can be a fairly quick and cheap way to extend bearing life.

[toast2266]

It's a 2022 Zeb Select 170mm. Purchased late 2021 so it should be under warranty. I bought it with a complete bike direct from GG. So according to SRAM website I need to take it/send it to them in Denver? Either way I will just need to get another fork and warranty this one if possible to not be without a fork.

EDIT: I guess I can go to any SRAM dealer since my POS is far away. Still I'm not just gonna not ride bikes for like 2 months so I'm gonna just run this until I can get another fork.

For whatever it's worth, I just warrantied some Sram cranks off my propain (direct to consumer bike). Cranks were creaking pretty bad but had no visually obvious problems. Took them to my local shop for warranty and had new cranks within a week. Total cost: a decent six pack for the shop.

The fork might be trickier since there isn't a clearly identifiable problem with it, but if the shop can diagnose something I think Sram's turnaround is quick.

[406]

Replaced my drivetrain about 300 miles ago with shram x01. On a typical ride, the first few miles after lubing chain (blue rocknroll) sounds fine, but at around mile 5 starts to sound like marbles in a tumbler. Pretty sure I have b-gap adjusted correctly. Shifting seems fine. What am I missing?

[toast2266]

Replaced my drivetrain about 300 miles ago with shram x01. On a typical ride, the first few miles after lubing chain (blue rocknroll) sounds fine, but at around mile 5 starts to sound like marbles in a tumbler. Pretty sure I have b-gap adjusted correctly. Shifting seems fine. What am I missing?

More lube? Use a different lube? Keep your cadence below 5000 RPM?

I dunno, but that's certainly not an inherent problem of sram stuff. With a half-ass application of whatever lube I have lying around, any sram chain I've had is good for 30 miles or so before it starts sounding a little chirpy.

[teledad]

12 speed SLX derailleur, XT shifter, SLX 12-speed chain, all with about 300 miles. Was JRA and the shifting went from perfect to crap, skipping gears, double shifting. However I set the cable tension it isn't happy - if I adjust it just enough to shift up I can't shift down, adjusted just enough to shift down I can't shift up. If I leave it in the middle it skips cogs in both directions (particularly in the middle of the cassette).

First thought was the clutch, but turning off the clutch didn't help, and neither did a clutch service. Checked the derailleur hanger alignment, it's fine. Adjusted the set stop screws and the B screw, no change. Tried another wheel with a brand new cassette, same issue. Replaced the chain, same issue.

The derailleur seems basically fine, no slop in the pivots and it moves back and forth OK when I unhook it from the cable. Shifter seems to be working fine.

What's next - replace the cable and housing? New derailleur? New shifter?

[MegaStoke]

On the subject of chain lube, is anyone else here as enamored with SCC Tech/ Wolf Tooth lube as I am? I’m continually amazed how long that stuff lasts in rough conditions, wet or dry.

[Roxtar]

12 speed SLX derailleur, XT shifter, SLX 12-speed chain, all with about 300 miles. Was JRA and the shifting went from perfect to crap, skipping gears, double shifting. However I set the cable tension it isn't happy - if I adjust it just enough to shift up I can't shift down, adjusted just enough to shift down I can't shift up. If I leave it in the middle it skips cogs in both directions (particularly in the middle of the cassette).

First thought was the clutch, but turning off the clutch didn't help, and neither did a clutch service. Checked the derailleur hanger alignment, it's fine. Adjusted the set stop screws and the B screw, no change. Tried another wheel with a brand new cassette, same issue. Replaced the chain, same issue.

The derailleur seems basically fine, no slop in the pivots and it moves back and forth OK when I unhook it from the cable. Shifter seems to be working fine.

What's next - replace the cable and housing? New derailleur? New shifter?

Apparently, the only thing left is the cable/housing. It's also the cheapest/easiest to replace. Would also possibly explain the instantaneous-ness of the problem.
Although you don't see cables completely go to shit very much any more.

[rideit]

This is probably way too obvious, but I recently had this issue when the thru-axle was loose out on the trail.
Took me a bit to isolate the problem.

[XXX-er]

after a service of the front & rear suspension my 2021 Zeb E specific fork was only moving 4 inches and seemed a little harsh on stutters so I dropped the pressure from 55 to 40 psi at 165lbs

a lot of air to drop for sure but the front shock is using more of the travel and is not as harsh, try less air

the rear shock is no longer losing air every night

[El Chupacabra]

This is probably way too obvious, but I recently had this issue when the thru-axle was loose out on the trail.
Took me a bit to isolate the problem.

Was thinking this, or perhaps the derailleur hanger lost a screw and moved out of place.

[jm2e]

Any Ridewrap whisperers lurking? Secrets to a good install?

Seems like top tubes always get tons of little scratches on any park bike. So a run of tape there is worth it. Chainstays and Seatstays are worth it in my book.
I spent all my downtime for like a week cutting up helicopter tape to cover as much of wife's new DH bike as possible before building up. The first thing I learned is that if you aren't using soapy water, you're doing it wrong. It's pretty mind blowing doing the soapy water thing.
The second thing I learned is that whatever area isn't protected will be a tractor beam for the fist scratch. Happened first day out. Along with a stanchion scratch on the brand new Fox 40. This is why we keep our bikes forever.