Ask the experts

[Dantheman]

Since we're talking drivetrains--has anyone used Garbaruk cassettes and can comment on how well they shift under load? I'm pretty over how shitty SRAM 11-42 shifts. In different times the obvious answer would be to upgrade to Shimano 12 sp, but given the availability issues, additional cost and need for a different hub driver, a partial solution that only involves a new cassette sounds nice. I'm not sure I want to be a guinea pig for E13's new cassette.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

FWIW my 11spd e13 shifted 10 times better than my GX Eagle.....this was using the first 51 tooth E13 cassette that apparently many people had issues with. It maybe wore out a little faster than you would like, but it was worth it for good shifting.

.....and yes, the answer is Shimano 12spd now.....always.....but can't get them I guess now? Glad I picked up a barely used XT groupo here in the fall.

Honestly cannot imagine EVER running Sram again now.

[XXX-er]

I like my Shimano but Sram might catch up if shimano fucks up again like when they atempted the 2nd coming of rapidrise, as a result in 2005 half the new bikes had SRAM and it was as good or > Shimano and i liked my X9

[XtrPickels]

Sorry all- I did this fun thing last week. It's called skiing. Pretty sweet. I think I'm going to do more of it while not riding my bike.

Looks like a quorum is interested in some training / physiology talk.
I'll try to put something together in the Mid February timeframe. If I'm super motivated I may even start a thread to dial in topics.

[Roxtar]

Sorry all- I did this fun thing last week. It's called skiing. .

This thing you speak of? Does it require a white frozen rain-like terrain covering?

[XtrPickels]

51
Shimano 12sp has really nice stepping (28-33-39-45-51) that makes the entire range actually usable, rather than a tight 11 gear range with big "bail-out" 12th gear.
If you have easier terrain, go to a bigger front.

Yeah. Weight savings of 45 vs 51 is negligible. Steps between gears are nice.
On the XC Bike the 51 allows you to run a larger front chainring and not be spun out at higher speeds.
On the enduro bike it allows you to not kick yourself in the teeth on steep climbs

[NuMexJoe]

Since we're talking drivetrains--has anyone used Garbaruk cassettes and can comment on how well they shift under load?

I can let you know in a couple weeks, as I just got an email this AM that my 10-48 11-spd just shipped. It'll replace a 10-42 GX.

[Dantheman]

I can let you know in a couple weeks, as I just got an email this AM that my 10-48 11-spd just shipped. It'll replace a 10-42 GX.

Sweet, keep me posted. Hopefully Pinkbike's long-term review of the E13 Helix isn't too far away, either.

[Roxtar]

Since we're talking drivetrains--has anyone used Garbaruk cassettes and can comment on how well they shift under load? I'm pretty over how shitty SRAM 11-42 shifts. In different times the obvious answer would be to upgrade to Shimano 12 sp, but given the availability issues, additional cost and need for a different hub driver, a partial solution that only involves a new cassette sounds nice. I'm not sure I want to be a guinea pig for E13's new cassette.

I was an early user of the Garbaruk 11sp cassette. The shifting was great and the workmanship is amazing. Mine did suffer from the early version creaking issues that I understand have been addressed. Other than the creaking I was very impressed. It was basically an improved version of XX1 at the time.

[SchralphMacchio]

This fall I started running a Garbaruk 10-46 (xD) cassette and I’m mostly positive about it. I put it on at the same time as a new SRAM RED chain and WolfTooth rotor oval chainring (and new shift cable and housing as well). My shifter and derailleur are X01 11 speed, and long ago I replaced the stock SRAM composite pulley wheels with Absolute Black machined aluminum pulley wheels that are quieter and stay cleaner / gunk free 1000x better than the stock pulleys.

The 10-42 part of it is *wonderful.* With the other new drivetrain bits it is whisper silent and ultra smooth. Shifts so so well, almost on par with my original DuraAce 8 speed road kit from long ago. Does fine shifting under mild loads but disclaimer on that - I’m really lightweight and years of roller use and delicate shift cadence timing means I also have developed some skills to generally keep drivetrain stress low during shifts.

The 42-46 shift is by no means bad, but it’s noticeable in that it has a different sound than moving anywhere between the main block. If you aren’t familiar, the main 10 speed cluster is machined out of a single piece of steel just like the XX1 cassette and the aluminum 46 is pinned in place (but the XX1 only goes to 42). Because the main block shifts so amazingly well and with nice sounds it’s just noticeable and less confidence inspiring when you are moving on and off the pie plate as it has a higher frequency and louder ping to it. But it’s not bad, distracting or annoying and feels fine, I’ve never had it hang up or hesitate yet.

Overall the jumps range and feel of this cassette are so much better than the older X1 (this predates GX) cassette I had been using.

The main downside was that I waited 6 weeks for Garbaruk to even mail the cassette after I put my order in, with poor communication. Granted this is COVID times and even raw materials are probably hard to come by, but Garbaruk hadn’t really set those expectations on their website or in their communication with me. But hey it’s winter, a good time to order shit with long lead times.

I wouldn’t hesitate to spend the money all over again though, this is probably the best 11 speed cassette with large range you can get for an XD driver.

[Roxtar]

The main downside was that I waited 6 weeks for Garbaruk to even mail the cassette after I put my order in, with poor communication. Granted this is COVID times and even raw materials are probably hard to come by, but Garbaruk hadn’t really set those expectations on their website or in their communication with me. But hey it’s winter, a good time to order shit with long lead times.

There is this.
I used to be a Garbaruk dealer and this has been an issue from the beginning. Granted, they were based out of the Ukraine. Perhaps their move to Poland helps?

[Dantheman]

I'm aware that their lead times can be long. It's pretty unsurprising given their location. I have a perfectly functional cassette (XX1 that Phall hooked me up with for a song and still has lots of miles left on it) now so it's not a big concern. Still on the fence whether to go with the Garbaruk or roll the dice with E13. That 9t is tempting.

[SchralphMacchio]

Seems to me if you are running an XX1 cassette and like it, based on everything Ive read but not having tried it myself, going E13 will likely be a downgrade in shifting feel, if that matters to you.

[Dantheman]

Pinkbike had pretty favorable things to say about the shift quality on the new Helix cassette when it launched in October:

"I put the Helix R on Giant's new Trance X Advanced Pro, pairing it with a Shimano XTR derailleur and XT shifter, then went out and shifted like a ham-fisted gorilla up every single hill. In other words, just a normal ride. The results: While maybe just a hair away from matching a full Shimano setup, the chain moved over the cogs silently and without any bangs or worrying noises, much like a full Hyperglide+ setup. Impressive."
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/ethirt...view-2020.html

[SchralphMacchio]

Oh yeah forgot about that new product launch ...

[bagtagley]

I’d worry more about the long term. The previous versions creaked even with the fix installed, had a big cog made of butter, and didn’t like to be removed once installed. They kept putting out new and improved versions that had the same issues. Maybe they’ve addressed all the issues and have put out something solid and reliable, but given their track record I’d call that wishful thinking.

[Dantheman]

Long-term is definitely the concern with the E13, especially given that they've kludged together an installation system that skirts around the XD license. Pinkbike is supposed to have a long-term test in progress but there's no ETA on it.

[robnow]

Any case to be made on 45t vs 51t?

FWIW, I've got an 11-46 11sp on one of my bikes now and I prefer the shifting on the 11-42 on my other bike.

I'm running 12s 10-45 XTR on my enduro ride and ideally, I wanted the 11s 10-45 that was originally announced as the third option when new XTR came out but it never transpired. I'm totally good to run about 450% with a 30 tooth front and wanted the simplicity and lighter weight of the 11 speed.

One full season in and while I like having the increased derailleur clearance, I'm annoyed with how much more often I'm shifting the 10-45 vs 10-51 and sometimes having to double shift when a single may have been sufficient with bigger steps.

[RootSkier]

1UP rack question: If you have a 1UP, do you use/recommend the wheel locks? I have a long cable lock I have used on other bike racks. Just ordered a 1UP and wondering if I should add wheel locks to match the hitch lock and extension locks while I still have a chance.

[XtrPickels]

This thing you speak of? Does it require a white frozen rain-like terrain covering?

Based on my recent experience, it's best with full terrain covering, but partial covering will suffice.

[jm2e]

1UP rack question: If you have a 1UP, do you use/recommend the wheel locks? I have a long cable lock I have used on other bike racks. Just ordered a 1UP and wondering if I should add wheel locks to match the hitch lock and extension locks while I still have a chance.

Yes.
I’ve been using the wheel locks for years. Super nice to have the matching key. They would be a lot harder to defeat than any cable. AND, most thieves will be caught off guard by their novelty and move on. They’re quick and easy and “clean” to put on (ie not reaching, crawling around mud to get on). So you’ll actually use them more.
That said, get a 6-7’ long hardened chain. Ditch the cable. I can’t preach this enough.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[nickwm21]

Two Questions.

- What's the preferred way to silence internal cable rattle on an AL frame? The rubber foam tube / AC hose insulation / Jagwire kit? Sprayfoam? Ziptie trick? How about just sticking 1" pipe insulation down my the downtube?

- Who makes the slimmest folding spare tube? I'm not interested in paying $30 for a fancy thermoplastic tube.... Just which brand butyl tube folds up the smallest?

[smmokan]

Just pay $30 for a Tubolito... it's reusable and I don't even know it's in my pack. I never want to carry a regular rubber tube again.

[El Chupacabra]

Do you feel lucky?

Road bike inner tube.

[climberevan]

Just pay $30 for a Tubolito... it's reusable and I don't even know it's in my pack. I never want to carry a regular rubber tube again.

Have others had luck with these? Reviews are not good. Sounds like a lot of splits and torn out valve stems, but if course people are more likely to review stuff that fails.

It sure would be nice, especially on the 29er.