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Thread: Cali Dive Boat tragedy
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09-12-2019, 03:52 PM #151
Device charging station officially mentioned as a possible source of the fire..
https://www.latimes.com/california/s...-out-ntsb-saysGo that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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09-12-2019, 04:07 PM #152Funky But Chic
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09-12-2019, 04:11 PM #153
I would hope someone is required to keep watch. Bobbing around in the ocean with 40 people asleep and nobody awake isn’t a good scenario. Leaks, fires, buildup of fumes, pirates, rogue wave. Shit can happen quick.
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09-12-2019, 04:19 PM #154Funky But Chic
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Yeah I don't think it is but easily could be wrong.
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09-12-2019, 04:26 PM #155Funky But Chic
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Captain's discretion in Norway:
Ship at anchor
51. If the master considers it necessary, a continuous navigational watch shall be maintained at anchor.
Why the Norwegian regulations are in English is curious. Also why I could find Norwegian regs but not US ones in a quick search is puzzling.
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09-12-2019, 04:36 PM #156
Cali Dive Boat tragedy
Gotta dive into the CFRs to find it.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/33/164.19But Ellen kicks ass - if she had a beard it would be much more haggard. -Jer
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09-12-2019, 06:05 PM #157
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09-12-2019, 06:08 PM #158
No clue on legalities but here's a quote from the NYT article:
"A U.S. Coast Guard spokesman has previously said that a safety certificate for the 75-foot Conception required that at least one crew member serve as a "night watchman" on the ship while passengers slept."
Sad stuff
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09-12-2019, 06:19 PM #159
COLREG Rule 30 (Anchored vessels and vessels aground)
(a) A vessel at anchor shall exhibit where it can best be seen:
(i) in the fore part, an all-round white light or one ball;
(ii) at or near the stern and at a lower level that the light prescribed in subparagraph (i), an all-round white light.
(b) A vessel of less than 50 m in length may exhibit an all-round white light where it can best be seen instead of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule.
(c) A vessel at anchor may, and a vessel of 100 m and more in length shall, also use the available working or equivalent lights to illuminate her decks.
(d) A vessel aground shall exhibit the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) or (b) of this Rule and in addition, where they can best be seen:
(i) two all-round red lights in a vertical line;
(ii) three balls in a vertical line.
================================================== =====================================
Ship at anchor51 If the master considers it necessary, a continuous navigational watch shall be maintained at anchor. While at anchor, the officer in charge of the navigational watch shall: .1 determine and plot the ship's position on the appropriate chart as soon as practicable;
.2 when circumstances permit, check at sufficiently frequent intervals whether the ship is remaining securely at anchor by taking bearings of fixed navigation marks or readily identifiable shore objects;
.3 ensure that proper look-out is maintained;
.4 ensure that inspection rounds of the ship are made periodically;
.5 observe meteorological and tidal conditions and the state of the sea;
.6 notify the master and undertake all necessary measures if the ship drags anchor;
.7 ensure that the state of readiness of the main engines and other machinery is in accordance with the master's instructions;
.8 if visibility deteriorates, notify the master;
STCW.6/Circ.1 ANNEX Page 142
.9 ensure that the ship exhibits the appropriate lights and shapes and that appropriate sound signals are made in accordance with all applicable regulations; and
.10 take measures to protect the environment from pollution by the ship and comply with applicable pollution regulations.
(e) A vessel of less than 7 m in length, when at anchor, not in or near a narrow channel, fairway or anchorage, or where other vessels normally navigate, shall not be required to exhibit the lights or shape prescribed in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this Rule.
(f) A vessel of less than 12 m in length, when aground, shall not be required to exhibit the lights or shapes prescribed in subparagraphs (d)(i) and (ii) of this Rule.
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09-12-2019, 07:15 PM #160
What's the realistic expectations with regard to smoke detectors on a vessel of that type? Shouldn't there have been enough of them with loud enough alarms to have woken everyone up within a few minutes of the fire starting? I'm kinda thinking it's unreasonable to require a night watchman everywhere people sleep. Shit happens other places besides boats but people still sleep when working as guides on multi day outings.
Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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09-12-2019, 07:38 PM #161
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09-12-2019, 07:45 PM #162
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09-12-2019, 07:55 PM #163Funky But Chic
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It's there so they'll do it, not so there's something to point at when they don't. It's not specific in the regs for a vessel of that size (as far as I can see) is why they'd put it on the certificate rather than just relying on the regs.
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09-12-2019, 08:07 PM #164
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09-12-2019, 08:31 PM #165
wooden hulled boat and no fire watch? no anchor watch?
that seems less than optimal.
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09-12-2019, 09:13 PM #166
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09-12-2019, 09:21 PM #167
what’s the worst that could happen?
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09-12-2019, 09:26 PM #168
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09-12-2019, 09:52 PM #169Banned
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The owner of the company said a crewmember was on watch, awake in the wheelhouse when the fire started.
Seems that that wasnt the case. If you are correct in saying that it's not common to have someone on watch, wouldnt the owner know that? Did he lie in the interview? Did he not know his crew didnt post a watch? Was it standard to disregard the watch requirement or was this just an unlucky time...?
Sucks all around but if the company/crew were skipping safety regulations, it sucks even more.
Vibes divers...
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09-13-2019, 12:29 AM #170
Not specifically talking about boats, which I know little about, but in general and IME some regulations are for theoretical problems but most are because of something bad that happened.
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09-13-2019, 06:37 AM #171
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09-13-2019, 06:52 AM #172
If maritime law is applicable in this case which is very likely, the victims families should procede carefully before paying any attorney huge sums to go down the cruel path of 1838 justice; It was written entirely to protect the wealthy owners of ships from crew, passengers, and owners of lost cargo.
Scientists now have decisive molecular evidence that humans and chimpanzees once had a common momma and that this lineage had previously split from monkeys.
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09-13-2019, 08:49 AM #173
Ah geez. Finally popping fun here. The latest knees is very sad indeed.
I knew some of the deceased. Two minors attended school where I work. One was likely to be the first in her family to graduate high school and go off to college. In the brief time where our paths crossed I met both of these lovely young ladies. Our community is still reeling from this. A friends of my son, at another school, lost her mother. I never knew her mom, but she is a super sweet and awesome 8 year old. All of this is terribly terribly sad.
I don’t know about down in SB, but a lot of folks here in SC are starting to lose faith in this operation. Maybe it is just a part of grief and mourning, but this latest news has set a lot of us back a few days. People are starting to wonder if this was avoidable and due to negligence. That is a hard pill to swallow, especially when it hits your youth community directly.
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09-13-2019, 09:14 AM #174
I'd like to believe that if a battery or anything in another room of my house caught fire in the middle of the night, the smoke alarms would wake us before every path of escape for everyone was engulfed in flames. I get that boats are smaller and tighter with fewer escape options, but damn.. I'm hesitant to put this on some kid or young adult making $20/hr or whatever that may or may not have been sleeping when they were supposed to be on anchor watch. I'd also be hesitant to blame the employer/owners unless it comes to light that the smoke alarms were not in proper working order. Other than that, it's just bad, really bad shit happened and people died, but no one person should shoulder the blame for this.
Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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09-13-2019, 09:25 AM #175
i'll bet the lawyers will be disagreeing with you on this point.....
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