Bottled Water? Worse than Hitler?

[DougW]

Why not have a high deposit on the containers, $0.10 - $ 0.15 each?? maybe more?

[frorider]

and 148,000 litres of water to manufacture an automobile.

Yes but it’s so refreshing to drink that Camry

[MultiVerse]

Yes but it’s so refreshing to drink that Camry

In a blind taste test more people prefer Accord than Camry

[old goat]

There is a proposal to build a plant here in Golden and from the reaction of some people that would be like sleeping with Hitler. Yes plastic bottles are bad but I think the idea that we should take away consumer choice is pushing the line. Practically if water is not a choice then are people supposed to buy pop( soda). Also the opponents are pushing the idea that these bottling plants are using up vast amounts of water whereas in reality they are more like a drop in a swimming pool. Did my own calc and the largest bottling plant in BC yearly flow is equal to 98 seconds of the flow of the river that flows near the plant .

Fuck "consumer choice". The fish and marine mammals don't have consumer choice--they have to consume nanoparticles. Get your water from the tap, use a refillable container if you need to take it with you. If you need to save water for a natural disaster use refillable containers. Last I heard consumer choice wasn't in the Constitution, or the Bill of Rights, or the Declaration of Independence. I guess it is one of the Four Freedoms--freedom from want--although I'm pretty sure Roosevelt wasn't talking about bottled water.

In the meantime stop letting mining companies and chemical companies and god knows who else put poison in the water. Now that's a water issue worth getting upset about. That's another choice consumers are losing--the choice not to drink poison.

But Hitler was definitely worse. No argument there.

[iceman]

[fatnslow]

Why not have a high deposit on the containers, $0.10 - $ 0.15 each?? maybe more?

.10 deposit I. Oregon but that doesn't slow anyone down from buying bottled water. Only people that benefit are the homeless folks that collect cans/bottles, they are the lottery winners with the deposit going from .05 to .10. NOBODY gets to double their pay but the bottle collectors did here. Bottled water is definitely a first world problem with most of the world's population not having clean water to drink we bitch about tap water not tasting "good". Fuck bottles water drink tap water or use a filter and refill your own reusable container !

[DougW]

Fuck "consumer choice". The fish and marine mammals don't have consumer choice--they have to consume nanoparticles.

But Hitler was definitely worse. No argument there.

Of course you know that 90% of all plastics that end up in the ocean come for 10 rivers in asia and africa. So one could expropriate that really 95% of the problem comes from the 2nd and 3rd world. Ok so increased desposit won't work , do you even have deposits in US?, so a ban is only solution. Then why not include pop and all near waters? The trash I pick on mt road is either beer cans or pop glasses from mcds . Maybe force people to refill for pop also?

[SumJongGuy]

Of course you know that 90% of all plastics that end up in the ocean come for 10 rivers in asia and africa. So one could expropriate that really 95% of the problem comes from the 2nd and 3rd world. Ok so increased desposit won't work , do you even have deposits in US?, so a ban is only solution. Then why not include pop and all near waters? The trash I pick on mt road is either beer cans or pop glasses from mcds . Maybe force people to refill for pop also?

Whataboutism

[DougW]

Whataboutism

that is always a problem, ok , but saying that the plastic bottles in NA are causing the ocean plastic problem is just untrue. Saying no to a bottling plant and then still allowing consumers to import them is irrational as your now just allowing the import of the problem. Pop is stretching but is it not just a logical conclusion?

[SumJongGuy]

Pop is stretching but is it not just a logical conclusion?

Carbonated beverages present additional challenges for green options other than reusing glass with deposit. Perhaps a $5 deposit instead of a 5 cent deposit is the answer? I still think hemp bottles is the solution that works for everyone except those heavily invested in selling plastic bottles (and we know it ain't about selling water for fuck's sake).

[mtngirl79]

People refuse to grasp what we have accomplished even in the last 100 years or less.

Containers use to be too expensive to be disposable. They were refilled.

Disposable wasnt a thing.

There are so many things threatening the environment that are going to be really fucking hard to change.

Single use plastic containers are fucking easy to reduce. Tap water. Fountain drinks. Beer growlers. Aluminum cans. Glass bottles....

[mtngirl79]

Carbonated beverages present additional challenges for green options other than reusing glass with deposit. Perhaps a $5 deposit instead of a 5 cent deposit is the answer? I still think hemp bottles is the solution that works for everyone except those heavily invested in selling plastic bottles (and we know it ain't about selling water for fuck's sake).

If you have to have pop get it from a fountain. You can get one for your house these days but nearly every gas station and fast food restaurant has fountain soda.

If that wont work can are better. Get cans rather than plastic bottles.

[mtngirl79]

interesting - At Nestlé Waters Canada, our use of groundwater is even smaller than the industry average. This means that today, it takes us slightly less than 1.2 litres of water to deliver 1 litre of drinking water. By comparison, it takes 3 litres of water to produce one litre of soft drinks; 42 litres of water to produce one litre of beer; 183 litres of water to produce one 8-ounce (236 millilitres) glass of milk; and 148,000 litres of water to manufacture an automobile.

I dont give a fuck about how much water Nestle uses.

Plastic is the issue. Single use plastic.

[mtngirl79]

In Germany they do bottles & recycle the bottles. Transients scour the trash for recyclables to turn in for cashish. All in all much less trash & somehow people manage to still have access to water.

Plastic or glass? Plastic recycling isnt great. Aluminum is better.

Glass is recycled but it's pretty valueless. Better to reduce using disposables as much as possible.

[SumJongGuy]

If that wont work can are better. Get cans rather than plastic bottles.

They could also sell water in cans. Being able to drink half of it, reseal the bottle, drop it back in the cooler, then drink the other half later while out and about is the reason cans, or soda fountains aren't going to handle the utility demands a bottle does. Now beer in cans works because nobody pops a beer and only drinks half of it intending to save the other half for 6 hours later..

[SumJongGuy]

We recycled our aluminum cans in college. Every 2 weeks we'd bring a trunk full of crushed cans to the city recycle center and leave with enough cash for a 6 or 12 pack. WINNING!

[DougW]

I dont give a fuck about how much water Nestle uses.

Plastic is the issue. Single use plastic.

I can agree with that but around here the issue is pushed on use of ground water which is irrational as the whole bottling industry in BC uses about the same amount water as irrigating two sections of farmland in a dry area.

[mtngirl79]

People need to adapt. Canned water is obviously better than bottled but still there is no reason for single use containers of water!

A soda use to be a huge treat. Like once a month sorta thing. Now people drink it like its water.

People need to change their behavior.

[old goat]

Of course you know that 90% of all plastics that end up in the ocean come for 10 rivers in asia and africa. So one could expropriate that really 95% of the problem comes from the 2nd and 3rd world. Ok so increased desposit won't work , do you even have deposits in US?, so a ban is only solution. Then why not include pop and all near waters? The trash I pick on mt road is either beer cans or pop glasses from mcds . Maybe force people to refill for pop also?

"Pop" was the word I grew up using in Detroit but people out here look at me funny when I say it. Or maybe people just look at me funny.
http://popvssoda.com/
Of course Canada is not on the map; what else is new.

[DougW]

Ok the higher deposit amounts seems to be working in in AB

Alberta’s beverage container recycling industry is proud to celebrate a return rate of 86%, exceeding the goal of an 85% return rate set by the Government of Alberta. This equates to over 2 billion containers being returned to depots annually. This success is not only due to the hard work of industry stakeholders, but also to Albertans who are becoming more and more aware of the benefits of beverage container recycling and protecting our environment.

[dunfree]

Of course you know that 90% of all plastics that end up in the ocean come for 10 rivers in asia and africa. So one could expropriate that really 95% of the problem comes from the 2nd and 3rd world. Ok so increased desposit won't work , do you even have deposits in US?, so a ban is only solution. Then why not include pop and all near waters? The trash I pick on mt road is either beer cans or pop glasses from mcds . Maybe force people to refill for pop also?

so they originate from the people making all the cheap shit that yanks/canucks/euros buy?

wonder if you told people the average camry consumes ~ 1 litre of H2O per mile driven for manufacture cost if they'd care? That ~150k mile lifetime I think is an underestimate, but still an interesting figure.

[DougW]

so they originate from the people making all the cheap shit that yanks/canucks/euros buy?

yes , seen that figure a couple of times , first time in The Economist. Which is strange as the do have garbage pickers picking out recyclable things that have value. Maybe their number will go way up internally now they have stopped the import of recycled materials from west.

[mtngirl79]

Ok the higher deposit amounts seems to be working in in AB

Alberta’s beverage container recycling industry is proud to celebrate a return rate of 86%, exceeding the goal of an 85% return rate set by the Government of Alberta. This equates to over 2 billion containers being returned to depots annually. This success is not only due to the hard work of industry stakeholders, but also to Albertans who are becoming more and more aware of the benefits of beverage container recycling and protecting our environment.

And what are they recycled into and at what cost?

What percentage?

Plastic recycling sucks. They dont make them back into bottles. They make other shitty stuff that will end up in the landfill not recyclable.

Recycling isnt the answer.

Not using single use plastic shit is the answer.

Omg. You are an idiot.

[Thurgood Jenkins]

Omg. You are an idiot.

The pot calls the kettle black!

[DougW]

Omg. You are an idiot.

why thank you , coming from you its high praise

though the issues you raise are interesting though isn't that a different issue