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Thread: Gondola cable snaps
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08-12-2019, 05:40 PM #151
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08-12-2019, 06:55 PM #152Registered User
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That’s an awful lot of destruction to be perpetrated by a $100 tool.
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08-12-2019, 07:00 PM #153
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08-12-2019, 07:46 PM #154
RCMP is saying that it happened at 4 AM. On most nights at 4 AM, the weather data shows that things are very calm in Squamish Spit. However, this Saturday AM, even though the weather meter at PAM Rocks shows nothing, some localized wind hit Squamish Terminals and Squamish Spit. It came in 3 growing exponential pulses.
I find this hard to ignore. I checked back a few days, then months, and then years to the first time they had a potential deropement incident and a cabin fall as a result of wind. Here is that day:
I've pasted a few more here: https://imgur.com/a/ruQ2KjT
As per said theory in this post, https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...27#post5732127 , it just might be plausible that something weather related happened that was much more powerful up the gondola line, something that caused a chain reaction or that could not be compensated by a tensioning system and possibly exacerbated by the steep grade and tower distances.
Of course, only Sea To Sky gondola people have their own tower wind readings. Only they know how the cars were actually parked that night. But unless the RCMP says more, or they have some definitive proof, i.e. not just repeating the same 'no wind, suspected vandalism' over and over, it seems more logical to use Hanlon's razor.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
~Hanlon's Razor.
I get it. Things like this don't happen. I get it.
I also look at the car swing clearance in the diagram ... and it gives me the willies.
I'd love to see the wind data they have from the gondola line over the last few years. It might be surprising given the mountain topography there.
There really isn't much wind speed difference between the day time they lost a car and the time of this event.
It is just 40 - 50 km/h vs 30 - 40 km/h. In the mountains, based on local winds, it may have been all the same. On the ground, at Squamish Terminals and Squamish Spit, there is just a 10 km/h difference.
Squamish Spit isn't a windsurfing and kiteboarding destination for no reason. It is dam windy there.
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08-12-2019, 07:50 PM #155Registered User
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PG, just curious, but, why the boner over this? Perhaps we should just wait a day or two for more info to be released..
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08-12-2019, 08:37 PM #156
He’s feeling guilty..... trying to throw dudley do-right off his trail.
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08-12-2019, 09:34 PM #157Registered User
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08-12-2019, 09:49 PM #158Registered User
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https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...lism-1.5244290
cbc's latest "what we know"Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know
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08-12-2019, 09:56 PM #159
Gondola cable snaps
55mm is slightly over 2”, it wouldn’t take a huge amount of effort with a cordless tool and the right blade, metal cutting saws these days are fairly impressive
“I have a responsibility to not be intimidated and bullied by low life losers who abuse what little power is granted to them as ski patrollers.”
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08-12-2019, 10:13 PM #160Registered User
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yes a battery powered 4" angle grinder available from any hard ware store
Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know
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08-12-2019, 10:26 PM #161
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08-12-2019, 10:33 PM #162
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08-12-2019, 10:46 PM #163
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08-12-2019, 11:05 PM #164
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08-12-2019, 11:22 PM #165Registered User
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If a gondola fails in a 25mph wind because of said same wind, somebody has some ‘splanin to do b
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08-12-2019, 11:39 PM #166
If you have a lot of patience...
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08-12-2019, 11:48 PM #167
Well, you can see the two wind graphs and read the 2014 report (I posted a link). That shows the actual winds at both times and it shows the mechanism by which deropement is possible and also the mechanism that actually caused a grip to collide and get ripped off the wire, damaging the wire in the process. The lift has been running for 5 years under those conditions, cabins swinging wildly every windy night, because they don't park them in a shed them at night. I don't know how the cars are aligned with towers when parked for the night. Maybe there is a method. Maybe it is random.
However, if cars are parked adjacent to the "Haul Rope Catcher Device", see https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...27#post5732127, then I don't see why damage couldn't be an ongoing happening since there are so many wind events in Howe Sound and on that mountainside. The tested 16.4 degrees after which the haul rope was observed to move out of alignment on the sheaves, and which also almost made contact between the "Gondola Grip Torsion Tube" (assumed to be aluminum cased) is something that seems worth looking at.
There are incidents where haul ropes are not retained by catcher devices. See: https://www.technicalsafetybc.ca/cas...2009-june-2016
I AM GRASPING AT STRAWS - that's what armchair quarterbacks do!!! I just think that is more productive than the current myopic obsession with probable vandalism.
The operator, RCMP and media seem to have latched onto the malice motive ... and assuming that the investigators do the same thing, they might not find the real cause if it was something else. I fear that ANY rush to conclude the affair and shortcut or curtail a THOROUGH investigation is not in the interest of safety.
Incidents like these need to be approached without bias as to the cause.
So .. IF NOT vandalism, THEN what?
That is where my imagination likes to explore.
To BE CLEAR - I AM NOT AN ENGINEER,
MY RAMBLINGS DO NOT CONSTITUTE BLAME OR PROFESSIONAL OPINION.Last edited by puregravity; 08-13-2019 at 12:36 AM.
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08-12-2019, 11:59 PM #168
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08-13-2019, 12:44 AM #169
I've been part of a few cable splices over the years. Wire rope is easy to cut with a grinder. Standing on a tower and cutting it under load would be terrifying.
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08-13-2019, 12:55 AM #170
Gondola cable snaps
See his long persistent history of posts in the bitcoin thread and this will make more sense.
A cable cut by a grinder, or a torch or anything will be easily identifiable and very different from a cable failing under stress, according to a expert witness mechanical engineer I talked to today. He said they would be able to tell the difference at a glance, and determine the exact mechanism and blade type, heat source, etc with investigative tools.
Also, while it isn’t advisable, isn’t standing right at the fail point of a cable under tension, theoretically and relatively, a safe place to be? The cable is going to go in either direction for at least a little bit before it starts whipping sideways. I’m not saying it’s safe, but I’d take the immediate break point over 1 ft to the left or right. (I didn’t ask the engineer that question, that uneducated opinion is all mine)
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08-13-2019, 04:47 AM #171Registered User
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https://youtu.be/LRKN8DCYyrE
Crazy video of aircraft carrier wire breaking.
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08-13-2019, 05:19 AM #172
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08-13-2019, 05:54 AM #173Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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08-13-2019, 05:56 AM #174
For sure - and once it starts to really fail, you just duck and cover your head like a turtle and listen for the chaos to happen. We also can't assume whoever did such a thing is also smart enough to weigh the risks and take safety seriously.
I hope they figure out who did this, such crazy story.
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08-13-2019, 05:58 AM #175
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