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  1. #1
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    School me on lightweight bindings.

    Next season I'm getting a pair of reasonably lightweight skis, that I plan to set up with lightweight bindings. Skis will be around 1200/1300 grams (I Know, not super light) and I want to pair them with bindings that doesn't way a ton to do quicker touring missions when there isn't a ton of pow and also for more extended tours.


    Background: Me 85 kilo 186 centimeters, hits the gym regularly and skis reasonably fast.


    What lightweight bindings ski well? Of tech bindings, only had Dynafit radical ft's before the Tecton, Kingpin, and Shifts. The radicals skied horribly compared to the ones with an alpine heel. Do they all feel like that?


    Happy for the help!

  2. #2
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    I'm not sure anything with a tech heel will ski like a Tecton/etc, but my Radical STs were particularly loose. 1200/1300g/ski is pretty damn light in my book, that's what most of my skis are, and I use basically skimo race bindings on them, though you sacrifice adjustable RV and typically lose the second heel riser. There are a number of options for a light-ish binding (~300g, ~2x what a reasonably priced reliable race binding weighs) with some level of adjustability in the RV + second riser, if those things matter to you. FWIW the conditions in which ultralight tech bindings differ the least in feel from heavier bindings (or alpine bindings) is pow, where it doesn't really make a difference. The shittier the conditions, the more you feel the chatter.

    Personally I would not put a 500g+ binding like a Tecton/etc on a 1200g ski, just seems ridiculous. I'd also skip the Radical 2.0 / etc genre of tech bindings as they're all heavy as sin. If you end up deciding on a 500g+ binding, just get a heavier ski and live with the compromise, imo.

    For skimo race bindings, I'm a huge fan of the Plum 150. Fixed lateral/vertical RV supposedly around 8 (I've never released from them even in some very hairy terrain/conditions/bad skiing/etc), single riser + flat mode, pretty affordable. I've used a variety of ultralight bindings, and so far anyway this is the one for me. If money was no object I'd buy one of the rebranded ATKs (BD Helio 145 or something) but the Plums are always somehow like $100 or more cheaper. The only thing that sucks about them is the heelpiece is a bitch to rotate into flat mode when they're new. There's also the Plum 170 which includes an adjustment plate, or you can use iirc the Kreuzspitze plates, or mount without plates, depending on your preferences. Edit: I am 5'10" / 150lbs (178cm / 68kg)

    For bindings with the next level of feature set (and weight) there's the popular Salomon MTN, Kreuzspitze GT, G3 Zed (though I've heard they explode??), etc etc... depends on the weight/feature tradeoff you are looking for. There's also some new Fritschi thing for next year, but personally I will never buy a 1st year tech binding.

    What boots are you gonna use with these? And out of curiosity, what particular skis?

  3. #3
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  4. #4
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    Salomon mtn. Really bomber and easy to use

    Sent from my Armor_3 using Tapatalk

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    Salomon mtn. Really bomber and easy to use

    Sent from my Armor_3 using Tapatalk
    Is there a shin available to reduce ramp or is it a build your own?

  6. #6
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    Dynafit SSL 2.0 def worth a look. 1200g/ski is pretty light so Id want a <200g binder on it.

    Mtn lab delta is 8 mm IIRC, so might not have to shim

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by auvgeek View Post
    Mtn lab delta is 8 mm IIRC, so might not have to shim
    I measured mine at 8.5mm, but after years of various Dynafits (13-15) and Plum (18) they feel flat.

  8. #8
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    ^ the Plum Guides have all the ramp; the 150s are basically flat, the 170s (with plates) are only 4.5

  9. #9
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    A 1200 gram ski isn't super light? For downhill skiing not rando racing?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaliBrit View Post
    Is there a shin available to reduce ramp or is it a build your own?
    The ramp is not noticeable on the mtn, and I'm sensitive to this.

    Sent from my Armor_3 using Tapatalk

  11. #11
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    If you remove the brake from the MTN it is even flatter (and lighter) I believe.
    Also ATK makes great stuff. The haute route may fit your needs. Dunno if it is available in the USA. BD imports/rebrands some of their stuff.

  12. #12
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    As mall walker said, nothing will ski as well as an alpine-style heel like the Tecton or Kingpin or Shift.

    However, my G3 Ion LTs ski noticeably better than Dynafit Radical 1.0s/Speed Radicals or my Salomon MTNs. I've pretty much gone to the Ions for winter touring and MTNs for spring touring and pretty happy with both.

    My opinion may not matter though as I want nothing to do with the 1200-1300g class of skis. Every time I try a ski that light, I end up back on a heavier ski. But I'm more into skiing than slogging.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    All ye punterz! Leave thine stupid heavy skis in the past, or at least in the resort category, for the age of lightweight pussy sticks is upon us! Behold! Keep up with the randocommandos on their carbon blades of shortness! Break thine tibias into spiral splinters with pintech extravagance!

  13. #13
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    School me on lightweight bindings.

    At that ski weight, Id go BD Helio 145 or ATK Trofeo. Also consider the BD Helio 110 or ATK SL Evo. Several non-adjustable release values to choose from.

    FWIW, the Plum Race 150 forward (upward) release value was too low for me.

  14. #14
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    Jun 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by mall walker View Post
    I'm not sure anything with a tech heel will ski like a Tecton/etc, but my Radical STs were particularly loose. 1200/1300g/ski is pretty damn light in my book, that's what most of my skis are, and I use basically skimo race bindings on them, though you sacrifice adjustable RV and typically lose the second heel riser. There are a number of options for a light-ish binding (~300g, ~2x what a reasonably priced reliable race binding weighs) with some level of adjustability in the RV + second riser, if those things matter to you. FWIW the conditions in which ultralight tech bindings differ the least in feel from heavier bindings (or alpine bindings) is pow, where it doesn't really make a difference. The shittier the conditions, the more you feel the chatter.


    Personally I would not put a 500g+ binding like a Tecton/etc on a 1200g ski, just seems ridiculous. I'd also skip the Radical 2.0 / etc genre of tech bindings as they're all heavy as sin. If you end up deciding on a 500g+ binding, just get a heavier ski and live with the compromise, imo.


    For skimo race bindings, I'm a huge fan of the Plum 150. Fixed lateral/vertical RV supposedly around 8 (I've never released from them even in some very hairy terrain/conditions/bad skiing/etc), single riser + flat mode, pretty affordable. I've used a variety of ultralight bindings, and so far anyway this is the one for me. If money was no object I'd buy one of the rebranded ATKs (BD Helio 145 or something) but the Plums are always somehow like $100 or more cheaper. The only thing that sucks about them is the heelpiece is a bitch to rotate into flat mode when they're new. There's also the Plum 170 which includes an adjustment plate, or you can use iirc the Kreuzspitze plates, or mount without plates, depending on your preferences. Edit: I am 5'10" / 150lbs (178cm / 68kg)


    For bindings with the next level of feature set (and weight) there's the popular Salomon MTN, Kreuzspitze GT, G3 Zed (though I've heard they explode??), etc etc... depends on the weight/feature tradeoff you are looking for. There's also some new Fritschi thing for next year, but personally I will never buy a 1st year tech binding.


    What boots are you gonna use with these? And out of curiosity, what particular skis?

    Thank you for all the suggestions. I agree with you there is no point on mounting heavy touring bindings on light skis. Since I allready have two other heavier pairs I tour on, I'm going pretty light here. At the moment I use a pair of Dynafit Beasts boots for all my skiing, but I'm considering getting a pair of lighter rando boots as well. This will be the setup for missions where speed matters or when it's more ski mountaineering, than freeride so to speak. I'm mounting on a pair of DPS Cassiar 87 tour 1.




    Quote Originally Posted by Lindahl View Post
    At that ski weight, Id go BD Helio 145 or ATK Trofeo. Also consider the BD Helio 110 or ATK SL Evo. Several non-adjustable release values to choose from.


    FWIW, the Plum Race 150 forward (upward) release value was too low for me.

    Thanks for the suggestions, I'll look into these. If the plum 150 has din 8, that sounds like something I could easily pop out of too.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    As mall walker said, nothing will ski as well as an alpine-style heel like the Tecton or Kingpin or Shift.

    However, my G3 Ion LTs ski noticeably better than Dynafit Radical 1.0s/Speed Radicals or my Salomon MTNs. I've pretty much gone to the Ions for winter touring and MTNs for spring touring and pretty happy with both.

    My opinion may not matter though as I want nothing to do with the 1200-1300g class of skis. Every time I try a ski that light, I end up back on a heavier ski. But I'm more into skiing than slogging.
    I have the g3 ion in my katanas and the mtn on spring skis.
    I feel no difference between how the bindings ski.

    But the g3 ions are a lot less durable.

    The toes developeda play where the rivets are, and the heel moves left and right easily, even though they are set at 12.

    By comparison, they mtns are solid.

    So much that i replaced the ions on the katanas with the mtn

    And on top of it, g3 does not want to warranty for the toes.


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  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    83
    Quote Originally Posted by CaliBrit View Post
    Is there a shin available to reduce ramp or is it a build your own?
    The ramp delta is very low with the Salomon MTN. It's identical to that of the Look SPX 12 Dual.

    Measured from the "shelf" of the toe and heel lugs of a Dalbello AX120 w/GripWalk soles*:

    Salomon MTN = Δ12mm
    Look SPX 12 Dual = Δ12mm
    Tyrolia AAAttack2 14 AT = Δ14.5mm

    Old skis:

    Dynastar Contact 10 w/Dynastar/Look PX12 Contact (old system carver) = Δ13.5mm
    Dynastar Big Trouble w/Dynastar/Look PX12 Jib (nominally park-ish twin w/metal) = Δ13mm w/~4mm shim under the toe (~Δ17mm w/o shim).

    * I'm defining it this way because I'm not sure if tech insert locations on a sole are rigidly defined against that of the alpine sole lugs. Somebody who knows the two standards can chime-in to possibly enable a better, simplified statement.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    I have the g3 ion in my katanas and the mtn on spring skis.
    I feel no difference between how the bindings ski.
    I can. It's not huge, but I can feel a difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    But the g3 ions are a lot less durable.

    The toes developeda play where the rivets are, and the heel moves left and right easily, even though they are set at 12.
    Sample size of 1, but I've had zero issues with my ions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    All ye punterz! Leave thine stupid heavy skis in the past, or at least in the resort category, for the age of lightweight pussy sticks is upon us! Behold! Keep up with the randocommandos on their carbon blades of shortness! Break thine tibias into spiral splinters with pintech extravagance!

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
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    5,998
    Sample size of 1, but I've had zero issues with my ions.
    Sample size of me, many of my friends that tour a lot and a few guides I know. IONs just work and are very dependable. Just an opinion. I'm sure they are not the lightest nor have the most features and are probably not the best fit for someone that needs the latest greatest obscure, but they just work.

  19. #19
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    Oct 2009
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    Sample size of me, many friends who tour lots and few that are guides as well... IONs are pretty good, I've liked skiing them for the past 6 years or so, but they can have issues too. Less than some other tech bindings, but they can still fail. They work... until they don't.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by skisurfmirth View Post
    Sample size of me, many friends who tour lots and few that are guides as well... IONs are pretty good, I've liked skiing them for the past 6 years or so, but they can have issues too. Less than some other tech bindings, but they can still fail. They work... until they don't.
    I used the ion for two years, maybe 80 days, and they started to develop play in the toes, and the heel became too lose for mental comfort.

    Switched to the Salomon mtn, and o believe it's more bomber and reliable.

    And simpler!

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