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  1. #26
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    so I tried a putty knife and if you work against the little glob of glue in 1/2 to 1/4 inch quick strokes you can push up a ridge of glue pretty quick

    I might try the heat gun for shits and giggles later
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
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    Colorado Front Range
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    I need to rummage around for my putty knife. Messing around with this a bit more, I think the job will go faster wirh a heat gun.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  3. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
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    No longer somewhere in Idaho
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    941
    I tried this with a heat gun and scraper, got it all off and applied gold label per my usual practice.
    It all came back off in messy chunks, I think due to unseen residue.
    I ended up tossing the skins out of lack of interest. They were splits, which also wasn't much good.

    Sent from my SM-G960U using TGR Forums mobile app
    Gravity always wins...

  4. #29
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    i think the heat gun might "soak" it into the skin so to speak

    I'm gona thro them in the freezer and see what that does

    I got a skin to sacrifice the glue removal

    but I don't have any gold label

    its
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  5. #30
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    Dec 2014
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    Yeah, there does seem to be a bit of absorption into the backing. Of course, that could be a result of the application process.

    There's so much texture in the weave, that a have trouble believing the glue won't stick, but WTF do I know ...

    Good idea about the freezing. At least it will provide a data point. This is beginning to look like a vintage instrument restoration.

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 10-31-2019 at 09:59 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  6. #31
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    Freezing for an hr didn't work, I will let the skin get to room temp and try some heat tomorrow
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    185
    SOLVENTS?

  8. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    yeah you could probably scrape a bunch of the glue off and have the skins drycleaned

    I havent tried heat yet
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    8
    Nice discussion so far 😉
    From the manufacturer's point of view, please do not try to remove the hybrid glue!
    If it is not tacky it is either dirty or contaminated with wax residues (or destroyed by some other kind of chemicals/solvents) Dirt and wax can easily be removed using the cleaning spray or a wax remover.
    This should restore the tack in a few minutes. The glue should always be tacky enough to lift the skin off the ground with a finger tip. Check out www.hybridskins.com for details and tutorial videos. Enjoy early winter! Werner

  10. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
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    Colorado Front Range
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    Quote Originally Posted by werner.koch View Post
    Nice discussion so far 
    From the manufacturer's point of view, please do not try to remove the hybrid glue!
    If it is not tacky it is either dirty or contaminated with wax residues (or destroyed by some other kind of chemicals/solvents) Dirt and wax can easily be removed using the cleaning spray or a wax remover.
    This should restore the tack in a few minutes. The glue should always be tacky enough to lift the skin off the ground with a finger tip. Check out www.hybridskins.com for details and tutorial videos. Enjoy early winter! Werner
    Hi Werner,

    The skins have a great grip/glide characteristic.

    Is there any way they can be "converted" to your standard glue formula? I suspect that even if it can be done, the labor at the factory makes it a losing proposition, but I thought I'd ask.

    The current formulation seems as if it requires a cleaning every 8-10 days, and the failure mode (when you forget) makes for a less than ideal touring experience ;-) I'd rather not have to keep track of this. That's my main objection to the fan packs ... yet another item to have to remember to charge before going out for the day.

    Assuming they can't be converted, does is citrius degreaser safe for use?

    Thanks,
    Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    18,233
    so i tried a heat gun and putty knife which seems to work pretty well for getting the old glue off, its a single skin with no partner so I'm not really worried about wrecking anything, I remember now that I had used heat to get the glue off the other ( now missing ) skin so i could fix the rip in the skin with AQS & drywall patch tape, then I put some gold label on the patched area not realizing it was a glueless type skin

    I also tried some generic orange cleaner and some citrus base cleaner on this skin and it made a big difference on the glue surface, it now seemed to have some tack

    I DO have some iron on glue somewhere so I will have to try getting it to stick on the back of this skin with some heat BUT I have already done that when I was fixing the other skin, in fact i mixed both types of glue !!

    EDIT : I gotta run now but somewhere in TGR I have an old post with picts of repairing the other skin by removing the glue with heat/ repairing with AQS/ replacing the glue with gold label
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  12. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    8
    Hi Thom, if you get used to run the microfleece integrated in the stuff sac over the ski base before mounting skins, 1-2 times cleaning per season should be more than enough. If not, I reckon wax residues are the main problem. Use the contour cleaning spray, the small wipe that is now included in every pair of hybrid skins and available for cheap as an accessory or a wax remover like holmenkol wax ab. Haven't tried citrus decreased but it probably does not remove wax residues. Werner

  13. #38
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    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
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    Thanks Werner.

    What surprised me was that I tend to brush and then buff the wax (lightly, with a paper towel or the equivalent). It's possible that I didn't buff one time and got more wax on it than I thought.

    I'll pick up some wax remover.

    If the skins had lots of miles on them, I have to confess that I'd likely start "experimenting" with them, since I'm an incurable tinkerer ;-)

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  14. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
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    8
    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Thanks Werner.

    What surprised me was that I tend to brush and then buff the wax (lightly, with a paper towel or the equivalent). It's possible that I didn't buff one time and got more wax on it than I thought.

    I'll pick up some wax remover.

    If the skins had lots of miles on them, I have to confess that I'd likely start "experimenting" with them, since I'm an incurable tinkerer ;-)

    ... Thom
    Thanks, let me know how it works out! Would love to see our skins being the right ones for you, too. Though skins probably are the one piece of equipment where you never satisfy everyone... Werner

  15. #40
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    Dec 2014
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    Colorado Front Range
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    Quote Originally Posted by werner.koch View Post
    Thanks, let me know how it works out! Would love to see our skins being the right ones for you, too. Though skins probably are the one piece of equipment where you never satisfy everyone... Werner
    Yeah, we're a tough crowd. I'll clean them and play some more.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    209
    Hey Werner 5☆ fo stepping in to the arena! Maybe you should start a contour skins discussion Q&A thread. All magots would appreciate answers from tha source...

  17. #42
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    Dec 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by nordekette View Post
    Hey Werner 5☆ fo stepping in to the arena! Maybe you should start a contour skins discussion Q&A thread. All magots would appreciate answers from tha source...
    Makes sense, and yes, I forgot to thank Werner for jumping in.

    I don't want to come off as grumbly, but I'm not too thrilled about the extra maintenance step, but ripping them with skis on is really easy (maybe too easy?)

    If this were a big day instead of an early season jaunt, I would have really been pissed off with a skin that was flapping about in the breeze.

    Knowing what you're getting into with any product (especially a non-traditional "technology") sets the correct expectations, which is never a bad thing.

    I didn't receive any details or materials with the skins (picked up in last year's Down ski group buy) other than an insert saying that skin savers are no longer necessary. I don't know who dropped the ball in this one.

    Frankly, I have to say that my waxing protocol (buffing) is good, and I'll bet dollars to donuts that Warner's test crew forgets to wax most of the time.

    So, I'll fork over $$$ for wax remover and report back. Maybe it was a one time thing on my part (not buffing out my wax one day last year).

    I wish I knew this in advance, and that's my biggest beef.

    I'll report back later in the year.

    Ending this on a positive note - the skins' grip/glide characteristics are great, and I'd definitely consider the traditional glue version in the future.

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 11-03-2019 at 02:56 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  18. #43
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by nordekette View Post
    Hey Werner 5☆ fo stepping in to the arena! Maybe you should start a contour skins discussion Q&A thread. All magots would appreciate answers from tha source...
    Hi Nordekette, thanks. Q&A can be found on our website here http://www.kochalpin.at/en/brands/co...ked-questions/ but a thread here could be a good idea!

  19. #44
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    8
    ...yes please report back.
    True, it is a problem that a large part of information is lost when skins are sold through the ski industry, especially when purchased online...
    That's why we decided to include the cleaning wipes with all contour hybrid skins this season.
    Still I am convinced that wiping of dirty or wet ski bases any time you mount skins and cleaning the hybrid glue once or twice a season takes less time and effirt than fiddling with cheat sheets and regluing skins every other season.
    Enjoy a great early winter, Werner

  20. #45
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    Dec 2014
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    Colorado Front Range
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    Quote Originally Posted by werner.koch View Post
    ...yes please report back.
    True, it is a problem that a large part of information is lost when skins are sold through the ski industry, especially when purchased online...
    That's why we decided to include the cleaning wipes with all contour hybrid skins this season.
    Still I am convinced that wiping of dirty or wet ski bases any time you mount skins and cleaning the hybrid glue once or twice a season takes less time and effirt than fiddling with cheat sheets and regluing skins every other season.
    Enjoy a great early winter, Werner
    Hi Werner,

    Including the cleaning wipes (and more importantly emphasizing their use) is a good idea. Better late than never ;-)

    I picked up some citrus degreaser today (my supply ran out) and cleaned and rinsed them. They feel quite a bit more tacky now. I'm headed out for a short tour tomorrow and I'll report back (it's supposed to be quite a bit warmer than last week).

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 11-05-2019 at 09:06 AM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  21. #46
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    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
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    3,098
    Converting a cranky customer into a happy boy ...

    I got out yesterday in about 32F/0C conditions and the difference was like night and day. Some of the improved stick was no doubt due to the warmer temperature but I think most of it came from the cleaning, because the "glue" felt much more tacky immediately after cleaning them.

    Note - a visual inspection won't tell you that the skins are loaded with wax. They looked much the same after cleaning them, so don't use this as an indictator.

    After mentioning my experience to my buddy (with whom I was out both days), he commented that his "conventional" skins weren't sticking very well on that cold day.

    So (in summary), a little user education goes a long way. I'm going to set a reminder for myself and give them a cleaning on the first of each month during the season. This may be overkill, but it only takes 10 minutes.

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 11-06-2019 at 07:44 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  22. #47
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    5,555

    Removing Hybrid Glue On Contour Skins

    Iím sure cleaning them helped... but...

    All skins have issues sticking at super cold temps we frequently get in the interior states. New Contour Hybrid skins are less sticky than new G3 and BD plain and simple. In super cold temps, you canít be as careless with them. Naturally, in warmer temps, the Contour skins are easier to handle because the glue isnít overly sticky.

    My guess is that the Ďglueí on the Contour skins are tuned to the warmer EU climates than the climates of CO, MT, WY and interior BC. A lot of EU skin manufacturers are similar in this respect (less sticky glue), so nothing unusual here.

    Analogy: donít buy powder skis for a one ski quiver if you live in the east coast unless you want to deal with the drawbacks of them on hardpack.

  23. #48
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Converting a cranky customer into a happy boy ...

    I got out yesterday in about 32F/0C conditions and the difference was like night and day. .....
    ... Thom
    Nice to hear, yet nothing I did not expect 😉
    If you get used to wipe off the ski base before mounting skins, you won't need to clean the glue more than once or twice a season...
    And: on the 19/20 version we have a black backing which makes especially wax residues much better visible.

    Enjoy the season,
    Werner

    Werner

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