Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    3,360

    Touring boots that don't ski like crap

    Feel free to tell me to search, JONG, which I have to a certain extent, but I've been a bit out of the gear loop and am hoping someone can give me some quick notes.

    I ski on mountain on Lange plug boots, ZB flex. They're awesome, as you can imagine. My touring boots are 5-year old Scarpa Maestrale RS. When they came out, they were said to be revolutionary as boots that are light and walk well but ski well. Frankly, I find they kind of blow. They lack the cuff support of my alpine boots. When I fall backseat or want to drive my 189 Dynafit Hokkaidos through some tighter trees, the boots feel unresponsive and it just feels like there's nothing there to hold me up.

    I am looking for:
    - Smooth, progressive forward flex (don't have to be stiffest, just have to flex nicely and not like hitting a brick wall followed by sudden collapse)
    - Good aft and lateral support
    - Good for touring - light and good range of motion

    Five years after buying my Maestrale RS, are we at a point where touring boots have improved substantially to the point where they won't be a complete disappointment compared to my Langes?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Banff
    Posts
    20,273
    nothing will be as narrow / fitting close as your ZB's but at least the flexes are stiffer now.

    Most companies will have a boot that is close to that

    Technica cochise/guide
    Nordica strider
    Lange freetour (I think)
    etc.


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Den/Baltimore
    Posts
    5,129
    Quote Originally Posted by D(C) View Post
    I am looking for:
    - Smooth, progressive forward flex (don't have to be stiffest, just have to flex nicely and not like hitting a brick wall followed by sudden collapse)
    - Good aft and lateral support
    - Good for touring - light and good range of motion

    Five years after buying my Maestrale RS, are we at a point where touring boots have improved substantially to the point where they won't be a complete disappointment compared to my Langes?
    Here's the thing, people have very different definitions of "good for touring" and "complete disappointment."

    Even most standard alpine boots and alpine binders don't ski nearly as well as a ZB + P18. If you expect performance anywhere near that, you'll be disappointed. Conversely, is an 1800g boot too heavy for touring?

    If you can handle the weight, the most "alpine like" tech setup would probably be Lange XT Freetour LV Promodel and Tecton. (I'm sticking with Lange over Dalbello or Tecnica cuz you ski the ZB) But it's heavy without a ton of ROM -- think Dynafit Titan ROM that skis like 95% as good as an RS130. (or so I'm told)

    If you want something lighter, the Tecnica ZeroG Tour Pro or Atomic Hawx XTD 130 seem like the biggest contenders. I would personally pair them with either a frankenbinding of SSL 2.0 heel and speed radical toe (skimo.co sells heels/toes separately) or a Tecton if you don't mind the weight. (I won't recommend the new Maestrale RS or Masetrale XT given your hatred of the OG Maestrale RS.)
    Last edited by auvgeek; 03-13-2019 at 04:59 PM.
    "Alpine rock and steep, deep powder are what I seek, and I will always find solace there." - Bean Bowers

    photos

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
    Posts
    2,572
    Quote Originally Posted by auvgeek View Post
    Here's the thing, people have very different definitions of "good for touring" and "complete disappointment."

    Even most standard alpine boots and alpine binders don't ski a ZB + P18. If you expect performance anywhere near that, you'll be disappointed. Conversely, is an 1800g boot too heavy for touring?

    If you can handle the weight, the most "alpine like" tech setup would probably be Lange XT Freetour LV Promodel and Tecton. (I'm sticking with Lange over Dalbello or Tecnica cuz you ski the ZB) But it's heavy without a ton of ROM -- think Dynafit Titan ROM that skis like 95% as good as an RS130. (or so I'm told)
    If you want something lighter, a Tecnica ZeroG Tour Pro or Atomic Hawx XTD 130 seem decent. I would personally pair them with either a frankenbinding of SSL 2.0 heel and speed radical toe (skimo.co sells heels/toes separately) or a Tecton if you don't mind the weight.
    Lange free, but the 130 and 140 have the same shell, just different liners.

    Sent from my Armor_3 using Tapatalk

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    1,511
    Dalbello Lupo > Lange Freetour IMO because the Lange lacks in rearward support where the Lupo has great lateral and rear support.

    Also, you could look into Pulse Revelstoke's Kickstarter project on stiffening boots, particularly the 'hybrid' boots:
    https://www.pulserevelstoke.com/kickstarter-campaign
    Last edited by robnow; 03-13-2019 at 03:17 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Den/Baltimore
    Posts
    5,129
    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    Lange free, but the 130 and 140 have the same shell, just different liners.
    Source? You posted that in the other thread, too, but I've heard from a number of others, including my bootfitter I trust, that they have different plastic.
    "Alpine rock and steep, deep powder are what I seek, and I will always find solace there." - Bean Bowers

    photos

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    2,831

    Touring boots that don't ski like crap

    I just picked up a pair of Solly QST 130s. Appx 1750 grams, supposedly ski well. Kind of a lighter hybrid boot. Iíll report back when I get on snow.

    As an aside, I think all boots are getting softer. My Salomon Xmax 130 (matte black) ski softer than my Patron Pros. I am weighing the benefitsó itís a less jarring ride, seems like itís less work on my knees and less shin bang when skiing through variable terrain and/or getting a little air.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    voting in seattle
    Posts
    4,043
    Compared to a ZB they all ski like shit.

    Compared to a Maestrale RS, many offerings ski great.

    There are folks out there whoís alpine boot is a ZB and their Ďtouringí boot is a stock RS 130 with a cast conversion.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    328
    No experience in the Lange ZB, but lots of experience in the Lange Freetour XT 130 LV. Daily driver for 2.5 seasons, 150+ resort days. And if you love the tight heel pocket of the ZB, you may be disappointed with the XT 130 LV or XT Pro LV last in the back half of the boot. It’s pretty roomy. I needed shims and a Zipfit liner with tons of extra Omfit added to get the heel hold I wanted. Added spoilers for skinny calves and Expert booster too. I love it as a resort and crossover boot with those mods, but it doesn’t tour uphill very well compared to dedicated touring boots with dedicated touring liners. They also weigh 2200gms (size 26.5) with all those mods. Not light. But going downhill, it’s 80-90% of the performance of a rigid spine alpine boot for me. It has a nice progressive forward flex. Not quite as supportive as a dedicated alpine boot in rearward support.

    After struggling through some longer tours on Langes, I went out and bought the Hawx 130 XTD. The calf and heel volume of the shell are lower than the Lange Freetour XT 130 LV IMO. The stock liner does a pretty good job holding my heel. Probably will replace the stock liner with a MV Intuition ProTour when it craps out. Added green superfeet, Expert booster, and spoilers for skinny calves again. Comes in around 1600gms with those mods (size 26.5 also). Less friction in touring mode, greater ROM, better locking mechanism than the Freetour XTs (the langes will sometimes ice up in walk mode and get stuck there). So the Hawx 130 is definitely better on the up than the Lange.

    Is it as good on the down? No, but it’s close. It’s a little more harsh (transmits more feedback from rough snow) and the forward flex isn’t quite as progressive as the Lange Freetours. But a lot of that could be just the liner and the total weight of each setup. Zipfits ski so well. I bet if I put the stock liners in the Lange Freetours and the stock liners in Hawx XTD 130s, the difference in the downhill performance would be pretty small.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    974
    Another vote for hawx 130 xtd. I have had various iterations of "stiff touring boots" over the years and this is the first time I have no complaints with how they ski. Is it quite as good as an actual alpine boot? No. It's close enough for me though and I feel like I'm at the pickier end of the spectrum for those willing to accept *some* compromise is inherent.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Whistler, BC
    Posts
    1,325
    Lots of people suggesting Ďhybridí boots here, such as Lange freetour, Lupo, Strider, Cochise etc but sounds like the OP is maybe looking for a Ďproperí touring boot?

    If thatís the case, the consensus seems to be the Hoji, Zero G, XTD and the XLab all ski with some sort of progressiveness.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Angry Whelk View Post
    a more stupid motherfuck does not exist.
    Big Balls is worst asshat kind.
    kind that wear bukkake from above.
    with warm drown he gurgles final death, for one time not worried about his misplaced import known of african american social standing and prominent community members. for he is only drown, as is the way.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    18,012
    WAIT till next year for the Hoji free
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    438
    A lot is dependent on the weight that is acceptable for you.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Hell Track
    Posts
    8,583
    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    Compared to a ZB they all ski like shit.

    Compared to a Maestrale RS, many offerings ski great.

    There are folks out there who’s alpine boot is a ZB and their ‘touring’ boot is a stock RS 130 with a cast conversion.
    This. It's all about how much of a trade off on the up vs. down you want to make. If you want something that's even moderately close to your alpine boots on the way down, the trade off on the up is going to be significant.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    3,360
    Quote Originally Posted by rob stokes View Post
    sounds like the OP is maybe looking for a Ďproperí touring boot
    Ideally, I am. I know that finding a touring boot that skis like my Lange plugs is impossible. My question was more whether Ďproperí touring boots have gotten good enough thatís itís worth moving on from my Maestrale RS. It sounds like they have.

    So much time is spent skinning that doing so needs to be enjoyable, but I also donít want to have walked all that way only to wish I was on better boots on that hard-earned run.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    SLC
    Posts
    4,420
    Quote Originally Posted by D(C) View Post
    Ideally, I am. I know that finding a touring boot that skis like my Lange plugs is impossible. My question was more whether ‘proper’ touring boots have gotten good enough that’s it’s worth moving on from my Maestrale RS. It sounds like they have.

    So much time is spent skinning that doing so needs to be enjoyable, but I also don’t want to have walked all that way only to wish I was on better boots on that hard-earned run.
    fwiw, the thread here https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...odel-(updated) has your Maestrale RS at a 105 flex. I think you have plenty of room to improve, especially if you're fairly happy with the way your Maestrale's do on the uphill.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Tahoe City
    Posts
    627
    i tried on the hoji recently and it felt like progressive flex, not terribly stiff but progressive, the current model won't take a normal ski boot crampon so I will wait to until the new one comes out which will accept crampons and is rumored to have a slightly narrower last. after trying various walk mode boots i got some tech blocks for salomon ghosts and have had no complaints over the past ~ 4 seasons but am thinking it's time to give a proper touring boot another go.
    Like I told my last wife, I never drive faster than I can see, besides it's all in the reflexes.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    4,250
    Problem = 2 different boots; solution = reduce to one boot for both. At least you will avoid the jarring difference of comparing two entirely different tools.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,341
    Scarpa TX Comp

    bring it!!

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Simi Valley, CA
    Posts
    5,193
    If you have a high instep, don't need a full rocker sole, and don't need 130 flex, the Cochise 120 shell weighs about 1,400g (lighter plastic than the Cochise 130). Put an Intuition liner in there, and you're around 1,700g. Add the lugged sole pads from a ZeroG Guide Pro, and you can rock scramble. I also have the Zero G Tour Pro and only have two days in them so far, but in my opinion the Cochise 120 skis better even though the Tour Pro is supposed to be a 130 flex. Could just be the greater weight making it feel more powerful, hard to say. Zero experience with the Lange's.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    18,012
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Burton View Post
    i tried on the hoji recently and it felt like progressive flex, not terribly stiff but progressive, the current model won't take a normal ski boot crampon so I will wait to until the new one comes out which will accept crampons and is rumored to have a slightly narrower last. after trying various walk mode boots i got some tech blocks for salomon ghosts and have had no complaints over the past ~ 4 seasons but am thinking it's time to give a proper touring boot another go.
    the free is sposed to have a narrower last & be 20% stiffer
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    194
    Next year's Roxa sounds promising: https://blisterreview.com/gear-revie...oxa-r3-130-t-i

    Could this be a legit slightly lighter weight alternative to Lupos?

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    974
    Quote Originally Posted by mall walker View Post
    fwiw, the thread here https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...odel-(updated) has your Maestrale RS at a 105 flex. I think you have plenty of room to improve, especially if you're fairly happy with the way your Maestrale's do on the uphill.
    This. The original maestrale RS has been surpassed dramatically by boots that both tour and ski much better. Maestrale RS2, Tecnica ZGTP, Atomic Hawx XTD, all do both better and noticeably, especially the skiing part. Lupo also skis a ton better although I'm not sure it actually walks better.

    Fit in the old scarpa stuff was abysmal too. I had skookums way back that had all the anatomical shaping of a kleenex box.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    47
    Quote Originally Posted by DGamms View Post
    After struggling through some longer tours on Langes, I went out and bought the Hawx 130 XTD. The calf and heel volume of the shell are lower than the Lange Freetour XT 130 LV IMO. The stock liner does a pretty good job holding my heel. Probably will replace the stock liner with a MV Intuition ProTour when it craps out. Added green superfeet, Expert booster, and spoilers for skinny calves again. Comes in around 1600gms with those mods (size 26.5 also). Less friction in touring mode, greater ROM, better locking mechanism than the Freetour XTs (the langes will sometimes ice up in walk mode and get stuck there). So the Hawx 130 is definitely better on the up than the Lange.

    Is it as good on the down? No, but itís close. Itís a little more harsh (transmits more feedback from rough snow) and the forward flex isnít quite as progressive as the Lange Freetours. But a lot of that could be just the liner and the total weight of each setup. Zipfits ski so well. I bet if I put the stock liners in the Lange Freetours and the stock liners in Hawx XTD 130s, the difference in the downhill performance would be pretty small.
    Your description of the XTD 130s is spot-on.
    I would add XTD 120s to the list. Much better and more progressive flex without harshness combined with better heel hold. Skis better than the XTD 130s despite the cuff being a little bit softer (which is mitigated by the liners). On the uphill 120s are pretty decent with better ROM than the Freetours although worse than the XTD 130s

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    en route
    Posts
    576
    if you need to tour in a rs 130, maybe you just have shit balance? just throwing it out there

    that being said, the new zero g pro tours are pretty great

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •