Results 1,626 to 1,650 of 1849
Thread: MLB Thread 2019
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11-04-2019, 06:45 PM #1626
It's possible. He's the single greatest talent I've ever seen put on a Tribe jersey. Unfortunately paying guys $400M+ just isn't how the Indians, or any small market team really, do business.
What they do have is a lengthy track record of taking elite talent like a Lindor and turning it into future all-stars and Cy Young winners, so all won't be lost.
If he turns down the extension the Indians offer him this off-season, which I suspect he will, he will bring a kings' ransom in return. He will go and get paid after next year, and he should, and I'll root for him where ever he lands - he's 100% class and plays the game the right way. He's the second best player in baseball in my opinion and I'll look forward to seeing the Tribe retire his number one day.I still call it The Jake.
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11-05-2019, 10:10 AM #1627
Lindor likely a Yankee unfortunately...
On another note. lets argue
https://baseballhall.org/modern-base...ra-ballot-2020
Murphy. Mattingly. Garvey
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11-05-2019, 08:49 PM #1628Registered User
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11-05-2019, 08:54 PM #1629Funky But Chic
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Reportedly Strasburg wants to stay and may be amenable to some creative bookeeping, so maybe they can figure out a way to swing it.
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11-05-2019, 09:44 PM #1630"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 07:31 AM #1631
evans, murphy, whitaker
j'ai des grands instants de lucididididididididi
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11-06-2019, 07:49 AM #1632Funky But Chic
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11-06-2019, 08:49 AM #1633
but not a player like this?
Career: .294 BA, 272 HR, 1,308 RBI, 2,599 hits
10-time All-Star
4-time Gold Glove Winner
1974 N.L. MVP (.312 BA, 21 HR, 111 RBI)
5 times in top 6 of N.L. MVP voting
6 times with 200 or more hits something achieved by only 13 other players in baseball history at the time of his retirement. All of the other 13 are in the Hall of Fame with the exception of Pete Rose.
7 times with a .300 batting average or bettter
5 times with 100 or more RBI
Career post-season: .338 BA, 11 HR, 31 RBI, .910 OPS
MVP of 1978 and 1984 NLCS
Career in 10 All-Star Games: .393 BA, 2 HR, 7 RBI, 1.255 OPS (two-time MVP)
1,207 consecutive games played (1975-1983), longest streak in N.L. history
World Series Champion
whats holding him back?
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11-06-2019, 09:20 AM #1634
or
.290 BA 377 HR 1518 RBI 2461 hits 5x all star, MVP, 4x Silver Slugger
or
.284 BA 492 HR 1550 RBI 5x All star 3x silver slugger
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11-06-2019, 09:40 AM #1635
i can't really do a deep dive, but he just doesn't strike me as a hall of famer. .300, more hr's would have been nice. Not an end all be all, but 38 war would lower the bar quite a bit.
I am actually on the fence about Tommy John. Unlike the offensive stats seeming diminished in the rear view, his career looks stronger. Plus the surgery is named after him.j'ai des grands instants de lucididididididididi
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11-06-2019, 09:53 AM #1636"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 10:23 AM #1637Registered User
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MLB Thread 2019
That seems to be one of the cases in which WAR is just a stat not any better than any other. It’s the hall of fame, Not just the hall of stats. He’s a no brained HOF for anyone that watched baseball in the 70s/80s
Tommy should be in just based on the surgery named after him and being able to come back from what previously would have been career ending injury to dominate. He literally changed the game being able to do that regardless of his stats which should put him in the HOF
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11-06-2019, 10:51 AM #1638
WAR is diminished by a guy who consistently hit 3rd or 4th in that line up and was expected to get RBIs. Walks dont get RBIs, BUT walks help WAR.
For 10 years he was considered the best player in his league at his position
10 years
He led all NL first baseman in fielding percentage five times, and his career mark of .9959 ranks 10th all-time at the position.
I am biased as fuck as a late 40s Dodger fan, but I find it hard to believe anyone who watched baseball in the 70s & 80s wouldnt see him as a Hall of Famer. Much like Murphy
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11-06-2019, 11:00 AM #1639
Uh, I watched baseball in the 70s/80s, as did the sportswriters voting on Garvey in the 90s and 00s, and he never got above 50% in the voting. And didn't get in the first two times on the "old timer's" ballot. So the notion that "he's a nobrained HoF" is bunk. You think he belongs. I recall watching a player -- even back then -- who always seemed to have a reputation greater than his actual performance.
We use stats because that's what we have; you can say "he looked like a Hall of Famer" and I can say "no he didn't" and the discussion ends there. Baseball is and always has been a game driven by stats. Anyone that watched baseball in the 70s/80s -- or any other era for that matter -- should understand that. Sure, the advanced stats didn't exist then. But here's a few that were always around. 272 HRs for a first baseman is very low. Never even slugged .500 in a single season, and a slugging percentage below .450 for a first baseman is very low (he was only top 10 in the league twice, and both times just barely, which is not HoF material for a slugging first baseman). Under 500 BBs for his career, so while the batting average and hits totals are high-ish, his OBP is a very low .329. Grounded into an awful lot of DPs (38th all time).
So you can say "ignore the stat heads" and Woodsy can point to his perceived value at the time (10 all star games), but my eye test back during his playing days and the stats and the eye test of all the voters who have exhaustively considered his candidacy have all concluded (to this point) that he is, in fact, not a hall of famer."fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 11:03 AM #1640"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 11:43 AM #1641
I am sure that the approach at the plate has changed over the years, but how much WAR could it really have cost him? And wouldn't other offensive stars in the middle of the lineup have been hurt fairly similarly?
Meanwhile, which of these players in 1974 would you build a team around, because I think several people got robbed in MVP voting.
Garvey: 4.4 .312 .342 .469 .811
Bench: 7.9 280 .363 .507 .870
Schmidt: 9.7 .282 .395 .546 .941
Morgan: 8.6 .293 .427 .494 .921
Garvey was a good and durable 1b, but the HOF has already rejected candidates that were far better (Mattingly and McGriff both come to mind).j'ai des grands instants de lucididididididididi
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11-06-2019, 12:11 PM #1642
He is getting his second bite at the apple, like Donny baseball.
Appreciate the points all well made above, think it is just hard for me to look at the most acclaimed member of one of the longest lasting and most successful infields of all time, a group that went to the world series 3x and won it once (fuck the Yankees) and say he shouldnt be in the hall. Especially when broadcasters at the time reffered to him as "future hall of fame 1st baseman..."
I guess I look at the Dodgers of the 70s/early 80s as an essential part of that era of baseball. To have Lasorda as the only part of that in the hall seems wrong.
but as mentioned, biased as fuck and I dont get a vote
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11-06-2019, 12:20 PM #1643
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11-06-2019, 12:23 PM #1644
Heh, came across this: https://www.mlb.com/news/will-steve-...ame-c262805278 which discusses how he was always referred to as "future hall of famer Steve Garvey".
I get why a diehard Dodgers fan would feel he is hall worthy. I just don't think he was nearly as good as his reputation, and I think that the 5 year period before you're eligible worked perfectly here, it gave voters the time to better evaluate him with some distance from his playing days. He's had 17 bites at the apple, this is his 18th. And he still won't get in."fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 12:24 PM #1645
Last edited by irul&ublo; 11-06-2019 at 04:12 PM.
Quando paramucho mi amore de felice carathon.
Mundo paparazzi mi amore cicce verdi parasol.
Questo abrigado tantamucho que canite carousel.
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11-06-2019, 01:17 PM #1646
Sutton was a stud, but owes those infield 5 a lot of his success.
Again all valid points but shows a lot how we look at and consume baseball now. As a kid looking at box scores and baseball cards, Garvey was 200 hits, AVG .300 with 20 homers, and drive in 100+ runs, every year for what seemed like forever all while playing great D. He showed up in the post season and even after he left did well for the Padres. Also, I lived out of market most of my life following the Dodgers from NC, TN, and eventually UT. Garvey was always the face of the franchise and in the public eye.
Danno that article nails it and helps me feel like not just a homer, thanks.
Ok back to Munson and Tommy John discussions
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11-06-2019, 01:37 PM #1647Registered User
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11-06-2019, 01:50 PM #1648
what's really interesting is how the narrative helps some guys and not others. Dwight Evans compares favorably to Jim Rice, but the narrative was always "Jim Rice was feared" so he gets in while Evans is not. Simmons was a top notch catcher forever, a great player, but the fact that Bench was always better, and that his first year of eligibility came on a crowded ballot, and he got dropped in year 1. Bobby Grich and Lou Whitaker compare favorably to some of the other 2Bs that got in, but they lacked the narrative in their favor.
Which is part of why I do not think Garvey should get in. The narrative was always in his favor, he was on the ballot for 15 years, and he still couldn't get in. I believe that's because he just wasn't quite good enough, we all bought into the narrative for a long time, but when push came to shove and we had to look at the details, the narrative couldn't prop him up enough when the details of his candidacy weren't strong enough."fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 01:58 PM #1649"fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
"She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin
"everybody's got their hooks into you, fuck em....forge on motherfuckers, drag all those bitches across the goal line with you." - (not so) ill-advised strategy
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11-06-2019, 02:07 PM #1650Registered User
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Woodsy, I’m with you. He should be in.
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