For the love of Ullr stop skiing your low tech bindings at the resort!

[CascadeLuke]

No, no, no. I'm talking about shit skills- skidding-down-blues-in-a-gorilla-stance skills. This is a relatively recent phenomenon. There is a thread about it somewhere, I think, with input from folks who work in shops. It starts with a dude who wants to buy all the status he can, and has no interest in actually listening to advice from people in the know. I don't know if these folks like DPS and Black Crows because of the high price, because the brands are just outside the main stream, because of the solid, bright color schemes, or all of the above. It's the equivalent of me walking into a surf shop making off hand comments about my Tesla being faster than a my neighbor's Porsche and demanding their "best" surf board when I'd be better off on one of those big foam rental boards.

Just making fun and being a wanker. I see those cats skiing here in PNW all the time.
Honestly I’m a touring jong. It’s why Shifts suit me as I learn bc skills and gain experience.

[snoqpass]

OK if I use tech bindings at the resort if I skin up first?

That’s what trekkers are for, you don’t want to look like a gorilla on dynafits while skiing down

[3PinGrin]

Is this a warranty rant? Confused.....

Not that you would catch me on a/t stuff BC or inbounds, is it okay with the OP that I am on tele gear inbounds, do I need a permission slip? If it's a warranty thing I get it, thus the confusion. Maybe the OP could clarify if that's the issue.

[markcjr]

[/QUOTE]

But how else will everyone know how backcountry and tour oriented I am? That I spent a shit ton of money to ski inadequate gear inbounds.

Your new set of Kincos?

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[rod9301]

IMHO touring bindings are acceptable for inbounds use in powder, so long as you aren't jumping off big stuff regularly.

The newer burlier pin bindings are supposed to hold up better to inbounds use -- Kingpin, Beast 14/16 -- but I probably wouldn't make that my quiver-of-one and ski it on hardpack.

The newer burlier? Kingpins? You are surely joking. They fail regularly.

Imo, the burliest tech binding is the Salomon mtn. And the simplest. And the easiest to use.

Due to a medical issue, used my bc setup in the resort this year for 40 days, katanas with tech bindings, skied ice, steeps, and no problems. At least resort steeps.

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[2FUNKY]

Add in the back packs that look like they are staying for 4 days. What isn’t in there?

[MHSP1497]

No, no, no. I'm talking about shit skills- skidding-down-blues-in-a-gorilla-stance skills. This is a relatively recent phenomenon.

Ive noticed an increase in these kinds of skiers at Timberline as well. Always puzzles me to see them ski so tentatively on a freshly groomed, low angle blue run. Even the wife has noticed it and made comments about how odd it seems.

[mall walker]

Add in the back packs that look like they are staying for 4 days. What isn’t in there?

I tie my sleeping pad on my resort pack (with 8mm rope and locking biners natch), you might have to spend the night in a gondola if the lifts fail!

[hafjell]

Add in the back packs that look like they are staying for 4 days. What isn’t in there?

This is my favorite. And I skin inbounds so no hate just curiosity. Maybe they’re training?


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[SupreChicken]

No, no, no. I'm talking about shit skills- skidding-down-blues-in-a-gorilla-stance skills. This is a relatively recent phenomenon. There is a thread about it somewhere, I think, with input from folks who work in shops. It starts with a dude who wants to buy all the status he can, and has no interest in actually listening to advice from people in the know. I don't know if these folks like DPS and Black Crows because of the high price, because the brands are just outside the main stream, because of the solid, bright color schemes, or all of the above. It's the equivalent of me walking into a surf shop making off hand comments about my Tesla being faster than a my neighbor's Porsche and demanding their "best" surf board when I'd be better off on one of those big foam rental boards.

I feel you. Usually hit my local hill a few times with a touring kit a week or two before they are ready to spin the lifts. Skin to the top of one of my favorite runs and mob it with usually some pow and minimal base. Fun as hell. Nice way to start getting the ski legs back.

I usually feel like I’m the only person on the mountain those days that DOESN’T fit this description. No one can fucking ski. Lots of aggressively set skin tracks, smiles and beers at the top, shooting the shit about skis...

And then they start skiing and make me look like a FWT athlete.

They often decimate the narrow chutes and then crack a cold one to toast the season being back.

And I wear bright colors, ski bright skis and I have a masterful gorilla stance.

/Rant support

[SupreChicken]

Separate question.

Are these “skiers” going into the backcountry as a group? Is the sole objective to skin? What happens when they happen upon terrain that has to be skied to get back to the car?

[MHSP1497]

Separate question.

Are these “skiers” going into the backcountry as a group? Is the sole objective to skin? What happens when they happen upon terrain that has to be skied to get back to the car?

I often see them solo, not with a group or even any others. Snowplowing their way down the run, looking terrified. Or doing the jong turn-their-whole-body-across-the-fall-line beginner turn stuff. Makes me wonder how these people ski in the BC, or if they’re only in it for the “up” and being fit.

[auvgeek]

Separate question.

Are these “skiers” going into the backcountry as a group? Is the sole objective to skin? What happens when they happen upon terrain that has to be skied to get back to the car?

I don't know this exact situation so take this with a grain of salt but I can think of some people who are reasonably competent in the bc but don't ski inbounds particularly well. It's not pretty, but they seem to manage alright. IME, these types tend to know their limits and make conservative decisions. I have more patience with them in the bc than the opposite situation of someone who skis downhill super well and therefore thinks he/she is ready to "get rad" in the backcountry.

Edit: Not that I'm at all disputing the whole tech binder on DPS/Black Crows inbounds crowd. I was in a shop near DC (circa 2014 when I first moved to Baltimore and wanted to try on something locally) and the number of people who stop by, seemingly on a whim, wanting a crossover boot because they "might want to ski uphill one day" was astounding.

[iriponsnow]

Fully agree!!! Love it!

[galibier_numero_un]

I don't know this exact situation so take this with a grain of salt but I can think of some people who are reasonably competent in the bc but don't ski inbounds particularly well. It's not pretty, but they seem to manage alright. IME, these types tend to know their limits and make conservative decisions. I have more patience with them in the bc than the opposite situation of someone who skis downhill super well and therefore thinks he/she is ready to "get rad" in the backcountry.

Very much like the gym climber who breezes through 5.13s indoors. Go outdoors with them to realize they can't set up a solid belay on trad climb.

... Thom



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[Reformed]

This isn't just a skiing thing. I've been increasingly amused by the ever-increasing number of unfit/unskilled bro/brah dudes I see on high-dollar bikes. The "tribe" thing that Yeti pushes must really speak to these guys' souls. Yeti makes great bikes and the brand's history is pretty cool, but so many members of their "tribe" make me happy to be riding something else.
The recent Black Crowes and tech bindings phenomenon is similar. I've never understood why anyone would want a relatively expensive, fragile and soft snow-oriented set up as their "slay it all bro!" rig when a multi ski/boot/binding hill/touring quiver could be put together for less cash.
I try to give people the benefit of the doubt/remind myself that everyone has to start somewhere, but this is becoming increasingly difficult given the level of attention this group seems to to be seeking.
I'd like to see a resurgence of the stoked ripper on cobbled together gear. They're out there, but they're becoming increasingly rare.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

I don't know this exact situation so take this with a grain of salt but I can think of some people who are reasonably competent in the bc but don't ski inbounds particularly well. It's not pretty, but they seem to manage alright. IME, these types tend to know their limits and make conservative decisions. I have more patience with them in the bc than the opposite situation of someone who skis downhill super well and therefore thinks he/she is ready to "get rad" in the backcountry.

I enjoy touring with anyone who I like, who can get around on skis a little bit and has a good sense of their limits, including my 71 year old mother. But last winter I went out with two different friends of friends who were absolute beaters. Nice guys, and very fit, but in both cases 25 degree blower pow was too much to handle. One of them ended up literally pizza-ing down some perfect snow only slightly faster than he skinned up. Then he wanted to do another lap! I took him up a nice 15 degree slope where we had to pole our way down. He said something like "that's more my speed."

The other guy fell four times, losing a ski each time, on a 800 vert meadow skip. He was done. I was annoyed. The chance of these guys getting hurt and needing help getting out was pretty high. It didn't occur to me that someone who skied like these guys would want to go backcountry skiing. Is there a connection between these guys wanting to be "backcountry skiers" and the inbounds DPS/Black Crows tech binding crowd? I don't know.

For comparison, I tour a few times a winter with a running buddy who once said "I sometimes feel up to skiing blacks at Eldora." Not a great skier, but I know he has a healthy sense of self preservation. He communicates how he's feeling about terrain and snow. We have a great time.

[auvgeek]

Very much like the gym climber who breezes through 5.13s indoors. Go outdoors with them to realize they can't set up a solid belay on trad climb.

Ha, brings back memories. Random anecdote: when I was in high school, this girl from the climbing gym, who was older and had been climbing much longer, talked me into doing a multipitch 5.10 with her. I was a solid 5.9+ trad leader, she was a 5.13 gym leader with supposed trad/multipitch experience. Finding partners (let alone a girl!) to climb multipitch was super challenging since I didn't really know anyone else who climbed, so I readily agreed ... but only if she felt absolutely 100% comfortable leading the crux pitch, which was bolted, because it was after a long traverse pitch that would be crummy to reverse or rappel.

"Yeah absolutely, no problem, it's only .10c."
"You're positive? It's not like .10c in the gym. And it'll be tough to bail if we can't climb it."
"Dude, chill. I climb outside with my dad all the time, I know what .10c is."

She took a 5 foot whipper on the first bolt of the crux pitch and started crying. Wanted to be lowered to the belay and refused to try again. [But in hindsight, I'm sorta glad it happened because I'll never forget leading that pitch, so perfectly at my limit, and it helped me understand I was ready to lead stuff in the .10s.]

For comparison, I tour a few times a winter with a running buddy who once said "I sometimes feel up to skiing blacks at Eldora." Not a great skier, but I know he has a healthy sense of self preservation. He communicates how he's feeling about terrain and snow. We have a great time.

yeah, that's more in line with what I was thinking and have experienced. Your first stories are pretty next level -- haven't experienced skiing with someone like that in the bc, yet, personally.

[dunfree]

I've never understood why anyone would want a relatively expensive, fragile and soft snow-oriented set up as their "slay it all bro!" rig when a multi ski/boot/binding hill/touring quiver could be put together for less cash.

there are people who want to do other things in life than give a fuck about assembling a quiver of skis.

[galibier_numero_un]

So I'm staring at some Swiss-cheesed, new to me Billy Goats that I just plugged, and am wondering if they'll get Tectons instead of Pivots. Tectons will save two holes.

The big question - will they see sidecountry action, or do I head to the car at lunch to pull out the GPOs (mounted with Vipecs)?

More 1st world problems.

... Thom

[kid-kapow]

(headshake) Honestly - who gives a shit.

There will always be jerrys, real or imagined. These guys and galls spend tons of money in support of an industry we all like, potentially lowering unit prices, increasing resort revenues or shops ability to give brohbrah special prices. The equipment might not be perfect for everything they use it for (at least according to how we would use it ), but oh well - it is their knees. I too cannot for the life of me phantom why people use regular tech binders in resorts, but then again I have used Vipecs and Tectons a veritable shit ton with zero poor experiences - including Tectons on BGs Thom (go for it ) - so I guess I am no better.

Sure, giving advice like "man, I think ordering those Monster 8s with ATK superduperlightrandobindings and Lange freeride boots is not going to enhance your day in the beginner class" is positive and helpful. Inadvertedly claiming moral superiority or laughing at people for seeking a different experience, prioritizing equipment characteristics differently (for instance weight over elasticity - yes, a poor trade off in resorts unless you primarily ride soft snow, but less so uphill in the backcountry) or having a different skill level than you is uncalled for imo.

Taking your approach to (insert sport/activity), generalizing that approach/experience to be what everybody else must be after too, and then using the lack of coherence to your strategy to belittle how other people go after (insert sport), does not make your approach necessarily more valid than others. It just makes it different. Belittling other generally does not make the other person the idiot.

--------

Auvgeek - I enjoyed that story, thanks for sharing It is unusual that it is the girl that is the overly confident in that scenario, but I am glad that you turned a shitty situation into a memorable experience

[skifishbum]

The newer burlier? Kingpins? You are surely joking. They fail regularly.

Imo, the burliest tech binding is the Salomon mtn. And the simplest. And the easiest to use.

Due to a medical issue, used my bc setup in the resort this year for 40 days, katanas with tech bindings, skied ice, steeps, and no problems. At least resort steeps.

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how the fuck is all that plastic crap and a binding with 3 din springs aka settings more burly than a 14 spring din metal
atk freeraider?

theres no fuckin way you skied both and came to that conclusion without what was a fully loaded crack pipe or suckin spansered soli schlong
i ski tech binders in and out bounds fine have been for over a decade now
while ill never rip like norseman, mofro, zeebo illadvised stragegy yeti man bro
i highly doubt theres a lot of mags i encountered on bbi tour or who have shared the wasatch with me that will tell you my chicken legged 54 yo piss poor lifestyle choices ski bum ass cant hang anywhere you wanna ski on tech binders.

cool i didnt go skiing today and my shop panties are binding rant though op

[mall walker]

while ill never rip like norseman, mofro, zeebo illadvised stragegy yeti man bro
i highly doubt theres a lot of mags i encountered on bbi tour or who have shared the wasatch with me that will tell you my chicken legged 54 yo piss poor lifestyle choices ski bum ass cant hang anywhere you wanna ski on tech binders.

sig worthy

[TahoeJ]

Shit, does this mean I need to sell my Black Crows Anima Freebirds with Tectons? Or should I get a lesson? Granted, I only tour on them and never take them to the resort unless I'm doing some slackcountry.

Not disputing the generalization, however. Black Crows, despite looking flashy and being a trendy brand at the moment, do indeed make some very nice skis (the Noctas in particular I'm a huge fan of). I've noticed the people I've seen on them are either really good skiers or somewhat mediocre skiers with not a whole lot in-between. Although I still don't see that many around Tahoe.

[doebedoe]

....
i ski tech binders in and out bounds fine have been for over a decade now
while ill never rip like norseman, mofro, zeebo illadvised stragegy yeti man bro
i highly doubt theres a lot of mags i encountered on bbi tour or who have shared the wasatch with me that will tell you my chicken legged 54 yo piss poor lifestyle choices ski bum ass cant hang anywhere you wanna ski on tech binders.

cool i didnt go skiing today and my shop panties are binding rant though op

Fucking dying.

I'm spend the day mounting up some tech binders in hopes that I can find a ride to the resort tomorrow to test them out. My van might be fucked and in the shop with no way to the hill, but I've still got the latest Mag-approved carbon-laced skis with plastic tech binders that need some sendage.